Attention PM - Islam & Flexibility

everneo

Re-searcher
Registered Senior Member
For general good of the society relaxation and stiffening certain laws are permissible and this does make / will make Islam relevant and generous as well as strict enforcer in any era.


Muttah

Muttah, the temporary marriage was permissible in the case of the prophet and by him to the companions and muslims in general. Caliph Umar found that to be unsuitable for the good of the soicety in general :

"Mutah in some form or the other was permissible or at least not expressly forbidden before the time of Umar. Umar felt that Mutah "hereunder a man married a woman for a specified number of days amounted to disguised prostitution and this led to moral laxity. Umar accordingly passed an order prohibiting Mutah. He declared that it was open to a person to divorce a woman after regular marriage for any valid reason, but a marriage which was stipulated to be dissolved after a specified number of days was repugnant to the spirit of Islam which stood for stability of domestic homes. Umar elaborated that the purpose of marriage was to set up homes with a view to getting children and Mutah negated such objects. Moreover in the case of Mutah the children born of such union were to be subject to social disability which was detrimental to social order. "

Umar prohibited muttah marriages issuing fatwa against that practice.

Drinking

There is no specific punishment in Quran for drinking. Some argued that since quran does not specify any punishment Allah does not intend to prohibit drinking.!

Umar convened a meeting of his Consultative Assembly to consider the question. The first question that was taken up for consideration was: whether the drinking of wine was lawful or unlawful. The verdict was that it was unlawful.

The next question was: if it was unlawful what should be the penalty therefore. Umar agreed that no penalty in this behalf had been laid down in the Holy Quran, but he held that a penalty therefore could be laid down on the basis of analogy keeping in view the penalty provided for offences of kindred character.

Ali argued that the offence of drinking was of the same species as calumny for under the influence of drink one was apt to say many things which he should not have otherwise said. In the case of calumny the Holy Quran provided punishment as follows:

"Give eighty lashes to each one,

Of those who accuse honorable women;

But do not support their accusation with four witnesses.

Do not accept their testimony,

For it is they who break the law."

Ali advised that for drinking the same penalty i. e. eighty lashes should be provided.

This advice was accepted by Umar. Umar issued orders to all concerned to the following effect:

"Drinking is banned under the Holy Quran. If any Muslim drinks and pleads that this was lawful then cut off his head for what he says is a violation of the Holy Word. If he says that it is unlawful but that he fell into error then give him eighty lashes publicly."

- http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Articles/companion/14_umar_bin_al_khattab.htm

Cow slaughter - Modern fatwa, India :

In India, the cow is considered as sacred animal for various reasons. In a goodwill gesture to hindu brothers' religious feeling a top Islamic Theological School issued fatwa to avoid cow slaughter on the eve of Id-ul-Azha (Feb 2004) :

"Though cow slaughter is legitimate under Shariat, it is advised that sheep, goat and camel may be sacrificed in states where there is a ban on cow slaughter. The law of the land should not be violated and peace should be maintained in the states and the country," Mufti Habibur Rahman, head of the Darul's fatwa bench, told PTI over phone from Deoband, about 50km from Saharanpur, in Uttar Pradesh."

"President of the Jamiat-Ulema-Hind, affiliated to the Deoband school, Maulana Mehmood Madani told PTI that the Jamiat had passed a resolution over a year ago asking Muslims to voluntarily stop killing cows as it hurt the sentiments of the Hindus."

- http://www.rediff.com/news/2004/feb/02cow.htm

This goodwill gesture was praised even by hardcore hindu nationalists let alone ordinary hindus who feel more closer to muslims.

Time changes and Islam should show dynamicism and it can do that without loosing its sanctity. What you think..? Any further proposals to bring closer the muslims and non-muslims..? or would you declare Umar, Ali and those Ulema in India as non-muslims for violating the prophets words and compromising with infidels respectively.?!!
 
you'd love that wouldn't you? A complete dilution of their faith, seeing them drinking and whorring.

:rolleyes:
 
Read properly. Prohibition of Mutah and drinking was the bold move on the part of Umar and Ali irrespective of what was the opinion of the prophet or what is there (or not) in Quran. How these fatwas dilute your faith and result in drinking & whoring.? Quite contrary otherwise.
 
outlandish said:
you'd love that wouldn't you? A complete dilution of their faith, seeing them drinking and whorring.

:rolleyes:

Well said.

I have no time to waste with the everyon's nonesense, some people want Islam to be like christianity, TAILORED-MADE, to suit their own personal desires, it wont happen...Alcohol is strictly banned in Islam and so is adultry, I dont need to go all over again and explain why, I have really no intention to waste my energy with such nonesense.

Thanks outlandish.

PS: I like to listen to the song AISHA by the Danish group outlandish, any connection with them ?? ;)
 
Just for the record PM, adultery is also banned in The Bible and thus in Christianity, you just find that many people calling themselves Christians seem to pick and choose what parts they will follow on a day to day basis.
 
Alcohol is strictly banned in Islam and so is adultry

That won't stop anyone. If it did, there would be no need for Ramadan.
 
One of the worst alcholics and philanderers I've ever met was a Muslim, or so he called himself. He was a nice guy, but would get drunk everyday and hit on women whenever he got drunk. The worst part is that he was doing this in business situations.
 
everneo said:
There is no specific punishment in Quran for drinking. Some argued that since quran does not specify any punishment Allah does not intend to prohibit drinking.!

You are quite correct everneo, and yes the Quran doesn't speak of a punichment for drinking or any intoxicants. The Quran never prescribed a wordly punichment for eating swine, but we all know that it's sinfull. I personally am deterred enough from not drinking or eating swine due to the mere fear of god and not what Omar or others might think of me. The Quran specifically states that drinking is sinful, yet it never established a punishment for it. Lying is sinfull as well, but no punichment. Here's the Quranic verses:

The Holy Quran, 2.219:

They ask thee concerning wine and gambling. Say: "In them is great sin, and some profit, for men; but the sin is greater than the profit." They ask thee how much they are to spend; Say: "What is beyond your needs." Thus doth Allah Make clear to you His Signs: In order that ye may consider. [The Qurán 2:219]

The Holy Quran, 5.90:

O ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling, (dedication of) stones, and (divination by) arrows, are an abomination,- of Satan's handwork: eschew such (abomination), that ye may prosper. [The Qur;an 5:90]

The Holy Quran, 5.91:

Satan's plan is (but) to excite enmity and hatred between you, with intoxicants and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allah, and from prayer: will ye not then abstain? [The Qurán 5:91]
 
First time after opening this thread, there IS a muslim who actually read my post and comprehended what is really told there. Great, Flores, so far i was seeing the so called shields of Islam really have no time to digest that Islam could be (and is) tolerant and flexible enough to preserve its spirit. They seem to wish that Islam should be and 'remain' an intolerant and 'tyranical' religion. I hailed the just and reasonble decision taken by Umar and Ali in case of mutah and drinking. See the kind of responses from 'muslims' to this islamic friendly thread.!
 
everneo said:
See the kind of responses from 'muslims' to this islamic friendly thread.!

Everneo, unfortunately, some muslims in this day and age are extremely judgemental and are playing god on earth. Much like christians used to sell heaven keys and tickets for a price during the dark ages, muslims are currently in their darkest ages selling Fatwas for the promise of heaven. Can you believe that our sheiks are interfering with every minute detail of our lives by issuing a Fatwa. Muslims who need to fart now, need a Fatwa, those needing to marry need a Fatwa, wanna eat in a restaurant get a Fatwa, wanna buy cloth, get a Fatwa...why are they closing all god's forgiveness doors and replacing them with their own Fatwas? It also seems like while most christians are level headed, the baptist sect are trying to drag all christians back to the dark ages with their attitude that they are the only ones saved.....again being judgemental and playing god.
 
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Proud_Muslim said:
Well said.
some people want Islam to be like christianity, TAILORED-MADE, to suit their own personal desires, it wont happen...

Why are you so hostile toward other's interpretations and understanding. Do you feel threatened? Do you not trust in god that you have to keep confirming to yourself that YOUR WAY OR THE HIGHWAY. Do you have a copy right on Islam? Last I checked, god is the only one with copy rights on his religion, and Islam is not YOUR religion, it's god's religion. Try to control your hatered and replace it with something more beneficial like admitting your unrightous state and requesting forgiveness from god.

[110.1] When there comes the help of Allah and the victory,
[110.2] And you see men entering the religion of Allah in companies,
[110.3] Then celebrate the praise of your Lord, and ask His forgiveness; surely He is oft-returning (to mercy).
 
Flores,

Fatwas issued for good cause like the ones i mentioned earlier were well intended and would certainly go a long way. The fatwas you mentioned regarding sundry things made me to laugh.

I have to agree with you on babtists' zeal. Extremities in any religion would bring harm to those religions / sects.
 
everneo said:
Flores,

Fatwas issued for good cause like the ones i mentioned earlier were well intended and would certainly go a long way. The fatwas you mentioned regarding sundry things made me to laugh.

Agreed, but please remember that Omar was in no way attempting to change the religion with his Fatwa. Omar was merely establishing order and civil rule for his State. Afterall, Omar was head of state and entrusted with State affairs.

Omar as a leader of the State was not trying to change or refine Islam, he was merely establishing a civil constitution that is subject to change or even elimination if another civil ruler deems it necessary.

Islam is indeed flexible.
 
Siddhartha said:
Just for the record PM, adultery is also banned in The Bible and thus in Christianity, you just find that many people calling themselves Christians seem to pick and choose what parts they will follow on a day to day basis.

Siddhartha said:
(Q), the actions of one man do not define Islam. Unless his name is Allah. ;)

So you have a set rules to judge Christians and another set to judge muslims - how very Islamic, true to the core.
 
(Q), the actions of one man do not define Islam. Unless his name is Allah.

Was Allah a man? I thought Allah was an ideal in the minds of men.
 
(Q)

It just goes to prove muslims make it all up as they go along, and it also proves that Islam is a load of bollox.
 
Vienna said:
(Q)

It just goes to prove muslims make it all up as they go along, and it also proves that Islam is a load of bollox.

Stick with those thoughts if that is what makes you tick....
 
Are fatwa's being used to justify criminal, anti-social behavior? Obviously, yes. But is this practice at an all time high in the history of Islam? I don't know my Islamic history well enough to answer that with certainty.

What I can say for certain is this: Through the use of mass communication via TV and internet, fatwa's have the capability to reach a larger audience faster than ever before, and that makes the misuse of them potentially more dangerous than at any point previous to the present.
 
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