Aleins from Earth

kmguru said:
This planet has been fully formed for the last 750 million years with several life extinction level events. To say that humans evolved only 100,000 years ago from the apes and trying to force fit the lack of clear evidence is really shaky at best.
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First, I'm not saying that human "evolved from apes," I'm saying what science says: that H. sapiens sapiens evolved along with apes from a common ancestor. Second, no one is "force fit"ing anything with a "lack of clear evidence." There simply isn't any evidence to suggest that hominids existed prior to the last few million years and ample evidence to suggest that other, different species did exist.

I'm not ruling out the possibility, and it make for nice fanstasy-fiction, but science is based on observation and hypothetico-deductive reasoning based on observable data. Speculation is fine for brainstorming, but it doesn't equal a true hypothesis.

My arguments to the silliness, hogwash, and poppycock suggested by the original poster stand. QED.

kmguru said:
For a true scientist - that is only a possiblity among many.
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But for a truly simple mind, the least possible becomes the most probable in spite of evidence and observation.

kmguru said:
So the point in pseudoscience section is to explore other possibilities rather than rehassing the simpletons. While 99% may be useless conjecture - that 1% - ah! that could be something.
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From my perspective, the Pseudoscience section of a science message board is a place to expose bad science, fraudulent science, and poppycock and to discuss the dynamics and affects of each on society and culture.

Otherwise, wouldn't the title of the section be "alternative science" (an oxymoron, to be sure)?
 
But for a truly simple mind, the least possible becomes the most probable in spite of evidence and observation.

You mean like the Flat Earth, or the Earth is the center of the Universe or the many before them - Oberservations?

Yes, you are right, a truly simple mind can not understand the context and references of higher level thinking. To them everything is least possible unless told otherwise by their elders. It happens all the time even with people having PhDs or working for the Government. That is why World Economic Forums do not produce any great positive results!

From my perspective, the Pseudoscience section of a science message board is a place to expose bad science, fraudulent science, and poppycock and to discuss the dynamics and affects of each on society and culture.

Originally, that was not our intent...but then again even the word "gay" lost its original meaning...as to society and culture, we have several subsections under real science section to show ones prowess in expose jounalism!
 
pseudo-science = fake-science
kmguru said:
Originally, that was not our intent
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When you and Porf created the forums, why didn't this come up? Why not "alternative" science forum or speculative "theories" forum?
 
That is because, it is true that 99% that is posted are junk science for entertainment. But there are "Eureka" moments that then moved to the science section. I have done that myself. So, Speculative theories does not quite fit into it. I would rather play here and when there is some useful idea comes - then go to work...

Most real innovators I talked to, do similar stuff - they play with silly stuff, but sometimes find interesting relationships out of this playground. We discussed this several years ago in a similar arguement. So just relax and enjoy. When you take your kid to go see Wrestling or any game...aways remember it is just a game...don't get too serious like some adults do...:D
 
kmguru said:
If one follows the last 100 million years of evolution, the missing link for humans should not arrive for atleast another 1 to 2 million years and humans perhaps another few million years - unless someone can explain the sudden change that affected the planet on a global scale. That is yet to come.
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Please explain. This makes no sense to me.

kmguru said:
While evolution itself may not be debateble, the time line and earth's isolation from the galaxy can be
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And what do you mean by 'earth's isolation from the galaxy'?
 
Meaning one group saying that we are the only intelligent creatures in the galaxy while others can argue that we are not isolated from galaxy and there could be technologically advanced races out there that could have influenced our evolution in the past. This is just as good a debate as people who believe God exists...and there are billions of them :D

It takes a very long time for species to evolve. Because of the time line is too short for the humans, we may either have external help or we have been here a lot longer like 20 million years? Extrapolating the time scales of other specis to humans, if the evolution is accelarating then we could have had a whole lot of advanced new specis along with humans in the last 40,000 years.

These are some items we could talk about. I am sure scientists have asked and answered these questions somewhere!
 
Okay the following I'm writing even though it's just a bizarre out of the way theory, which will likely never be proven possible but here it is.

A few years ago, Australia Teleported a Particle a couple of metres across their Laboratory (I apologise for the lack of concise information like with Laboratory and which Scientists were involved, I could search the internet for the answers however I'm being lazy because it would divert my attention from the content of the posts)

My question to that teleportion instance was, "Did the particle transfer distance in an instance, or did that particle mearly move between universes and found it's new position due to Relativity?"

Now you will probably find that question bizarre, however the reason I asked such a question is because if the second portion to that question proved true it would mean that "Time" is manipulatable and not just time, the movement of mass through "Time".

This spawned a whole bunch of theories for me:

For instance, what if a Primate Research Centre was setup where a monkey is sent through this system so that it ages within minutes (sent back form the future) and in this Centre different mating pairs can generate offspring which are then also sent back in the same way.

Before you know it, you couble be sending different points within Darwinistic nightmares of mans evolution back through the same system and of course.... beyond.

Notibly that one wouldn't be done because of the fact the equipment doesn't exist yet, and of course imagine trying to generate a "Tree of life" of monkey ancestors from folding multiple universes together to come up with an outcome, it would be like running a project as "Super String" not to forget the whole animal rights aspects.

The reason I mention this is because I know how technical it would be for us humans to master the alteration of our existance within time let alone for an alien civilization to do so.

(In our current societies on this planet and the current governments and legislation there is no way we could accomplish time manipulation as an "Open" goal because most people are too narrowminded and see only their goals as "the goal".

It's the same problem that any alien civilization would have to counteract to be able to do the things that so many people profess they do.)
 
Kmguru, OK, I see where you are coming from now. I'll leave the isolation question to one side, at least for now.

What leads you to believe the time for the development of humans is too short? Species development can be rapid. The geological record has many examples of rapid change. [In part this has generated the arguments over punctuated equilibrium.] For a species evolving in a rapidly changing environment human evolution doesn't seem unusual. Have you data that would contradict this?
 
Stryderunknown said:
A few years ago, Australia Teleported a Particle a couple of metres across their Laboratory
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I think you'll find that they teleported properties of a particle, not the particle itself, by means of quantum entanglement. That kind of negates the rest of your speculation.
 
Thanks for stating that out, however do note it was mearly a theorum.
However the same question could be asked about the properties, are they of the same universe? If they were able to generate a paradox would the output generate a duality? etc.

(Btw, I ask questions that I don't have answers and don't necessarily expect to hear any from anyone but if someone knows something it aids me to better understand the universe)
 
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I don't have the answers, but I think the research you are talking about was reported in Scientific American about three years ago. If you can track down a library copy you could learn a lot more there.

Or you could try reading Experimental and Theoretical Aspects of Quantum Teleortation here: http://www.ornl.gov/~webworks/cpr/pres/107480_.pdf
A somewhat more populist view can be found here: http://www.cakes.mcmail.com/StarTrek/teleportation.htm
And here is a summary of that SciAm article - it wasn't three years ago, but seven. (And it wasn't Australians, but Austrians.)http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=00014CBD-7633-1C76-9B81809EC588EF21&pageNumber=1&catID=4
 
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