Any atheists here who were once believers?
- Thread starter wegs
- Start date
Wow! I'm really impressed by that.
I've already defined it. Nobody here buys your BS, so there's no use pretending.
No you didn't. You made a bunch of claims based on an ignorance of physics. You don't even know what a wave-function is. The concept of spacetime is totally foreign to you. You just throw words against the wall and hope they stick.
God hasn't claimed anything. People have made claims on his behalf. Or her behalf. Or their behalf. You believes can't even get the amount, name or gender of gods right.
Seattle
Valued Senior Member
Wegs, I wonder what is your distinction between atheist and agnostic? I try not to use labels as they tend to lead to confusion since everyone has a different definition of certain labels.
I ask because to me an agnostic is someone who isn't sure one way or the other. That is generally due to a lack of evidence I would think. An atheist is someone who doesn't believe based on a lack of evidence.
I don't see a real distinction. What is the distinction for you?
I ask because to me an agnostic is someone who isn't sure one way or the other. That is generally due to a lack of evidence I would think. An atheist is someone who doesn't believe based on a lack of evidence.
I don't see a real distinction. What is the distinction for you?
I don't see agnosticism as compromise between theism and atheism, though that's probably how wegs (and most people) use it. Agnosticism actually deals with the idea of whether it's possible to know whether there is a god or not.
In that sense, it's kind of redundant, in my opinion. Virtually all atheists accept that there is no way as of yet to know the answer to the ultimate question. Their (our) belief is that the evidence suggests the gods we know of are man-made, not that there's no chance an actual god exists somewhere.
In that sense, it's kind of redundant, in my opinion. Virtually all atheists accept that there is no way as of yet to know the answer to the ultimate question. Their (our) belief is that the evidence suggests the gods we know of are man-made, not that there's no chance an actual god exists somewhere.
What two numbers do you multiply together to get infinity? That is the number of Gods there could be.
In my own understanding of atheism, it could be defined as not believing in God, because no evidence supports his existence. Agnosticism (to me) is defined as "I don't know, what I don't know." Meaning, I can't say with certainty either way, if God exists or not. And I don't have a desire to know, anymore.
This is my understanding.
That's your opinion. Many others would suggest otherwise, proving my point that you guys can't seem to agree on anything.
That is your lack of understanding! Sorry I'm not angry just tired of it all. But I think God has a surprise waiting for you.
If you want everlasting life solve all the riddles in the THE GOSPEL OF THOMAS
http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/thomas.htm
1) And He said, "Whoever finds the interpretation of these
sayings will not experience death."
2) Jesus said, "Let him who seeks continue seeking until he
finds. When he finds, he will become troubled. When he becomes
troubled, he will be astonished, and he will rule over the All."
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One times infinity would be one of the answers, but when you multiply anything by zero and what do you get?
In one of the old Gospels Jesus is quoted as saying something about he does care how many Gods people have for he will be one of them.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/thomas.htm
"THE GOSPEL OF THOMAS"
So you see Jesus doesn't care how many Gods there are for he will be with him/them.
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Again, not everyone believes Jesus was even real, let alone the son of a god. So we're still left with you guys not being able to get your story straight.
Well what does Jesus say about that? Is it even important?
Have you tried this one? "37) His disciples said, "When will You become revealed to us and
when shall we see You?"
Jesus said, "When you disrobe without being ashamed and take
up your garments and place them under your feet like little
children and tread on them, then [will you see] the Son of the
Living One, and you will not be afraid""
That is what the Cave Boy did. He took off his clothes and walked naked and not ashamed, being reborn from Mother Earth. Am I the only Man with two biological mothers and two fathers?
It's not even remotely important what Jesus said about it. Of course, the passage you've quoted here doesn't even address what I just said.
Well read the Gospel and see if it is there and if it isn't, it just goes to show you it's not important.
I have some good news to share. My boyfriend asked me if I'd marry him, earlier tonight. I said yes. 
I've known him for a while, but as friends, even though we have only been dating a few months. When I came to this site, I wanted my ''persona'' to be private. I was married before, and after I divorced, I dated a very abusive man. He made my life very hard and I was always frightened. He was the reason I had lost trust in people...in men. It is the 'missing piece' that I left out of my 'leaving the faith' story.
It was around this time, that my faith wavered. How could God watch me go through what I did? It's been a long, winding road...but, I'm happy now.
I've also never shared that my dad died when I was a kid. My dad was the one who taught me to pray as a little girl. Taught me my faith. And I struggled to stay true to the faith he raised me in, but I just can't anymore. Letting go of my faith, is like letting go of my father, all over again. It's as though he has died all over again.
So...that's my story. I started a thread asking for stories, of why people who believed, left their faith. And I never really shared mine, in its entirety.
So, some of you here think I'm naive. That I look at the world through rose-colored glasses. But, I choose to still see the good, despite the pain I've dealt with, personally.
My kids are teens and are happy for me. I got married very young, in my life.
My bf is moving in this weekend. I didn't make a very good wife the first time, I hope I do better this time.
If my sharing this story, helps anyone...then, it's worth it.
I've known him for a while, but as friends, even though we have only been dating a few months. When I came to this site, I wanted my ''persona'' to be private. I was married before, and after I divorced, I dated a very abusive man. He made my life very hard and I was always frightened. He was the reason I had lost trust in people...in men. It is the 'missing piece' that I left out of my 'leaving the faith' story.It was around this time, that my faith wavered. How could God watch me go through what I did? It's been a long, winding road...but, I'm happy now.
I've also never shared that my dad died when I was a kid. My dad was the one who taught me to pray as a little girl. Taught me my faith. And I struggled to stay true to the faith he raised me in, but I just can't anymore. Letting go of my faith, is like letting go of my father, all over again. It's as though he has died all over again.
So...that's my story. I started a thread asking for stories, of why people who believed, left their faith. And I never really shared mine, in its entirety.
So, some of you here think I'm naive. That I look at the world through rose-colored glasses. But, I choose to still see the good, despite the pain I've dealt with, personally.
My kids are teens and are happy for me. I got married very young, in my life.
My bf is moving in this weekend.
I didn't make a very good wife the first time, I hope I do better this time.If my sharing this story, helps anyone...then, it's worth it.
More questions, Jan. You didn't answer the previous ones I put to you. Funny, that. It's almost as if you want to avoid the questions you find difficult.
Revelation is in the eye of the beholder, of course. And have you considered that perhaps Jesus Christ, if he existed at all, was just a great man?
Yes, and those instructions often conflict. Take different scriptures and you can easily pick out different messages and instructions. So, what to do?
How do you know there is information that we will never know? That's like Donald Rumsfeld's unknown unknowns, isn't it?
It's more a case that you, Jan, want more. You want a mystical, invisible, supernatural being to go along with your sensory apparatus.
See the detailed questions I asked about this distinction in my previous post. Can you answer them?
And if he doesn't exist after all?
Only in particular religious traditions. Some of the major world religions have very few scriptures. One (Yoruba) even relies a lot on human memory and oral transmission of the religious knowledge.
Besides, all scriptures are subject to endless argument and dispute and conflicting interpretation. How are we to know which one is right?
Finally. This is useful.
Your argument, then, is that one can only really believe in God if one has directly, personal experience of God. Scriptures, for all the importance you attach to them, are only a way to find out more once you already believe. That first step requires a personal communication with a being that you argue is real but who others argue is imaginary. So, we're back at step one. It's not that non-believers deny the obvious existence of God, or that they won't open themselves to that religious conversion experience you think they ought to have. It's more that they just haven't had that experience. Failing that, by your own argument, there's no good reason for them to believe. And the major problem you have is that your God may just be a delusion after all. That special connection you think you have to your God may in fact be nothing more than self-deception.
You accept that God was a first cause, do you not? On what basis? Scripture alone?
To what original position are you referring?
No. You just stopped believing.
I think you're in a muddle. Not believing in God doesn't mean you secretly believe in God but deny him in public. It really, actually, means you don't believe in God. This may be hard for you to accept or comprehend, but it really is as simple as that.
Revelation is in the eye of the beholder, of course. And have you considered that perhaps Jesus Christ, if he existed at all, was just a great man?
Yes, and those instructions often conflict. Take different scriptures and you can easily pick out different messages and instructions. So, what to do?
How do you know there is information that we will never know? That's like Donald Rumsfeld's unknown unknowns, isn't it?
It's more a case that you, Jan, want more. You want a mystical, invisible, supernatural being to go along with your sensory apparatus.
See the detailed questions I asked about this distinction in my previous post. Can you answer them?
In other words you've talked yourself out of belief in God, because you know better than God, and if He exists, it is for Him to come to you personally despite Him giving you every oppotunity in this form of life to come to Him.
And if he doesn't exist after all?
Only in particular religious traditions. Some of the major world religions have very few scriptures. One (Yoruba) even relies a lot on human memory and oral transmission of the religious knowledge.
Besides, all scriptures are subject to endless argument and dispute and conflicting interpretation. How are we to know which one is right?
Finally. This is useful.
Your argument, then, is that one can only really believe in God if one has directly, personal experience of God. Scriptures, for all the importance you attach to them, are only a way to find out more once you already believe. That first step requires a personal communication with a being that you argue is real but who others argue is imaginary. So, we're back at step one. It's not that non-believers deny the obvious existence of God, or that they won't open themselves to that religious conversion experience you think they ought to have. It's more that they just haven't had that experience. Failing that, by your own argument, there's no good reason for them to believe. And the major problem you have is that your God may just be a delusion after all. That special connection you think you have to your God may in fact be nothing more than self-deception.
You accept that God was a first cause, do you not? On what basis? Scripture alone?
To what original position are you referring?
No. You just stopped believing.
I think you're in a muddle. Not believing in God doesn't mean you secretly believe in God but deny him in public. It really, actually, means you don't believe in God. This may be hard for you to accept or comprehend, but it really is as simple as that.
I have some good news to share. My boyfriend asked me if I'd marry him, earlier tonight. I said yes.
It was around this time, that my faith wavered. How could God watch me go through what I did? It's been a long, winding road...but, I'm happy now.
I've also never shared that my dad died when I was a kid. My dad was the one who taught me to pray as a little girl. Taught me my faith. And I struggled to stay true to the faith he raised me in, but I just can't anymore. Letting go of my faith, is like letting go of my father, all over again. It's as though he has died all over again.
So...that's my story. I started a thread asking for stories, of why people who believed, left their faith. And I never really shared mine, in its entirety.
So, some of you here think I'm naive. That I look at the world through rose-colored glasses. But, I choose to still see the good, despite the pain I've dealt with, personally.
My kids are teens and are happy for me. I got married very young, in my life.
My bf is moving in this weekend.
If my sharing this story, helps anyone...then, it's worth it.
Wow tripple wow. That is good news isn't it. To come out of your closet and whack us with this I was surprised, by what you've said, for I had asked about things and never had a answer before. I feel really happy knowing you too have kids and that they are happy. Wow, thanks for the good news. For they will bring you joy. Do you look after them wegs?
OK, now I don't know what the prophecy means, so is it your Honeymoon trip then? When is the big day? So are you taking the blame for the first one failing? Surprised even more. Little miss perfect admitting an error! What is that about?
What a dag!
May the Lord Bless you with Love.
I loved you too. They say loved and lost, is better than never loved at all.
Thank you. ((Hugs))
Bells
Staff member
....
Dude!
You know how sometimes it is best to just say nothing at all?
I think now would have been one of those times for you.