Anyone think AIDS is man-made?
- Thread starter Chalaco
- Start date
Do your friends have any more depth to thier theorys other than "I bet it was man made"? I really didnt know there was any evedence for it. I have also heard there is a group of folks with HIV who claim that HIV is not the cause of AIDS, but from all I've found out about this these are just people in hysterical denial.
SpyMoose said:
that's assuming they're my friends (some are, though not all, I've heard it many times as well). I've heard that theory many times over, and if the merits of their arguments held any real weight, I'd probably be able to remember them with more lucidity, meaning it probably wasn't much.
Take it as you will, however some times this theory turn out to be true, remember that the news here in US, is totally bias, and that all is not revealed, thus rummors that may be unpopular are quickly labed "conspiracie theories" who is to know, when our reporters are a bunch of pancies, who don't report. But sell you SUV's and soap, and I again stress it, take it as you will, I don't know if this is true, I don't have the time required to investigate. However if rummors have an origin I've found it.
http://www.qadhafi.org/Muammar_Al_Qadafi_Exposes_the_CIA_role_in_Creating_&_Spreading_AIDS.html
Godless.
http://www.qadhafi.org/Muammar_Al_Qadafi_Exposes_the_CIA_role_in_Creating_&_Spreading_AIDS.html
Godless.
I wish you had cited a better source than Muammar Al-Qadafi. I dont think thats going to keep this thread alive. I know you were trying, and thats good, but wow man. Ive heard the "AIDS is man made" rumor many times myself, but it never comes with evedence. The only people I would trust on this issue are the doctors studying it... but then again they are probably primarily on the payrolls of the companys who are going to cure it, so they probably arnt free to say anything (conspiracy)
This is rather interesting:
http://www.rense.com/general36/history.htm
1969 Dr. Robert MacMahan of the Department of Defense requests from congress $10 million to develop, within 5 to 10 years, a synthetic biological agent to which no natural immunity exists.
1970 Funding for the synthetic biological agent is obtained under H.R. 15090. The project, under the supervision of the CIA, is carried out by the Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick, the army's top secret biological weapons facility. Speculation is raised that molecular biology techniques are used to produce AIDS-like retroviruses.
1975 The virus section of Fort Detrick's Center for Biological Warfare Research is renamed the Fredrick Cancer Research Facilities and placed under the supervision of the National Cancer Institute (NCI) . It is here that a special virus cancer program is initiated by the U.S. Navy, purportedly to develop cancer-causing viruses. It is also here that retrovirologists isolate a virus to which no immunity exists. It is later named HTLV (Human T-cell Leukemia Virus).
1978 Experimental Hepatitis B vaccine trials, conducted by the CDC, begin in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco. Ads for research subjects specifically ask for promiscuous homosexual men.
1981 First cases of AIDS are confirmed in homosexual men in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco, triggering speculation that AIDS may have been introduced via the Hepatitis B vaccine
You decide...
http://www.rense.com/general36/history.htm
1969 Dr. Robert MacMahan of the Department of Defense requests from congress $10 million to develop, within 5 to 10 years, a synthetic biological agent to which no natural immunity exists.
1970 Funding for the synthetic biological agent is obtained under H.R. 15090. The project, under the supervision of the CIA, is carried out by the Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick, the army's top secret biological weapons facility. Speculation is raised that molecular biology techniques are used to produce AIDS-like retroviruses.
1975 The virus section of Fort Detrick's Center for Biological Warfare Research is renamed the Fredrick Cancer Research Facilities and placed under the supervision of the National Cancer Institute (NCI) . It is here that a special virus cancer program is initiated by the U.S. Navy, purportedly to develop cancer-causing viruses. It is also here that retrovirologists isolate a virus to which no immunity exists. It is later named HTLV (Human T-cell Leukemia Virus).
1978 Experimental Hepatitis B vaccine trials, conducted by the CDC, begin in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco. Ads for research subjects specifically ask for promiscuous homosexual men.
1981 First cases of AIDS are confirmed in homosexual men in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco, triggering speculation that AIDS may have been introduced via the Hepatitis B vaccine
You decide...
I'm thinking this is straying a bit into pseudo-science here...
This is an insult to the planet earth, as if man could make something so brilliant and amazing as aids 
now that IS an interesting timeline. It would be more interesting if it did not come from rense.com, or if it sighted more source material for its information, but it seems like an ok start. Also I have to agree with Dr. Lou. Man never creates anything that rivals earths own natural developments.... oh hold on a second, we do it every day with one hand tied behind our backs. Sorry, my myistake there.
Don Hakman
Registered Senior Member
15 years ago the Scientific American magazine devoted an issue to the pandemic of Aids.
The scientific community was split about 50-50 on the man made Aides issue in the article.
One of the last and most reknown US microbiologists and authority on Aides of the opinion that certain forms of Aides are engineered, perished on Pan Am flight 800 along with his wife who was also a microbiologist and physician.
The scientific community was split about 50-50 on the man made Aides issue in the article.
One of the last and most reknown US microbiologists and authority on Aides of the opinion that certain forms of Aides are engineered, perished on Pan Am flight 800 along with his wife who was also a microbiologist and physician.
HahahahahaSpyMoose said:
Thats a joke, right?
Look at the best "robot" we can produce and then compare it to even the simplest of living organisms, there is no comparison.
And don't forget, nature made us for christ sake, have we made anything that even comes close to the human body in complexity? Pfft, we haven't made anything that comes close to the lady bug, or earth worm or cactus or anything.
Didn't we almost try to make some form of single celled life an then fail? Yeah I think we did.
And even if you were a comedically ignorant fool like spymoose you should have realised that if humans made aids then some human somewhere would have figured out a way to fight it, its clearly far above the brain of the homo-sapien, which is understandable considering nature went through a tonne of trial and error to find something we couldn't shrug off.
I just can't can't get over how you think human invention not only rivals but is more advanced than natural invention. The very concept is hilariously flawed.
Anything we have done that is half decent is an imitation of something we have noticed and dissected in nature.
There is clearly and obviously no argument for your stance, thanks for the laugh anyway.
Without even considering the usual conspiracy theories, or even that of infected African chimpanzees escaping from the lab somewhere in the USA, there are some facts about the AIDS virus, which are just too damn' weird to ignore.
1) 1st recorded case of AIDS-like fatality 1959.
2) 1st mass infections begin in the 70's, affecting gay men in SF USA and Sweden and hetero's in Tanzania and Haiti.
I can't help asking myself... why gay men in particular... in just 2 distinct places and why hetero men... in another 2 distinct places? The most natural place for the first cases to have occured should have been the whole of Africa, affecting both male and female Africans and some visitors to Africa as well. It's strange that the epidemic didn't take hold in Africa (as well as India and Thailand), until well after it exploded amongst the gay community in the West.
Some scientists, believe the virus jumped from chimps to humans 350 years ago, but they have no way of proving that, so it's mere conjecture.
Scientists believe that the modern strains of AIDS took a while to develop and spread (like, 350 years!), because it needed the (modern?) phenomenon of widespread promiscuous behaviour and dirty junkie needles to enable it to become epidemic. I cannot accept that Africans had been significantly less promiscuous in the last 300 years then they had in the last 50; why should they have been? Had even a few Africans been infected with HIV since the 1600's (and you could reasonably expect that there should have been at least some), then why didn't they export it to America and Europe during the slave trade?
I don't think AIDS is man made, but man may well have had a hand in it's development and distribution. I think it may have been a misguided attempt at culling homosexuals and black Africans.
Below is an official report I copied from some website.
Durban, South Africa-The AIDS virus most probably first jumped from chimpanzees to humans as early as 1675 and didn't establish itself as an epidemic strain in Africa until 1930, according to research presented yesterday at the 13th International AIDS Conference here.
The virus, HIV-1, is ancient, reported Dr. Anne-Mieke Vandamme of the Riga Institute in Leuven, Belgium. In collaboration with colleagues in France, Germany and Ireland, Vandamme devised a technique for tracing the family trees of viruses.
"The separation between SIVcpz [chimpanzee virus] and HIV was in 1675 to 1700," Vandamme told scientists. She said that theories on a more recent origin of HIV-1 epidemics in humans, "such as the one blaming vaccination with oral polio vaccine contaminated with SIV [chimp virus], seems very unlikely."
Vandamme's findings are important because they help explain not only how the world's worst recorded epidemic commenced, but also possibly where it is going and how fast. And in one respect they coincide with estimates reached independently at the Los Alamos National Laboratory. In 1930, both research teams have found, the first M-Class form of HIV emerged in Africa.
Scientists don't, of course, have blood samples dating to 1675. The oldest known HIV sample dates to only 1959. So to figure out HIV's history, scientists need to establish what they call the molecular clock of the virus, or the rate at which it changes. But that's tough for HIV, because different strains of the virus today are mutating and evolving at divergent rates.
As for why HIV smoldered in humans invisibly for 300 years, Vandamme said, "A true explosion requires a new mode of transmission or modern behavior," such as use of non-sterile needles, non-sterile blood products and widespread promiscuous sexual behavior.
000711
1) 1st recorded case of AIDS-like fatality 1959.
2) 1st mass infections begin in the 70's, affecting gay men in SF USA and Sweden and hetero's in Tanzania and Haiti.
I can't help asking myself... why gay men in particular... in just 2 distinct places and why hetero men... in another 2 distinct places? The most natural place for the first cases to have occured should have been the whole of Africa, affecting both male and female Africans and some visitors to Africa as well. It's strange that the epidemic didn't take hold in Africa (as well as India and Thailand), until well after it exploded amongst the gay community in the West.
Some scientists, believe the virus jumped from chimps to humans 350 years ago, but they have no way of proving that, so it's mere conjecture.
Scientists believe that the modern strains of AIDS took a while to develop and spread (like, 350 years!), because it needed the (modern?) phenomenon of widespread promiscuous behaviour and dirty junkie needles to enable it to become epidemic. I cannot accept that Africans had been significantly less promiscuous in the last 300 years then they had in the last 50; why should they have been? Had even a few Africans been infected with HIV since the 1600's (and you could reasonably expect that there should have been at least some), then why didn't they export it to America and Europe during the slave trade?
I don't think AIDS is man made, but man may well have had a hand in it's development and distribution. I think it may have been a misguided attempt at culling homosexuals and black Africans.
Below is an official report I copied from some website.
Durban, South Africa-The AIDS virus most probably first jumped from chimpanzees to humans as early as 1675 and didn't establish itself as an epidemic strain in Africa until 1930, according to research presented yesterday at the 13th International AIDS Conference here.
The virus, HIV-1, is ancient, reported Dr. Anne-Mieke Vandamme of the Riga Institute in Leuven, Belgium. In collaboration with colleagues in France, Germany and Ireland, Vandamme devised a technique for tracing the family trees of viruses.
"The separation between SIVcpz [chimpanzee virus] and HIV was in 1675 to 1700," Vandamme told scientists. She said that theories on a more recent origin of HIV-1 epidemics in humans, "such as the one blaming vaccination with oral polio vaccine contaminated with SIV [chimp virus], seems very unlikely."
Vandamme's findings are important because they help explain not only how the world's worst recorded epidemic commenced, but also possibly where it is going and how fast. And in one respect they coincide with estimates reached independently at the Los Alamos National Laboratory. In 1930, both research teams have found, the first M-Class form of HIV emerged in Africa.
Scientists don't, of course, have blood samples dating to 1675. The oldest known HIV sample dates to only 1959. So to figure out HIV's history, scientists need to establish what they call the molecular clock of the virus, or the rate at which it changes. But that's tough for HIV, because different strains of the virus today are mutating and evolving at divergent rates.
As for why HIV smoldered in humans invisibly for 300 years, Vandamme said, "A true explosion requires a new mode of transmission or modern behavior," such as use of non-sterile needles, non-sterile blood products and widespread promiscuous sexual behavior.
000711