Are all cultures worthy of equal respect?

[WillNever]

A poster in a different thread stated this:

All disparaging remarks about any culture should be a cause of personal offense to any intelligent person with a conscience.

Do you agree with the above statement? This person has also stated that being a cultural "bigot" is no better than being a racial bigot. I am unsure as to what a cultural bigot is, but I assume that it is one who is critical of other cultures simply for their identity.

I must admit that I don't agree with the above. I believe that some cultures have fundamental aspects to them that are flawed. For example, I certainly don't hold war-like cultures in the same esteem that I hold peace-loving cultures. I see nothing positive about being war-like. Nor do I think we should be expected to tolerate (much less respect) cultures who celebrate the destruction of life. Historically, sacrificing virgins was held as an ideal by certain cultures, as one example, and although that practice might be integral to those cultures, I believe that their practices should be put down and discouraged.

In my opinion, when it is a society's culture to torture and kill, then it isn't culture at all. It's just barbarism. And at that point, their culture ceases to be worthy of respect. Not until they change their ways, at any rate.

What is your view? Use this thread to talk about whether or not we should embrace all aspects of all other cultures, or if it is reasonable to admire some cultures while looking down on other cultures.

 

[adoucette]

I'm pretty sure I think the culture of the head hunters of Borneo sucks.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/1201166.stm

Similarly Black gang culture sucks.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/07/challenging_gang_culture.html

 

[Arioch]

No, all cultures are not equal and, depending on what drives your morality, they are definitely not all worthy of equal praise. If, for example, your morality is built on values like equality and freedom, then islamic culture is definitely not worthy of praise from your point of view because of how many basic freedoms(freedom of speech, the equality of women, freedom of and from religion) are necessarily impinged upon.

Beyond that different cultures are better at different things. If you and your family/tribe/whatever are stuck in the Amazon then I'm pretty sure that American culture will get you killed pretty quickly(I know that when I was stuck out in the wilderness for a week, virtually all of my cultural norms disappeared by the first day). But the culture of a tribe who lives and thrives in the rain forests of South America wouldn't do so well here because of the different environment they'd be forced to live in.

Basically it all comes down to your goals, and which cultures will suit them the best. If your goal is to be a good muslim then islamic culture is the way to go. If your goal is to reduce human suffering then islamic culture is not the way to go.

 

[Me-Ki-Gal]

wow they let you out of the slammer. Glad to see you on the out side .
Consider this . Maybe other cultures have something to offer ? Weed out the bad as there is in all cultures . Did ever stop to think there might be something of value you don't yet understand ? Are all cultures equal . Apples and Oranges are they equal ? How about Pears ? You might like one more than the other that is understandable . Do we throw away all the pears just because you don't like em ?

 

[chimpkin]

I think that one should look at a culture in such a way as to not allow the things that you do not care for to contaminate your view of the entire culture and people.
Which is where I see you standing in regards to the Chinese, Will.

Too, I think it helps to take a good hard look at one's own culture and realize yours isn't perfect either...don't worry about the mote in your neighbor's eye when you have a board in your own and all that.

It's interesting, the same people you accuse of being universally repulsive and violent are one of the homelands of Mahayana Buddhism.
The Chinese are like people everywhere. Some good, some bad. You will edit out the good, though because you carry a strong bias. You will remember the bad and pay attention to it.

I personally find a lot of Middle-Eastern cultures pretty repulsive-Saudi Arabia bothers the crap out of me...but I try not to let that extend to judging individuals or saying that all the people in the culture are barbarians or some such.

The headhunters of Borneo don't believe in natural death. If you die, somebody put a hex on you, and so your folks have to go rub 'em out. Everybody gets gotten in the end.

You have to wonder if the missionaries were doing them a favor or not...ordinarily the Xtian soldiers tick me off no end...speaking of cultures I don't like.

 

[James R]

This person has also stated that being a cultural "bigot" is no better than being a racial bigot. I am unsure as to what a cultural bigot is, but I assume that it is one who is critical of other cultures simply for their identity.

Probably ... combined with the assumption that the culture that one belongs to oneself is automatically "superior" to all other cultures. I guess a cultural bigot will go looking for the bad in other cultures while being wilfully blind to the good, and applying the reverse process to his own culture.

I believe that some cultures have fundamental aspects to them that are flawed. For example, I certainly don't hold war-like cultures in the same esteem that I hold peace-loving cultures. I see nothing positive about being war-like. Nor do I think we should be expected to tolerate (much less respect) cultures who celebrate the destruction of life. Historically, sacrificing virgins was held as an ideal by certain cultures, as one example, and although that practice might be integral to those cultures, I believe that their practices should be put down and discouraged.

The question you're really discussing here is the one of moral relativism. Is it ok to say "Well, being war-like is just part of their culture, so that's ok then?" If "they" have a different idea of morality than "us", are we in any position to judge "them"? Are we morally justified in doing so? If you're a moral relativist, you'll answer "No"/ If you're an absolutist, you'll say "yes".

In my opinion, when it is a society's culture to torture and kill, then it isn't culture at all. It's just barbarism.

It sounds like you're making value judgments before you start.

Also, I don't believe there are any societies whose "culture" it is to torture and kill. Can you think of any? Maybe those US states with the death penalty would qualify? Do you think? For that matter, is the US a "war-like" culture, by your measure? After all, in recent years the US has started wars in two separate countries.

What is your view? Use this thread to talk about whether or not we should embrace all aspects of all other cultures, or if it is reasonable to admire some cultures while looking down on other cultures.

It's hard to talk in the abstract.

What is a "culture", anyway? Is the US, say, a monoculture, or a set of many subcultures which share a nation? Does a motorcycle gang have a distinction "culture" in the sense you're talking about? What about the culture of the US military, or Congress, or the Civil Liberties Union? Or are all those things to be lumped into "US culture"?

 

[Pineal]

In my opinion, when it is a society's culture to torture and kill, then it isn't culture at all.

Well, that means most cultures are not cultures, since they all allow for torture and certainly killing.

As far as the thread title....

Are all cultures worthy of equal respect?

There's a way this question makes no sense. Worthy of whose respect? Once you state whose respect we are talking about, this person or group will then have a culture and that culture will likely have values in common with and against those of whatever culture is in question. The question as formulated implies there is an objective standard.

 

[chimpkin]

What is a "culture", anyway? Is the US, say, a monoculture, or a set of many subcultures which share a nation? Does a motorcycle gang have a distinction "culture" in the sense you're talking about? What about the culture of the US military, or Congress, or the Civil Liberties Union? Or are all those things to be lumped into "US culture"?

Right...Quakers and thugs are part of our culture, party types and serious academics...and people who are predators, sadists, drug addicts, violent criminals, and persons who are utterly callous to others' suffering.

 

[Pineal]

Right...Quakers and thugs are part of our culture, party types and serious academics...and people who are predators, sadists, drug addicts, violent criminals, and persons who are utterly callous to others' suffering.

I think we went to the same college.

 

[The Esotericist]

Does the planet Earth, do we humans have a culture? It's sort of hard to say. . . in comparison to what, right? But we can use our imaginations, for I think some of us could imagine a better world, and a worse world, right?

So, there are reasons for the way things are done the way they are, right? :shrug:

The fact is, you have to walk a mile in the shoes of a Terran to understand our ignorance and our necessary short comings. All cultures are a product of their history, all peoples are the collective products of the triumphs and failings of their ancestors. To condemn some practices is like taking out the threads of a finely crafted and intricate blanket. It'll unravel.

Is one culture's blanket necessarily more beautiful than another? Well, I think that is a rather subjective assessment. All have their necessary and beautiful contributions to the world culture, and certainly, there are many things about them all we can leave in the dustbin of history.

If you don't view them as worthy of equal respect, my suspicion is you are being ethnocentric. Historically, this has been one of the easiest and surest ways that elite rulers of nations have motivated their populations and whipped them up into a frenzy in order to mobilize them for war against the "other." And as you postulate, the nation that goes to war is clearly the inferior culture.

 

[Ripley]

I don't know, but passengers deplaning from—I only know a few—Royal Air Maroc and Air Algerie generally leave the plane in total disarray with all types of paraphernalia strewing the length of the entire cabin. I'd say theirs is a passionate mess. KLM and Swiss Air passengers generally leave an orderly mess, quite respectable, with refolded (!) blankets. Very proper indeed. Air France, an uninhibited casual mess, lavish, erotic, and bohemian. Lufthansa—as to be expected—is left with a faultlessly neat and proper mess; everything nicely arranged. Lite. Cubana, a dull mess—passengers must've been bored witless. Air Canada, a vapid mess, noticeably unnoticeable. British Airways—never got a chance to approach them. I wouldn't dare fly with an American airline nowadays.

 

[The Esotericist]

wow they let you out of the slammer. Glad to see you on the out side .
Consider this . Maybe other cultures have something to offer ? Weed out the bad as there is in all cultures . Did ever stop to think there might be something of value you don't yet understand ? Are all cultures equal . Apples and Oranges are they equal ? How about Pears ? You might like one more than the other that is understandable . Do we throw away all the pears just because you don't like em ?

Well said. A child can get this.

 

[nietzschefan]

wow they let you out of the slammer. Glad to see you on the out side .
Consider this . Maybe other cultures have something to offer ? Weed out the bad as there is in all cultures . Did ever stop to think there might be something of value you don't yet understand ? Are all cultures equal . Apples and Oranges are they equal ? How about Pears ? You might like one more than the other that is understandable . Do we throw away all the pears just because you don't like em ?

I personally take out the pears I like, then throw the rest in the trash. Particularly when times are good.

 

[quadraphonics]

A poster in a different thread stated this:

That was my statement, and I will take this opportunity to once again express my strong disapproval of your troll tactics. You had to know that I'd notice this thread and recognize the quote of myself, and so this adds up to an extremely cheap call-out thread that you've swaddled in the thinnest veneer of deniability.

Leave me the hell out of your racist trolling.

This person has also stated that being a cultural "bigot" is no better than being a racial bigot.

Once again: you have obviously created this thread to call me out, so how about you grow a set of balls and be up-front about it? This whole tactic of invoking and lambasting (and decontextualing) my statements while refusing to clearly attribute them is all kinds of cheap and childish.

It is an embarassment for SciForums as a whole that you are allowed to get away with this kind of shit.

 

[Tiassa]

The challenge of cultural illiteracy

It is an embarassment for SciForums as a whole that you are allowed to get away with this kind of shit.

Oh, we've entertained plenty of more embarrassing folks over time.

But I think part of the problem is that the question demands people understand culture and cultural dynamics.

For instance, while it is hard to "respect" female genital mutilation, it is even harder to "respect" the supremacist cultures that invaded tribal Africa with the intent of "civilizing the savages". In order to transform problematic aspects of any given culture, one must comprehend the essential reasons those aspects exist. And this is where the functional problem with cultural bigotry arises; the criticism of "inferior" cultures most often accommodates a supremacist attitude that possesses no substantial comprehension. Superficial condemnation or denigration of a culture is one of the key identifiers of cultural illiteracy.

 

[quadraphonics]

So now we're editing minor, non-insulting, non-profane expressions out of my posts, while allowing WillNever to blatantly troll me and spew overtly racist propaganda. How quintessentially limp-wristed and counter-productive - complicit, in point of fact.

This is an easy call. Why are you going so far out of your way to completely fucking blow it?

 

[Tiassa]

Mod Hat — Response

Mod Hat — Response

So now we're editing minor, non-insulting, non-profane expressions out of my posts, while allowing WillNever to blatantly troll me and spew overtly racist propaganda.

One can certainly question the validity of "non-insulting" as an adjective in this case. And it's not like this edit is inconsistent with history.

Additionally, I would note that our neighbor just returned from a two-week vacation imposed for his overtly racist conduct.

Thus, I would advise patience, sir. Our neighbor will either get the point eventually or unquestionably cross a line soon enough.

Meanwhile, remember that, according to the topic post, our neighbor does not agree with what he already admitted to not understanding. Surely that is worth a chuckle?

I know I'm amused by his exercise in futility. Just give it time.

(Additionally, I would repeat my general request that those who disagree with my moderation in a particular instance not disrupt an ongoing thread with the dispute. Members have diverse options for whining about how their own infallibility goes unrecognized.)

 

[The Esotericist]

Once again: you have obviously created this thread to call me out, so how about you grow a set of balls and be up-front about it? This whole tactic of invoking and lambasting (and decontextualing) my statements while refusing to clearly attribute them is all kinds of cheap and childish.

It is an embarassment for SciForums as a whole that you are allowed to get away with this kind of shit.

Geese, I thought he was calling me out. . .

 

[quadraphonics]

Geese, I thought he was calling me out. . .

He's obviously looking for as big a flamewar as possible, but the two specific quotes he built the OP around are both from myself.

 

[chimpkin]

I don't know, but passengers deplaning from—I only know a few—Royal Air Maroc and Air Algerie generally leave the plane in total disarray with all types of paraphernalia strewing the length of the entire cabin. I'd say theirs is a passionate mess. KLM and Swiss Air passengers generally leave an orderly mess, quite respectable, with refolded (!) blankets. Very proper indeed. Air France, an uninhibited casual mess, lavish, erotic, and bohemian. Lufthansa—as to be expected—is left with a faultlessly neat and proper mess; everything nicely arranged. Lite. Cubana, a dull mess—passengers must've been bored witless. Air Canada, a vapid mess, noticeably unnoticeable. British Airways—never got a chance to approach them. I wouldn't dare fly with an American airline nowadays.

:bravo:
I wish there was a way to favorite posts around here, so I could dog-ear them to read at a later date. This is golden.
On the American lines...
One visualizes trying to lift the seat cushions...only to find them gummed to the seat frame with the spew from used, dried-up prophylactics and old nutbar wrappers...