Are you concerned about finding the truth, for once and always?

Y

Yosef

Registered Senior Member
cosmictraveler said:
Every person has a right to believe in God if they want to. It is up to everyone to choose for themselves whether or not God exists to them.
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But I think it is important to emphasize in this context that each person needs also to ponder (in private) the question : "Am I concerned about finding the truth, for once and always?"

It would be nice if the readers report their thoughts regarding this question. If you care, what are your concrete plans to find answers and if you don't bother, may I ask why?
 
cosmictraveler said:
I believe in myself not some invisible supreme being that controls everything.
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But what if that supreme being calls you, promises to bless you with light and guidance as you navigate through life, take care of you, aid you, choose the best for you, promises to give you eternal life and promises to bring into life loved people who passed away?!

"The likeness of this life on earth to that in paradise is like what you get if you put one of your fingers into the ocean and pull it out.. See what it returns (a drop of water?!)": Saying of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).

Are not you concerned about losing the ticket to paradise?! We all would love to live a trouble-free eternal life...
 
I'm sure we would. But who is it you have on the phone, there?
 
Only a fool would think they could find the truth, let alone comprehend it.

Lets all drink from the holy grail....:rolleyes:
 
A thirsty horse will always drink. If there is an observer stationed at the well, they can decide then, truthfully or imagined delusion, that the horse was led there.
--keith
 
NeverForget911 said:
Jesus Christ/God is truth. All the rest is of Satan.
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All the rest that you talk of was made by God according to your religion. Before God there was nothing, now we have this universe of physical things and ideas, all of which were created and allowed to happen by God, including Satan. Your little boggey man called Satan is a creation by God and God allows Satan to exist for you and those who believe.

Now let me set up a question that gets to the heart of this belief in going to a happy place when you die.

I am assuming that you believe in Heaven. yes/no.

If so, then you want to go to Heaven right.

So tell me, what goes to Heaven? I have heard that your soul goes to Heaven. Can you tell me about this soul?
 
Yosef said:
But what if that supreme being calls you, promises to bless you with light and guidance as you navigate through life, take care of you, aid you, choose the best for you, promises to give you eternal life and promises to bring into life loved people who passed away?!

"The likeness of this life on earth to that in paradise is like what you get if you put one of your fingers into the ocean and pull it out.. See what it returns (a drop of water?!)": Saying of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).

Are not you concerned about losing the ticket to paradise?! We all would love to live a trouble-free eternal life...
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What is this thing that will get eternal life? Do you posses it or is it you?
 
Lori_7 said:
speak for yourself, and pass me the grail; i'm drinking.
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hey leave me some!:D
keith1 said:
A thirsty horse will always drink. If there is an observer stationed at the well, they can decide then, truthfully or imagined delusion, that the horse was led there.
--keith
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not if a guy pulled the horse to the well with a rope.

ok but seriously, whether you think the horse was guided or not and whether you're correct or not in your assumption is based on your knowledge of horses..i.e in religion.

if you're an expert on horses and you knew that he wasn't guided here then fine.
but don't say an eagle who caomes later on to drink isn't guided because you knew the horse wasn't.

you can't reject god because you reject a religion, as much as you can't say allanimals aren't guided because you know one isn't.
 
He can reject God if he rejects the theological elements that make Him.
 
then his mind is incomplete..[uh, as in..retarded? or at least not mentally capable]
care to give examples of such theological elemnts?
and you being a theist sure puts a question mark on your objection.
 
scifes said:
then his mind is incomplete..[uh, as in..retarded? or at least not mentally capable]
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That is utter and inexcusable nonsense.

care to give examples of such theological elemnts?
and you being a theist sure puts a question mark on your objection.
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It surely does not. Me being a theist indicates I can see both sides of the equation. Or do you presume I should take the side of foolish arguments, because some of my philosophy lies in the same line?

It is of no factual support that any magical or deific being exists. There is no G-statistic for God, or assay for Allah, or judgement line for Jehova. When atheists propose the Flying Spaghetti Monster, two lines of argument are invoked: i) that the comparison is farcical, as the FSM is a being known to be false, having been created for precisely this comparison, whereas the basis of the original proposition of God/Allah/Jehovah cannot in all probability be known. ii) the basis of practical evidence for either is virtually equivalent. While the FSM itself is not a practical argument, it does raise the issue of the basis of personal belief: atheists have no reason to believe in any creature, supernatural or natural, which is not supported by evidence.

The FSM is incorrect because it is knowingly false. But atheists, having no evidence for any of our conceptions of God, are not "disabled" or "incomplete" or - especially - "retarded" merely because of your childish frustration at their reasonable refusal of a concept that has in fact brought unimaginable harm to almost every civilization in the world. I appreciate your quest for theological truth, but not your indignation at the rejection of that quest by others. In fact, as a theist I am naturally constrained to wish that they would embark on such a quest, and even to discuss the matter therein, but not to demean their projection of free will into an argument with no empirical solution short of miraculous personal or general occurrence.
 
I might add here: the conception that atheists - or non-believers generally - are "mentally deficient" has been used in a number of cases of apostacy in your part of the world. You, projecting yourself as a sort of religious liberal Arthur E. Neuman while espousing the same belief system, supports a lot of the preconceptions that many people have about Islamic religious law and its demographic and 'intellectual' support. Your claims become increasing weak therein.
 
GeoffP, reading those last two posts makes me wish I could clap you on the back and shake your hand.
I can't, so an Internet handshake will have to do.

A belief in God is purely a faith thing. While the FSM may be known to be false, it demonstrates that anyone can invent or postulate a diving being and assign it traits.
And this is what the Modern God of the bible has become. The current description of God is Vastly different than the one from 400 years ago and more vastly different from the one of 2500 years ago.
He's ummm [cough]... evolved... according to the wants of the culture that believes in him.
Almost any believer will spell out their personal description of God, which is primarily based on what they want him to be and not how he's described by others.
The fundamentalists, on the other hand, almost seem to want him to be anything they can say they read about in a book. They want his description to be from someone else.

Hypothetically, if someone was unaware that the FSM was just an absurd comparison and took the idea and ran with it- they could quite easily build a church.

Even so, it's almost thrilling to see someone that holds an idea conscientiously accept and acknowledge what that idea is. No justification; no excuses; no song and dance.
 
post#17 was great, hats off to you sir, we sure need a reminder every now and then, even though it was the product of a misunderstanding of my post on your part[or me understanding yours], post 18 got personal, and i didn't really get it anyway, post #19..well it's a new open can of worms opened, but it's relevant.

for the question mark, you said an athiest can (rightfully, correctly) reject god if he rejects the theological elements that compose him, in reply to me saying that
a-rejection of a god model[a religion], is only for those who know that model.
b-rightfully rejecting a god model doesn't justify or mean the rejection of all god models.

you in essence disagreed with point b, that god can be rejected altogether without the need to know all religions or any, but to reject god as a concept, i say your statement is incorrect, and am sure of it 101%, there is no contradiction whatsoever in the theological or philosophical concept of god, and i dare anyone who says otherwise.
i still stand to say that anyone who says otherwise is using fractured logic, and am ready to prove it so[and i don't mind being proven to be having fractured logic myself, in my belief in god].
however, what i think you failed to grasp, is that you HAVE to agree that anyone who has a VALID theological argument against god is MISTAKEN, for you would be an atheist if you saw their argument to be right.

so how do you believe in god yet say their arguments against him are not flawed?:confused:
or are we just venting some steam here? or trying to show off our open mindedness by contradicting owrselves?:rolleyes:

the thing is, you colsed the only door open by yourself, the only excuse we can give atheists, and the only one they have, is that they lack knowldege of religion, which is what i said, not that they found a fault in his philosophical structure, which admitted by a theist doesn't make sense.
 
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