Can you see God?

[Katazia]

SouthStar,

The myth makers of Christianity knew full well that their fiction would be criticized and questioned by stronger and more rational minds and they have added many passages throughout their texts in an attempt to undermine and ridicule those who think and who present rational argument.

Before I start, do you therefore believe everything happens by chance?

No, I strongly suspect that everything is deterministic, yet I see no evidence that any form of super-intelligence has created a pre-determined universe.

Colossions 2
6So then, just as you received Christ Jesus as Lord, continue to live in him, 7rooted and built up in him, strengthened in the faith as you were taught, and overflowing with thankfulness.

A call to faith should always indicate to you that there is no factual basis for religious claims and a reminder that you are being encouraged to believe a fantasy. Such passages attempt to appeal to your emotions and avoid logic and the intellect since those things can see and understand truth, and there is no truth in religious appeals.

8See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ.

This is a standard political construct that has been used throughout time and is still heavily in use today. It is called negative campaigning and is designed to discredit and undermine the opposition through deceit and lies. It is otherwise known as propaganda. It is thoroughly reprehensible and Christianity is full of it since it cannot stand on its own merits.

9For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, 10and you have been given fullness in Christ, who is the head over every power and authority.

A straightforward fiction.

I will show you a miracle that God has wraught.

Dream on kiddo.

The text deals with three things, the people trying to "help" me "overcome the indoctrination and brainwashing" through "philosopy and empty deceit, through the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ."

All credit to the mythmakers, who although liars were not stupid, and who knew full well that their fictions would be questioned by brighter minds.

It also shows that Christ, who was on earth in flesh, has the FULLNESS OF THE GODHEAD in Him BODILY, that is to say, in bodily form, so He is NOT at all diminished. I am sure from this you can answer your own questions about "how, when and where?".

Without factual evidence you only have fiction.

Souls DO exist because it goes on to say "and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power". That means we BELONG to Him like property to the owner.

Putting a claim in writing but without any evidence still leaves the claim as a fiction.

Although you simply REFUSE to understand 2 Timothy 3:16, which says:

It is not a matter of refusal it is a matter of reasoned argument. There is no value in believing unsupported fantastic claims of the supernaturalists.

6All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

And more propaganda that implies that the man not of God is not properly equipped. Rather lame stuff really.

there really is nothing I can do to help you, I leave it to God.

That’s OK I’m not in need of any help – I know how to think. You on the other hand have a long way to go.

Remember, in THREE verses God has answered all that you have said. Three consecutive verses. Not just a coincidence, even if you believe in "luck".

LOL – just clever myth-makers and politicians who knew their fiction was going to be questioned and took what steps they could to include as much propaganda and negative campaigning material that they could.

This is what the Timothy 2 has to say:
23Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25Those who oppose him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.

Excellent example of Christian propaganda, complete with typical Christian arrogance and condescension.

Look for real physical evidence that gods or souls exist – there is none. Use your mind to think things through, many find logical thought a difficult challenge, but avoid trying to make choices based on emotions since these have always been shown to be entirely unreliable. Question every biblical text to see if it has any factual substance or is just a baseless claim.

You do not have to believe anything I say just learn to think for yourself and examine the biblical texts objectively and clearly without the clouds of emotion.

You are trapped in a fairy-tale and the escape is not obvious or easy. Many never escape and even more simply don’t want to escape since they find the false promises comfortable and they are happy.

And lastly teach yourself the tricks of politicians and myth-makers since you have been well and truly caught in their web of deceit.

I do not entrust you to God who does not exist but instead I encourage you to use your brain – everyone has one but very few use them.

Take care
Kat

 

[Rappaccini]

You are very disturbed... ... I am sure a jinn is possessing you.

Oh, yeah, baby.

Here he is.

Three wishes - no substitutes, exchanges or refunds.

~Genie~

 

[§outh§tar]

I wish for more wishes

 

[§outh§tar]

That's the entire reason I'm here Kat, to see if the Bible really does stand up to the test of opposition. However, you are coming off the premise that the Bible is authored by "liars" and I came off saying the Bible is inspired by God.

Of course, I don't know how exactly this inspiration takes place. Whether they just copy down what God whispers to them audibly, or whether these are just their theological contemplations.

How were they polticians? What did they have to lose that they would collectively "lie" and be "myth-makers"? Why would a cowardly bunch be suddenly inspired to endure crucifixion, whippings, imprisonment and so on just to spread a lie?

 

[path]

You are very disturbed, you never ever participate in the debate, you only post unrelated comments, I am sure a jinn is possessing you.

OMG Rappacini you are SOOOOOOO NAILED, PM got you good, you are done, it's over, gather your chips and go home.

PS are you and your jinn still coming over for martinis on friday? He likes olives right??

 

[§outh§tar]

hey path

I hear the jinn likes to eat pickles instead because he never got satisfied in life. Sorry Rappacini, PM's ghost detector has SURELY found a wild, crazy jinn infesting your soul, please note that "you are VERY disturbed".

 

[Katazia]

SouthStar,

That's the entire reason I'm here Kat, to see if the Bible really does stand up to the test of opposition.

OK excellent.

However, you are coming off the premise that the Bible is authored by "liars" and I came off saying the Bible is inspired by God.

The first consideration is credibility. An all powerful omnipotent and omniscient super being existing in an unproven supernatural realm versus the inconsistent writings of mere men at a time of widespread chaos, ignorance, illiteracy and superstition and where the total world population was only 150M.

The next consideration is history and a perspective for the arena that gave birth to Christianity. The research of Q explains much of this, and certainly an understanding of the “Kingdom of Heaven” Concept is essential, the key role of Paul, and then more politics and the influence of Tertullian and then Eusebius who is what I would call a somewhat creative editor while controlling too much of what history we were allowed to see and what was allowed to exist. And….. there is just so much to put together. My conclusions are based on many years and many books. But the selection process of the texts that comprise the current bible is revealing as well as the amount of material that was deliberately destroyed because it showed the ‘wrong’ story was simply criminal… and…

Of course, I don't know how exactly this inspiration takes place. Whether they just copy down what God whispers to them audibly, or whether these are just their theological contemplations.

They were men, just mere men, creating a story for an audience they hoped would come and listen. There was no godly influence. The politics and manipulation of the texts came later when Christianity became an official religion, although I think it was a close call and that Sun worship came a close second. Once a religious institution has the backing of a totalitarian and powerful state regime then there is little choice that it will thrive. Without that backing I’m sure it would have withered as it should have.

How were they polticians? What did they have to lose that they would collectively "lie" and be "myth-makers"?

You make it sound like an organized conspiracy, but that wasn’t the way it was in the early years – see Q for details. Later with characters like Eusebius who is on record as saying that telling lies is perfectly acceptable if it furthers the glorious work of Christianity, are the real criminals in the history of this religion.

Why would a cowardly bunch be suddenly inspired to endure crucifixion, whippings, imprisonment and so on just to spread a lie?

And then there are the gullible victims who actually believed the fairy tales.

Read and study with a critical eye. You appear to be starting by assuming it is all true first – that isn’t particularly objective. Question your reasons for believing it is true first.

Don’t know if that helps.
Kat

 

[§outh§tar]

Before I go on to answer tomorrow, I have a question:

Isn't questioning the "doctrine of Christ" saying that my faith is not strong? Don't I need faith to believe? Through my faith He forgives my sins. If I am doubtful that He will forgive my sins then I am doubting everything.

 

[Katazia]

Faith simply means believing without proof or evidence. There is no evidence for Christian claims that is why faith MUST be stressed. Reasoned arguments always require evidence for their basis. It follows then that no reasoned arguments can be formulated for Christian doctrine. The only reasonable path to follow must be to doubt. This does not mean you believe Christianity to be false only that there is no reason to conclude that it is true.

Kat