Chemical evolution:

OK, you are asking to explain the evolutionary process of abiogenesis . Can you explain the process of "Elan Vital"?
You wrote: "There is no Elan Vital. That's old stuff!"

I did not write "Elan Vital exists! It explains the origin of life!"

See the difference?

You claim to have somehow proved that elan vital does not exist. In contrast, I have never claimed that it does exist.

I assume your belief that elan vital doesn't exist is based on something. Otherwise it's just a belief you have, a faith. If you have evidence that shows it doesn't exist, great. If, on the other hand, you don't, then maybe you shouldn't be so quick to rule it out.

Notice, again, that I have not at any point claimed to know that it exists, or to have any evidence of its existence. I don't even believe that it exists. But I haven't closed my mind to possibilities like you have.

See?
 
I have produced 2 examples of apparent abiogenesis. Diatoms which are more crystal chemistry than bio-chemistry and viruses which are "partly" living organisms.
IMO, these are evidentiary examples of being "not quite alive".

If there is something wrong with those examples, I sure want to hear them.
Are diatoms examples of life arising from non-life?

If so, why aren't biologists claiming that they have "solved" the problem of abiogenesis?
 
You wrote: "There is no Elan Vital. That's old stuff!"

I did not write "Elan Vital exists! It explains the origin of life!"
See the difference?
Yes.
You claim to have somehow proved that elan vital does not exist. In contrast, I have never claimed that it does exist.
OK, then why do you object to my statement that elan vital has been disproven.
I assume your belief that elan vital doesn't exist is based on something. Otherwise it's just a belief you have, a faith. If you have evidence that shows it doesn't exist, great. If, on the other hand, you don't, then maybe you shouldn't be so quick to rule it out.
I trust Anil Seth knew what he was talking about.
Notice, again, that I have not at any point claimed to know that it exists, or to have any evidence of its existence. I don't even believe that it exists. But I haven't closed my mind to possibilities like you have.
See?
Absolutely, and I respect your adherence to scientific methodology. You're the scientist.

I am a little more adventurous and make "probing statements" accompanied by what I believe to be evidence, inviting falsification.
I do not claim authority, just an attempt at logic based on "available" (albeit skimpy) evidence....:rolleyes:
 
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Are diatoms examples of life arising from non-life?

If so, why aren't biologists claiming that they have "solved" the problem of abiogenesis?
Because they're not required to. There is no valid scientific falsification of the concept of Abiogenesis.
 
Write4U:

I have no problems with most of your last reply. Only want to comment on this:
OK, then why do you object to my statement that elan vital has been disproven.
Because, as far as I'm aware, it hasn't been disproven.

It may well be that we have equivalent, or better, scientific explanations, but that doesn't change the fact.
 
Write4U:

I have no problems with most of your last reply. Only want to comment on this:

Because, as far as I'm aware, it hasn't been disproven.
It may well be that we have equivalent, or better, scientific explanations, but that doesn't change the fact.

I have seen several arguments against the concept, but let me do some research for any definitive debunking.
I'll be back......loving this ................
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paddoboy:

In your latest string of rants responses,
:D The first sentence in a 14 paragraph rant and much ado about nothing....pot, kettle black! Add to that the the rather childish provocation that you like to exhibit when stood up to...like the following from another thread...
The post quoted here was made by paddoboy in a different thread, because he's too scared to post in this one any more. Just saying.
So much for adult conversation with this silly childish provocateur.


In the meantime, let me say again to avoid any confusion, Abiogenesis is the only scientific theory/process/scientific assumption that we have for how life came to be.
Once there was no life: Then there was.

Again just to reiterate James, grow up...:rolleyes:please?
I say your claim about abiogenesis is an unjustified assumption you make. You say that, on the contrary, there is a scientific theory of abiogenesis that explains the natural origin of live.


And you are wrong in the red highlighted part, and simply being picky and pedantic. And yes, I'm saying in effect that Abiogenesis is the only "theory" or if you like process, or scientific assumption [take your pick James, I'm not that overly concerned with your problem] that we have for how life came to be.
 
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Evolution , etymology; Borrowed from Latin ēvolūtiō, ēvolūtiōnis (“the act of unrolling, unfolding or opening (of a book)”), from ēvolūtus, perfect passive participle of ēvolvō (“unroll, unfold”).

I like this analogy. It agrees with David Bohm's "Implicate Order" (potential), the Enfolded (mathematical) order which becomes expressed as Unfolded (patterned) orders in reality.

Elan Vital, etymology;
Élan vital (French pronunciation: [elɑ̃ vital]) is a term coined by French philosopher Henri Bergson in his 1907 book Creative Evolution, in which he addresses the question of self-organisation and spontaneous morphogenesis of things in an increasingly complex manner. Élan vital was translated in the English edition as "vital impetus", but is usually translated by his detractors as "vital force". It is a hypothetical explanation for evolution and development of organisms, which Bergson linked closely with consciousness – the intuitive perception of experience and the flow of inner time.[1]
The British secular humanist biologist Julian Huxley dryly remarked that Bergson’s élan vital is no better an explanation of life than is explaining the operation of a railway engine by its élan locomotif ("locomotive driving force")
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki

Orthogenesis,
Orthogenesis, also known as orthogenetic evolution, progressive evolution,
evolutionary progress, or progressionism, is the biological hypothesis that organisms have an innate tendency to evolve in a definite direction towards some goal (teleology) due to some internal mechanism or "driving force".[2][3][4] According to the theory, the largest-scale trends in evolution have an absolute goal such as increasing biological complexity. Prominent historical figures who have championed some form of evolutionary progress include Jean-Baptiste Lamarck, Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, and Henri Bergson.
The term orthogenesis was introduced by Wilhelm Haacke in 1893 and popularized by Theodor Eimer five years later. Proponents of orthogenesis had rejected the theory of natural selection as the organizing mechanism in evolution for a rectilinear model of directed evolution.[5] With the emergence of the modern synthesis, in which genetics was integrated with evolution, orthogenesis and other alternatives to Darwinism were largely abandoned by biologists, but the notion that evolution represents progress is still widely shared.
The evolutionary biologist Ernst Mayr made the term effectively taboo in the journal Nature in 1948, by stating that it implied "some supernatural force".[6][7]
The American paleontologist George Gaylord Simpson (1953) attacked orthogenesis, linking it with vitalism by describing it as "the mysterious inner force".[8] Modern supporters include E. O. Wilson and Simon Conway Morris, though many museum displays and textbook illustrations continue to give the impression that evolution is directed.
Lamarck's two-factor theory involves 1) a complexifying force that drives animal body plans towards higher levels (orthogenesis) creating a ladder of phyla, and 2) an adaptive force that causes animals with a given body plan to adapt to circumstances (use and disuse, inheritance of acquired characteristics), creating a diversity of species and genera. Popular views of Lamarckism only consider an aspect of the adaptive force.[1]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthogenesis

These terms basically are variations on the concept of "Evolutionary processes by Natural Selection".

Any supernatural aspect must be dismissed as not scientific. That leaves only one....:cool:
 
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https://www.sciencemeetsreligion.org/evolution/origin.php

extracts:

"So what are the facts here? To what extent does modern science understand the origin of life, and what difference does it make?

It is true that as of the present time, scientists do not yet fully understand abiogenesis (as the origin of life is often termed). In particular, the origin of the first self-reproducing biomolecules, on which evolutionary processes could operate to produce more complicated systems, remains unknown, and there are numerous unanswered questions on the development of life leading up to multicellular organisms (see below). What's more, unlike bony structures that leave fossil records, the early stages of biological evolution on the planet very likely have been completely erased, so that we may never know for sure the full details of what transpired. If anything, the very rapid appearance of life on Earth after it first formed suggests that the origin of life was quite likely. But we have no way to know for sure.

It should be kept in mind that research in abiogenesis is fundamentally no different, philosophically or methodologically, than research in any other field of science -- the fact that this event occurred approximately four billion years ago makes no difference whatsoever. Scientists routinely study phenomena at the atomic and subatomic level that are far smaller than what can be viewed by eye, or even via optical microscopes, and they also study phenomena in distant galaxies that are far beyond current technology to visit in person and, more to the point, occurred millions or even billions of years ago (since these objects are often millions or billions of light-years away). Numerous papers are published in the abiogenesis arena every year, presenting empirical evidence and assessing theories in light of this evidence, just the same as in many other fields. Yes, there are unanswered questions in abiogenesis, but there are also unanswered questions even in areas of science that one would think are extremely well established, such as gravitational physics [Grossman2012a], cosmology [Barnes2013; Susskind2005] and reproductive biology [Ridley1995] (see also Controversies). Thus claims by creationists and intelligent design writers that unknowns in the origin of life arena "prove" that scientists do not have all the answers are only met with puzzled stares by real research scientists. Of course scientists do not have all the answers -- exploring unknown, unanswered questions is what science is all about and what researchers explore in approximately two million peer-reviewed papers published each year [Ware2012]. For additional discussion, see What is science?."

"It must be kept in mind that the process of evolution after abiogenesis is very well attested in fossils, radiometric measurements, DNA, and numerous other lines of evidence, completely independent of how the first biological structures formed. In other words, those unknowns that remain in abiogenesis theory have no bearing on the central hypothesis of evolution, namely that all species are related in a family tree, having proliferated and adapted over many millions of years. Thus there is no substance to the creationist-intelligent design claim that unknowns in the origins area are a fatal flaw of evolutionary theory.
This line of reasoning by creationists and intelligent design writers, namely that the absence of a full explanation of abiogenesis invalidates the whole of evolutionary theory, is a classic instance of the "forest fallacy" -- picking a flaw or two in the bark of a single tree, and then trying to claim that the forest doesn't exist. Indeed, to the extent that creationist and intelligent design writers continue to emphasize the abiogenesis issue as the premier flaw of evolution, they risk being discredited, even in the public eye, as new and ever-more-remarkable developments are publicly announced."

"On the other hand, it may turn out that the origin of the very first self-replicating strands of RNA, to mention one unsolved aspect of this theory, is fantastically improbable, and present-day humans are descendants of this remarkably unlikely event, as suggested by Totani's research mentioned above. But even here, nothing suggests that this origin event was the result of anything beyond the operation of known laws of physics and biology".

"Suppose a major international society announced that it had received a communication from a super-intelligent Entity, and the authenticity of this communication could not be denied because it included, say, solutions to mathematical problems that are utterly beyond the present level of human knowledge and computer technology. Suppose also that this communication disclosed that this Entity had initiated or created life on Earth. The next day inquisitive humans would then ask questions such as "What time frame was required for this creation?," "What physical laws and processes were utilized by this Entity?," "Can we replicate these processes in a laboratory?," "Why was Earth appropriate for life?," "Was life similarly initiated or created elsewhere?," "Who created this Entity?," "Who created the universe?," "Why?"

In other words, even if we found indisputable evidence that some supreme Entity had created life, virtually all of the fundamental questions of existence and evolution that have intrigued scientists and theologians alike for centuries would remain unanswered. In this light, the creationist-intelligent design approach of merely asserting "God did it," and resisting deeper investigation, is tantamount to a "thinking stopper," reveling in ignorance instead of thirsting for knowledge. Surely there is a more productive approach to harmonize science and religion".
 
https://www.amazon.com/Abiogenesis-Natural-Processes-Origin-Life/dp/1537072900

Abiogenesis has become a maturing field of study as an alternative to the creationist or intelligent design theory of the origin of life on earth. Abiogenesis, Biopoiesis or OoL (Origins of Life), is the natural process of life arising from non-living matter, such as simple organic compounds. It is thought to have occurred on Earth between 3.8 and 4.1 billion years ago. Abiogenesis is studied through a combination of laboratory experiments and extrapolation from the characteristics of modern organisms, and aims to determine how pre-life chemical reactions gave rise to life on Earth
 
https://www.amazon.com/Abiogenesis-Natural-Processes-Origin-Life/dp/1537072900

Abiogenesis has become a maturing field of study as an alternative to the creationist or intelligent design theory of the origin of life on earth. Abiogenesis, Biopoiesis or OoL (Origins of Life), is the natural process of life arising from non-living matter, such as simple organic compounds. It is thought to have occurred on Earth between 3.8 and 4.1 billion years ago. Abiogenesis is studied through a combination of laboratory experiments and extrapolation from the characteristics of modern organisms, and aims to determine how pre-life chemical reactions gave rise to life on Earth
I don't even find it controversial. It is completely natural and anyone who supports the concept of Naturalism, should have no objections to any possible natural evolutionary process.

Naturalism (philosophy)
In philosophy, naturalism is the idea or belief that only natural laws and forces (as opposed to supernatural or spiritual ones) operate in the universe.[1] Adherents of naturalism assert that natural laws are the only rules that govern the structure and behavior of the natural world, and that the changing universe is at every stage a product of these laws.
"Naturalism is not so much a special system as a point of view or tendency common to a number of philosophical and religious systems; not so much a well-defined set of positive and negative doctrines as an attitude or spirit pervading and influencing many doctrines."
"As the name implies, this tendency consists essentially in looking upon nature as the one original and fundamental source of all that exists, and in attempting to explain everything in terms of nature. Either the limits of nature are also the limits of existing reality, or at least the first cause, if its existence is found necessary, has nothing to do with the working of natural agencies. All events, therefore, find their adequate explanation within nature itself. But, as the terms nature and natural are themselves used in more than one sense, the term naturalism is also far from having one fixed meaning." — Dubray 1911
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy)
 
Yes - sections of them. Already, a necessarily whole dna strand has become irreversibly lost re biological efficacy
Sections of them hundreds of thousands of base units long.
Often, entire chromosomes. DNA is durable stuff. Lots of researchers think that's why it took over from whatever came before.
Really? But you offer no Darwinian explanation as to how it could plausibly happen.
Via Darwinian evolution is such an explanation. It's very general, an overview, but then we are very ignorant of the details.
I never mentioned DNA, and earlier referred to RNA as the supposed early self-replicators.
You've been posting about DNA and its supposed fragility for a while now.
In most environments, DNA degrades relatively fast.
So?
Is that so. You seem to claim to understand it. So explain what the first life was, and how it could tightly organize and be robust against attack without a protective membrane.
Why do you think there was a "first life", why do you think it was tightly organized, why do you assume it was "attacked", why do you assume there was no protective membrane, and what makes you think any of that has anything to do with Darwinian theory?
In Darwinian theory there is no necessary "first" anything. In Darwinian theory there is no necessary "tight organization" in the early going. In Darwinian theory nothing needs to be "robust against attack" in the early going.

Or to repeat myself: the people who dismiss Darwinian evolutionary theory do not understand it.
 
Q-reeus said:
I never mentioned DNA, and earlier referred to RNA as the supposed early self-replicators.

Yes, and that agrees with a purely evolutionary process. RNA is a clear progenitor to DNA.

dna-versus-rna-608191_sketch_Final-54acdd8f8af04c73817e8811c32905fa.png

By Anne Marie Helmenstine, Ph.D. Updated February 02, 2020

DNA stands for deoxyribonucleic acid, while RNA is ribonucleic acid. Although DNA and RNA both carry genetic information, there are quite a few differences between them. This is a comparison of the differences between DNA versus RNA, including a quick summary and a detailed table of the differences.


Which Came First?
There is some evidence DNA may have occurred first, but most scientists believe RNA evolved before DNA.1 RNA has a simpler structure and is needed in order for DNA to function. Also, RNA is found in prokaryotes, which are believed to precede eukaryotes. RNA on its own can act as a catalyst for certain chemical reactions.
The real question is why DNA evolved if RNA existed. The most likely answer for this is that having a double-stranded molecule helps protect the genetic code from damage. If one strand is broken, the other strand can serve as a template for repair. Proteins surrounding DNA also confer additional protection against enzymatic attack.
Double-stranded RNA (dsRNA) sometimes occurs. It is similar to DNA, except thymine is replaced by uracil. This type of RNA is found in some viruses. When these viruses infect eukaryotic cells, the dsRNA can interfere with normal RNA function and stimulate an interferon response. Circular single-strand RNA (circRNA) has been found in both animals and plants.4
At present, the function of this type of RNA is unknown.

what-are-the-parts-of-nucleotide-606385-FINAL-5b76fa94c9e77c0025543061.png

By Anne Marie Helmenstine, Ph.D. Updated January 25, 2020

Nucleotides are the building blocks of the DNA and RNA used as genetic material. Nucleotides also are used for cell signaling and to transport energy throughout cells. You may be asked to name the three parts of a nucleotide and explain how they are connected or bonded to each other. Here's the answer for both DNA and RNA.

ribonucleic acid (RNA) are made up of nucleotides which consist of three parts:
1. Nitrogenous Base
Purines and pyrimidines are the two categories of nitrogenous bases. Adenine and guanine are purines. Cytosine, thymine, and uracil are pyrimidines. In DNA, the bases are adenine (A), thymine (T), guanine (G), and cytosine (C). In RNA, the bases are adenine, thymine, uracil, and cytosine,
2. Pentose Sugar
In DNA, the sugar is 2'-deoxyribose. In RNA, the sugar is ribose. Both ribose and deoxyribose are 5-carbon sugars. The carbons are numbered sequentially, to help keep track of where groups are attached. The only difference between them is that 2'-deoxyribose has one less oxygen atom attached to the second carbon.
3. Phosphate Group
A single phosphate group is PO43-. The phosphorus atom is the central atom. One atom of oxygen is connected to the 5-carbon in the sugar and to the phosphorus atom. When phosphate groups link together to form chains, as in ATP (adenosine triphosphate), the link looks like O-P-O-P-O-P-O, with two additional oxygen atoms attached to each phosphorus, one on either side of the atom.
Although DNA and RNA share some similarities, they are built from slightly different sugars, plus there is a base substitution between them. DNA uses thymine (T), while RNA uses uracil (U). Both thymine and uracil bind to adenine (A).
How Are the Parts of a Nucleotide Connected or Attached?
The base is attached to the primary or first carbon. The number 5 carbon of the sugar is bonded to the phosphate group. A free nucleotide may have one, two, or three phosphate groups attached as a chain to the 5-carbon of the sugar. When nucleotides connect to form DNA or RNA, the phosphate of one nucleotide attaches via a phosphodiester bond to the 3-carbon of the sugar of the next nucleotide, forming the sugar-phosphate backbone of the nucleic acid.
https://www.thoughtco.com/dna-versus-rna-608191

It is clear that RNA and DNA evolved by similar and most likely from shared chemical polymers.

An excellent example of the evolutionary process from simple progenitors to more complex and efficient patterns.

If anything, your mention of RNA shows you are beginning to follow the right evolutionary path.
Don't stray into the mist of the "unknown swamp".........:eek:
 
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https://www.sciencealert.com/there-...-new-idea-about-how-life-on-earth-got-started

There's Mounting Evidence That Life on Earth Started With More Than Just RNA:

Just RNA

DAVID NIELD
1 JANUARY 2021

How life originated on Earth continues to fascinate scientists, but it's not easy peering back billions of years into the past. Now, evidence is growing for a relatively new hypothesis of how life began: with a very precise mix of RNA and DNA.

RNA and DNA both determine the genetic make-up of all biological life, with DNA acting as a genetic blueprint and RNA as a blueprint reader or decoder. For a long time, it was thought that RNA developed on Earth first, with DNA evolving afterwards – but mounting evidence suggests they may have emerged at the same time and both been involved in kickstarting life on the planet.

The latest study to back up this idea explains how the simple compound diamidophosphate (DAP) – which may have predated life on Earth – can knit together DNA building blocks called deoxynucleosides into basic DNA strands.

"This finding is an important step toward the development of a detailed chemical model of how the first life forms originated on Earth," says chemist Ramanarayanan Krishnamurthy form Scripps Research in California.

The findings add credence to the idea that both DNA and RNA developed together from the same sort of chemical reactions at the beginning of life on our planet, and that the first self-replicating molecules could have been mixes of both these nucleic acids – not just RNA, as suggested in the more established 'RNA world' hypothesis.

more at link.................


the paper:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/anie.202015910

Prebiotic Phosphorylation and Concomitant Oligomerization of Deoxynucleosides to form DNA

Abstract
Recent demonstrations of RNA‐DNA chimeras enabling RNA and DNA replication, coupled with prebiotic co‐synthesis of deoxyribo‐ and ribo‐nucleotides, have resurrected the hypothesis of co‐emergence of RNA and DNA. As further support, we show that diamidophosphate (DAP) with 2‐aminoimidazole (amido)phosphorylates and oligomerizes deoxynucleosides to form DNA – under conditions similar to those of ribonucleosides. The pyrimidine 5’‐O‐amidophosphates are formed in good (≈ 60%) yields. Intriguingly, the presence of pyrimidine nucleos(t)ides increased the yields of purine‐deoxynucleotides (≈ 20%). Concomitantly, oligomerization (≈ 18‐31%) is observed with predominantly 3',5'‐phosphodiester DNA linkages, and some (<5%) pyrophosphates. Combined with previous observations of DAP mediated chemistries and the constructive role of RDNA chimeras, the results reported here help set the stage for systematic investigation of a systems chemistry approach of RNA‐DNA coevolution.
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::


 
The latest study to back up this idea explains how the simple compound diamidophosphate (DAP) – which may have predated life on Earth – can knit together DNA building blocks called deoxynucleosides into basic DNA strands.

"This finding is an important step toward the development of a detailed chemical model of how the first life forms originated on Earth," says chemist Ramanarayanan Krishnamurthy form Scripps Research in California.

The findings add credence to the idea that both DNA and RNA developed together from the same sort of chemical reactions at the beginning of life on our planet, and that the first self-replicating molecules could have been mixes of both these nucleic acids – not just RNA, as suggested in the more established 'RNA world' hypothesis.

more at link.................
I believe that falls under the heading of "Abiogenesis".......:rolleyes:
 
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Why do you think there was a "first life", why do you think it was tightly organized, why do you assume it was "attacked", why do you assume there was no protective membrane, and what makes you think any of that has anything to do with Darwinian theory?
In Darwinian theory there is no necessary "first" anything. In Darwinian theory there is no necessary "tight organization" in the early going. In Darwinian theory nothing needs to be "robust against attack" in the early going.

Or to repeat myself: the people who dismiss Darwinian evolutionary theory do not understand it.
And with that dismissive series of non-answers, ended with an arrogant assertion, I'm finished wasting time engaging you here.
 
But please, feel free to repeat your false claim for the umpteenth time, all the while knowing that you're telling a lie. All it does is to highlight your lack of integrity and maturity. The only other possible reason you'd want to do that would be if you're actually much stupider than you appear to be, so that you can't actually understand the simple ideas that have been taught to you here.
In the meantime, let me say again to avoid any confusion, Abiogenesis is the only scientific theory/process/scientific assumption that we have for how life came to be.
Since you addressed none of the substance of my latest posts, there's no need for me to comment further.

Moderator notice:

Your continuing refusal to address the specific matters that have been put to you means that you're now actually wasting everybody's time in this thread. The next time you post your false claim without supporting argument or evidence, you will be excluded from posting further in this thread.


You are trolling and (now) knowingly telling lies. This has gone far enough.
 
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https://www.sciencemeetsreligion.org/evolution/origin.php

extracts:

It is true that as of the present time, scientists do not yet fully understand abiogenesis (as the origin of life is often termed).
i.e. there is currently no scientific theory of abiogenesis.

In particular, the origin of the first self-reproducing biomolecules, on which evolutionary processes could operate to produce more complicated systems, remains unknown, and there are numerous unanswered questions on the development of life leading up to multicellular organisms (see below).
Speaks for itself.

Thus claims by creationists and intelligent design writers that unknowns in the origin of life arena "prove" that scientists do not have all the answers are only met with puzzled stares by real research scientists. Of course scientists do not have all the answers -- exploring unknown, unanswered questions is what science is all about and what researchers explore in approximately two million peer-reviewed papers published each year
This is correct, of course, but it is not the subject of our (paddoboy's and my) dispute. The rest of the quoted extract is similarly irrelevant.

https://www.amazon.com/Abiogenesis-Natural-Processes-Origin-Life/dp/1537072900

Abiogenesis has become a maturing field of study as an alternative to the creationist or intelligent design theory of the origin of life on earth. Abiogenesis, Biopoiesis or OoL (Origins of Life), is the natural process of life arising from non-living matter, such as simple organic compounds. It is thought to have occurred on Earth between 3.8 and 4.1 billion years ago. Abiogenesis is studied through a combination of laboratory experiments and extrapolation from the characteristics of modern organisms, and aims to determine how pre-life chemical reactions gave rise to life on Earth
It ought to be clear to any reader that any field that "aims to determine" something doesn't have the answer yet.
 
:D The first sentence in a 14 paragraph rant and much ado about nothing....pot, kettle black! Add to that the the rather childish provocation that you like to exhibit when stood up to...like the following from another thread...

So much for adult conversation with this silly childish provocateur.


In the meantime, let me say again to avoid any confusion, Abiogenesis is the only scientific theory/process/scientific assumption that we have for how life came to be.
Once there was no life: Then there was.

Again just to reiterate James, grow up...:rolleyes:please?


And you are wrong in the red highlighted part, and simply being picky and pedantic. And yes, I'm saying in effect that Abiogenesis is the only "theory" or if you like process, or scientific assumption [take your pick James, I'm not that overly concerned with your problem] that we have for how life came to be.
Since you addressed none of the substance of my latest posts, there's no need for me to comment further.

Moderator notice:

Your continuing refusal to address the specific matters that have been put to you means that you're now actually wasting everybody's time in this thread. The next time you post your false claim without supporting argument or evidence, you will be excluded from posting further in this thread.


You are trolling. This has gone far enough.
Is that all you have James?
You ignore all the links etc that speak of Abiogenesis as a fait accompli and still say it isn't the only scientific theory/scientific assumption/scientific process available?
That's OK, as usual your threats are expected when anyone stands up to the great almighty James...
Sorry, as per your sexism claims pushing your pretentious cause, my stance remains as is...on both.
If that means I'm out, that's OK with me.
 
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