Absolutely Nothing: Atheists on What They Know About What They Pretend to Discuss

[Jan Ardena]

Alex

Anyways. Did you enjoy the movie?
I thought it would have been more effective with an “mission impossible” type soundtrack.
Anyways. Let’s discuss it.

 

[Write4U]

continued;

Another way to think about life is as an emergent property of a collection of certain nonliving things. Both life and consciousness are examples of emergent complex systems. They each require a critical level of complexity or interaction to achieve their respective states. A neuron by itself, or even in a network of nerves, is not conscious—whole brain complexity is needed. Yet even an intact human brain can be biologically alive but incapable of consciousness, or “brain-dead.”

Similarly, neither cellular nor viral individual genes or proteins are by themselves alive. The enucleated cell is akin to the state of being braindead, in that it lacks a full critical complexity. A virus, too, fails to reach a critical complexity. So life itself is an emergent, complex state, but it is made from the same fundamental, physical building blocks that constitute a virus. Approached from this perspective, viruses, though not fully alive, may be thought of as being more than inert matter: they verge on life.

Impact on Evolution

Debates over whether to label viruses as living lead naturally to another question: Is pondering the status of viruses as living or nonliving more than a philosophical exercise, the basis of a lively and heated rhetorical debate but with little real consequence? I think the issue is important, because how scientists regard this question infl uences their thinking about the mechanisms of evolution.

Viruses have their own, ancient evolutionary history, dating to the very origin of cellular life. For example, some viral- repair enzymes—which excise and resynthesize damaged DNA, mend oxygen radical damage, and so on— are unique to certain viruses and have existed almost unchanged probably for billions of years...... more.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/are-viruses-alive-2004/

 

[billvon]

You’re blatantly being dishonest.
Here’s the rest of the paragraph you didn’t show

Still waiting for your answer.

To remind you, that was a question, not a statement - so it can't be dishonest. So what, specifically, is baloney? Radiocarbon dating? Oxygen isotope dating? Comparative anatomy? Physics? Geology? What, specifically, are you denying? All those are not hypotheses, they are fields of science.

Great! So now you have to be an expert in branches of science, to know the truth. If you’re not an expert, then you have to accept what the experts say, as true?

You are getting there! Yes, experts know more than you. You can become an expert too if you like, and a great many people do. Then you will understand what they do. That is a good goal.

So they can say anything, and it has to be accepted. That’s indoctrination.

That's education.

And no, it doesn't have to be accepted. Come up with a better theory and you'll win a Nobel prize. But 'it was a God-zap! Really! And you're stupid if you don't take that on blind faith!' is not a better theory.

Skinks aren’t snakes.

That particular skink evolved INTO a snake - specifically a limbless reptile that moves by slithering. Sorta blows your "one thing can't evolve into another thing" right out of the water, doesn't it? Sorry about that.

https://www.livescience.com/3053-evolution-action-lizards-losing-limbs.html

 

[Jan Ardena]

Still waiting for your answer.

Your question has nothing to do wit what we’re discussing.

To remind you, that was a question, not a statement - so it can't be dishonest.

You are sneaking in the idea that darwinism, and those animals turning into whales, are scientific facts. So far you’ve given absolutely nothing to indicate that it s so. So stick to the topic, and remain honest.

You are getting there!

And you need to wake up.

Yes, experts know more than you.

In their particular field of expertise, yes.
But they don’t necessarily know more than me, in general, outside of their field.

You can become an expert too if you like, and a great many people do. Then you will understand what they do. That is a good goal.

It’s not necessarily a good goal.

That's education.

No. That’s indoctrination, which is the process of teaching a person or group to accept a set of beliefs uncritically. Forcing people to learn darwinism, Is indoctrination because as everyone here has demonstrated, there is absolutely no evidence that hippos turn into whales, other than an imaginary story.
If Mary Schweitzer knows what’s good for her career, she’d best choose her words carefully, when talking about dinosaur soft tissue.

That particular skink evolved INTO a snake - specifically a limbless reptile that moves by slithering.

Stop lying.

 

[iceaura]

You are sneaking in the idea that darwinism, and those animals turning into whales, are scientific facts.

You don't know what you are talking about when you talk about "darwinism". Neither does anyone else.

The evolutionary sequence from earlier ancestors to living whales is unusually well documented.

Forcing people to learn darwinism, Is indoctrination

Darwinian evolution is one of the basic theories of biological science. Anyone who wants to learn biology (or a biological science, such as medicine) has to learn it because it's fundamental in their field, just as anyone who wants to learn physics or a related science has to learn Newton's Laws of Motion.

which is the process of teaching a person or group to accept a set of beliefs uncritically.

No one expects anyone to learn, let alone "accept", Darwinian evolutionary theory uncritically - that probably isn't even possible, with any scientific theory.

there is absolutely no evidence that hippos turn into whales, other than an imaginary story.

There is plenty of evidence that hippos and whales share a common ancestor not too long ago (lots of fossils of exactly the right type and sequence, genetic correlations of the right kinds, etc.). What is this weird language of "hippos turning into whales"? Nobody claims that hippos turned into whales.

In their particular field of expertise, yes.
But they don’t necessarily know more than me, in general, outside of their field.
- - - -
If Mary Schweitzer knows what’s good for her career, she’d best choose her words carefully, when talking about dinosaur soft tissue.

That is Mary Schweitzer's particular field of expertise. It isn't yours. You planning on taking your own advice any time soon?

 

[kx000]

If faith tells the truth, skepticism tells the lies. No matter what faith is just as valid scientifically as skepticism. And you would know that.

 

[Write4U]

If faith tells the truth, skepticism tells the lies. No matter what faith is just as valid scientifically as skepticism. And you would know that.

That is a completely incoherent statement.....

 

[paddoboy]

That window is only open to folk like yourself.
That you don’t respect me is a good thing. It means I am not infected with darwinitist delusionaria.

Respect is earned Jan, and I have good reason for having none for you...One of course being that previously I did offer an olive branch for us both to cease insults, and as per all the reputable links you have been given, and the actual personal accounts from the likes of James and Billvon, you either ignored them and/or purposely misinterpreted them.
You have been 100% shown to be a liar and redefining words to suit your agenda, and then demand we must all jump through your hoops when you act all pretentious crying that we cant answer your questions when you have absolutely no intention in the world of accepting any answer anyway.
You are a charlatan and a fraud Jan, but that obviously fits in with your standards of belief.

 

[paddoboy]

I already told you. You can’t believe what you want. You can accept what you want, then in time you may to believe what you accept.
You believe in stuff you have no idea of, and stuff that isn’t true, because you reject your creator, God. You need to keep accepting it, so you can eventually believe it, so you don’t have to believe in God.
You hate God.

Alex

Anyways. Did you enjoy the movie?
I thought it would have been more effective with an “mission impossible” type soundtrack.
Anyways. Let’s discuss it.

Love the above two posts from Jan...One shows desperation and being painted into a corner, the other another attempt to change the subject matter.

 

[paddoboy]

Your question has nothing to do wit what we’re discussing.

Another example of a poor attempt at redefining a statement.

You are sneaking in the idea that darwinism, and those animals turning into whales, are scientific facts.

Darwinism and the theory of evolution are undoubtedly fact.

So far you’ve given absolutely nothing to indicate that it s so. So stick to the topic, and remain honest.

Another example of lies from Jan and the pot/kettle syndrome he badly suffers from.

And you need to wake up.

Remember Jan previously whinging to James and playing the victim re insults he has received from others in this thread.
There we have the pot/kettle syndrome played out again.

In their particular field of expertise, yes.
But they don’t necessarily know more than me, in general, outside of their field.

Your peers on this forum will be the judge of that.

No. That’s indoctrination, which is the process of teaching a person or group to accept a set of beliefs uncritically. Forcing people to learn darwinism, Is indoctrination because as everyone here has demonstrated, there is absolutely no evidence that hippos turn into whales, other than an imaginary story.

More lies, more misinterpretations, and more pt/kettle syndrome.

If Mary Schweitzer knows what’s good for her career, she’d best choose her words carefully, when talking about dinosaur soft tissue.

Mary is the expert and has made her findings along with her learned colleagues, as dictated by the scientific method. You are an also ran that lacks the knowledge, the logic and any respect and are confined thankfully, to a remote forum where in time your nonsensical inane comments will be lost in cyber space.

Stop lying.

Words are cheap Jan, and I have already given the proof of you being the liar as well as redefining of words.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

No.
The question is there.

In that case I refuse to answer your question on the grounds it will incriminate you.

Jan what do you need with more answers, you have your good book it has an answer for everything...how to manage your slaves, where to take your unruly child to be put to death by stoning, what size stick you can beat your wife with....

You sound like a stuck record.

Thank you... that is some indication you are at least reading my message..how do you hear my written words? Hmmm auditory halucination ...we all know what that is a symptom of hmmm and then there is the imaginary friend thing ..it's pretty clear why you have the ego issues... but at least try to stop projecting your flaws onto others for now at least until you recover from your severe crushing.

What is it like to not have a mind of your own?

Inconvenient and there is never any room for me to put my stuff....oh wait are you talking to yourself now?

You can’t believe what you want. You can accept what you want, then in time you may to believe what you accept.

Thank you for sharing your personal experience as a cult member it's a pity that you can't escape...it sounds terrible.

You believe in stuff you have no idea of, and stuff that isn’t true,

First projecting your flaws onto others, now here you are talking to yourself ...I wasn't sure but it is clear that..Paddos crushing has done more damage than I first thought...next you will be talking to an imaginary friend...oh I get it now it's your imaginary friend you are showing this thread to...you poor thing.

because you reject your creator

And now you are babbling ...I did tell you that you can't reject something until it's existence has been established, there is no point in rejecting the Easter bunny, Santa etc there is no need.

You hate God.

I don't hate anything least of all mythical characters or are you talking to yourself again?

Did you enjoy the movie?

I certainly did enjoy it...I gave that post a like.

I thought it would have been more effective with an “mission impossible” type soundtrack.

Subtle as a brick to the head.
I think some realistic splashing sounds, a little bit of barking maybe better still an uplifting hyme...who do we thank for such a profound cartoon...what a great way to help young minds grasp the science of Evolution.

Let’s discuss it.

Some other time ..your hands are obviously full at the moment....coping with your recovery.

Alex

 

[Jan Ardena]

Another example of a poor attempt at redefining a statement.

How so?

Darwinism and the theory of evolution are undoubtedly fact.

No they’re not.

Remember Jan previously whinging to James and playing the victim re insults he has received from others in this thread.

Not true.
James can confirm that when he returns.
Neither did I send any subliminal messages for anyone to be band, in any of my responses.
I regard that as particularly low, and suspect.

Your peers on this forum will be the judge of that.

Most of them are biased like yourself, so I wouldn’t put any trust in their judgements.

More lies, more misinterpretations, and more pt/kettle syndrome.

So why don’t you explain why you think it is a misinterpretation and a lie?

Words are cheap Jan, and I have already given the proof of you being the liar as well as redefining of words.

You have no proof.
I easily defeated your claims. So much so that you just ignored my post and carried on with the same accusations.

Notice I didn’t accuse you of anything in this post. No name calling or insults.
I just responded to your post.
Let’s see if you really did offer an olive branch, as you said in your previous post, and just respond to what I said.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Love the above two posts from Jan...One shows desperation and being painted into a corner, the other another attempt to change the subject matter.

More like he was standing in the corner when they poured the slab.

But wasnt it a great little cartoon so useful to introduce young folk to the science of Evolution, I can see why Jan liked it as it would have been much more managble for him. I like it so much I think I will watch it again.

Folk better not let their dogs swim too long in the ocean I guess.

I wonder is there one for monkeys turning into humans or humans turning into monkeys ... a cartoon would be a great way to introduce the concept of common ancestor...

I like Jan he is just so funny the poor thing.

Alex

 

[Jan Ardena]

Thank you for sharing your personal experience as a cult member it's a pity that you can't escape...it sounds terrible.

Alex, what’s wrong?

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Alex, what’s wrong?

Just everything Jan.
I have been so worried about the Christians in USA putting themselves and the wider community at risk, as you know I respect their beliefs but I do think they should follow the government directives as the bible sets out most clearly.
Alex

 

[paddoboy]

How so?

It had everything to do with what is being discussed and support for Darwinism and the theory of evolution. Stop playing the fool.

No they’re not.

Yes they are.

Not true.
James can confirm that when he returns.
Neither did I send any subliminal messages for anyone to be band, in any of my responses.
I regard that as particularly low, and suspect.

Hmmm, Just as I have shown you to have lied previously, or maybe its a case of dementia, it appears we have another similar denial again. Gee Jan go easy with me, I hate having to go back searching as I am a lazy bastard, but in your case I'll show again how you either lie, or are simply demented. The following....

Not in relation to how these guys converse.
You wouldn’t bring a knife to a gunfight. Would you?

Not if they openly display it.
And the above analogy still stands.
In fact it stands for all the points you bring up.
Why don’t you pull them up publicly for their behaviour?

The idea of such minds become the powerfully dominant, is a very frightening prospect. It will be the end of reason. They will have no remorse, just as they constantly display here. Truth will be a patented commodity.
I may just create a new thread going into more detail of this hypothetical phantasmagoric future.

Most of them are biased like yourself, so I wouldn’t put any trust in their judgements.

Yaeh we know...the whole world is biased except me!! And while they may have laughed at Galilleo, they also laughed at Ja.. sorry I mean Bozo the clown.

So why don’t you explain why you think it is a misinterpretation and a lie?

Already explained and three examples given supporting that fact.

You have no proof.

None that you are capable of understanding obviously, and none that will crack your gullible fear of the unknown and sky daddy mythical remedy.

I easily defeated your claims. So much so that you just ignored my post and carried on with the same accusations.

More pot/kettle/black syndrome again!

Notice I didn’t accuse you of anything in this thread. No name calling or insults.
I just responded to post.

If you call lying and playing the ignorant fool responding.

Let’s see if you really did offer an olive branch, as you said in your previous post, and just respond to what I said.

How many times do you really need to be told Jan? I'm not jumping through your hoops, and particularly since all your questions have been answered, and you once again, are being less then sincere and honest.

 

[Jan Ardena]

It had everything to do with what is being discussed and support for Darwinism and the theory of evolution.

Go back and read it again.
He asked me those question independently of his claim. Their only relationship to darwinism was a sneaky assumption that darwinism was a scientific fact.

Yes they are.

Then we have to agree to disagree.

Yaeh we know...the whole world is biased except me!! And while they may have laughed at Galilleo, they also laughed at Ja.. sorry I mean Bozo the clown.

How are those exerts proof of me running to James about being insulted?

lready explained and three examples given supporting that fact.

You said earlier you wanted a truce in the insults. I am not insulting you, and I am responding to your posts in a proper manner.
I honestly don’t know what you’re talking about, when you say you’ve explained 3 times.
So why not start, and explain it to me without the need for insults, so we can discuss it and move on. Is that a reasonable request?

None that you are capable of understanding obviously, and none that will crack your gullible fear of the unknown and sky daddy mythical remedy.

Really?
Come on man.
We’re both grown men men.
Let’s act mature, and have a discussion,

How many times do you really need to be told Jan? I'm not jumping through your hoops, and particularly since all your questions have been answered, and you once again, being less then sincere and honest.

Fair enough.
If that’s how you want to see it, there’s not much I can do about that.

 

[paddoboy]

You are getting there! Yes, experts know more than you. You can become an expert too if you like, and a great many people do. Then you will understand what they do. That is a good goal.

That's education.

It’s not necessarily a good goal.
.

And there we have it Ladies and Gentlemen...remain ignorant, dumb, gullible, and forever deny the finality of death, and instead pretend a forever in heaven or in the case of evil Atheists, hell

 

[paddoboy]

Go back and read it again.
He asked me those question independently of his claim. Their only relationship to darwinism was a sneaky assumption that darwinism was a scientific fact.

Don't make me laugh! I have already been subject to your redefining of statements and purposeful lying. This is just a continuation of that.

Then we have to agree to disagree.

Yep, but at least Ihave science and the scientific method on my side, rather then unevidenced mythical claims.

How are those exerts proof of me running to James about being insulted?

So English is your second language? Or is this more redefining?

You said earlier you wanted a truce in the insults. I am not insulting you, and I am responding to your posts in a proper manner.

Yes, but I expected some honesty also.

I honestly don’t know what you’re talking about, when you say you’ve explained 3 times.

Sorry Jan, I'm sick of repeating myself. Lets just say that redefining Atheism to imply god exists is dumb, real dumb.

Really?
Come on man.
We’re both grown men men.
Let’s act mature, and have a discussion,

I find that difficult with you at this time, due to the reasons I have stated.

Fair enough.
If that’s how you want to see it, there’s not much I can do about that.

Jan, go back 4 or 5 pages...read all the posts and interactions between you, and I. If you are honest, you will recognise that you have changed definitions, and/or lied on at least three occasions that I have listed specifically.

 

[Jan Ardena]

And there we have it Ladies and Gentlemen...remain ignorant, dumb, gullible, and forever deny the finality of death, and instead pretend a forever in heaven or in the case of evil Atheists, hell

Rather than act like this, why don’t we have a discussion?
I’m sorry that I don’t feel the hurt and humiliation that you are intending to project.
You said earlier you extended an olive branch, is that offer still on the table?