Christians vs Atheists

[Lemming3k]

In school's I agree that there is absolute no reason why religion should be promoted, equally, there is absolutely no reason why atheism should be promoted. No philosophy, or religion should ever be promoted in a place where one should think on his own.

Thats exactly what most of us are getting at.

 

[Raithere]

You wish to take the term empiricism out of this context.

Because you're equivocating method with result.

Weather he can prove it or not, he is certain there cannot be God.
Therefore, he is certain God does not exist.

No. A weak atheist is certain that there is no evidence to support the notion of god's existence. This is not the same thing as being certain there cannot be a god. It really just comes down to taking a stance. An agnostic does not take a stance on the existence of god; the question for an agnostic is undecided. The weak atheist takes a stance despite epistemological uncertainty. I really don't know how to explain this to you any clearer.

He can either have the agnostic view or the empircist view.

Empiricism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive.

Who cares. We are not arguing about the definition of god.
We are able to have a discussion where the definition of God is not a problem.

Yet it is. For instance, from certain pantheistic definitions of God I might be considered a theist.

Well are you certain God does not exist or not?
Do you believe one can even ever be certain weather or not God exists?

I've already stated that from an epistemological viewpoint I'm agnostic. But I still don't believe in god. How do you reconcile that?

So I asked you if this was the correct interpretation.
cool skill: "So the reason agnostics would call themselves atheists is not because they do not wish to be irreligious?"

Ah, cool syllogism. My answer would be no.

Atheists do believe that God cannot exist.

No. Wrong. All atheists do not believe that god cannot exist.

Yes they do. All atheists believe the second because all atheists believe the first.

No. They are not equivalent.

~Raithere

 

[Katazia]

Raithere,

All atheists do not believe that god cannot exist.

That statement is very tortuous. I suspect you mean exactly what you say since you are usually faultless, but in this case I'm not entirely convinced. There are one too many negatives and that is scrambling my poor brain. It doesn’t feel correct but I’m not sure why based on your statement.

Kat

 

[Lemming3k]

All atheists do not believe that god cannot exist.

I hope your trying to say atheists believe god does not exist but not that he cannot exist.

 

[Raithere]

That statement is very tortuous. I suspect you mean exactly what you say since you are usually faultless, but in this case I'm not entirely convinced. There are one too many negatives and that is scrambling my poor brain. It doesn’t feel correct but I’m not sure why based on your statement.

It is indeed! Beg pardon and allow me to rephrase.

"Not all atheists believe that god cannot exist."

It’s still a bit unwieldy but better than before. Yes?

Lemming,

Yes, that was my point.

~Raithere

 

[Katazia]

OK I'll buy that - thanks.

Kat

 

[Lemming3k]

Ok i understand your point Raithere, though i'd say it is dependant upon a persons own stance if they decide to call it atheism or merely weak atheism since weak atheists dont deny the possibility of the existence of god but dont believe he does exist, perhaps it depends on what religion your compare it to aswel as some seem more fallible than others.

 

[Morion]

i have one simple answer to all of this.... :m: yes yes i know some disagree with it but then again some of those same people hate the fact that there is a place safe from christianity! Jesus was a hippie plain and simple and im sure he would agree with me when i say toke up and forget your stupid differences! i may not be christian but i do "know" that Jesus would agree with all of us just being happy together! so why do any of you see that as difficult? so one person believes in god but another doesnt and yet another isnt sure what he believes in.... SO FUCKING WHAT! WHO THE FUCK CARES?!?! my completly honest opinion is this say what you want where you want... and when people give you shit then tell them to piss off! like im going to do right now in advance b4 anyone here decides i have insulted them some how! PISS OFF!! there! see how easy it is? now you try! i just know you can do it!