A refrain...(warning! christian thought!)

M

Mr. Hamtastic

whackawhackado!
Registered Senior Member
I have to say, I did not intend to come to a science forum to debate theology. I have been surprised by the intensity of the debates here. I would like to take a moment to explain my position, and why I am now going to apologize.

I am afraid I have given the impression that I am overjoyed to suggest that in my belief system some choices lead to damnation. I am not overjoyed. It is with sorrow that I say this. I have tried to answer questions honestly, perhaps I have failed to do this. As far as I know I have answered them honestly.

I came to sciforums from googling a philosophical question: Can reality be proven to exist? I had a terrific time having this philosophical discussion and sought to explore the board further. I have posited thoughts on AI and the notion of a planetary government. I saw the religion category and suddenly I found my basic belief system under attack. I felt I was justified in attempting to stand in its defense, and to suggest that God/No god cannot be proven.

I then sought to open another thought in free thinking, where I was responded to with this:

Do everyone a favour and look up the world 'prove'. Then, go and read The Bible.

*sigh* I had high hopes that such closed-mindedness would not exist on a board for scientific discussion. I respect the belief that there is no God. I respect the belief in "flying undetectable wooly mammoths generating wind", if that is what you choose to believe. If you ask me if I find that God did/ordered X horrible, I will say no. I have no response when my God is labeled as "a dick" or a "cold-blooded ego-centric despot". This is my God you are talking about and I can't help but feel compelled to come to His defense. Not because he is not able to defend himself, but because perhaps by standing in his stead I can defer some of his judgement.

Therefore, I apologize if I have not respected your beliefs in some way. I would like to pursue other discussion, but so long as my God is under attack, I have trouble doing so. I will be posting here less frequently, and I may let some threads go merrily down whatever path they are going to. I only ask to be treated with the same respect you feel is due you. I would request that you do not attack my God with unnecessary name calling, or suggest you have some unseen 'evidence' that my God does not exist.

I will respect your belief/lack of belief if you will respect mine.

Also I didn't know where to post this that those I may have offended would hopefully see it. If this is in error I invite it to be moved to an appropriate space.
 
Mr. Hamtastic:

Please ignore the impolite posters here. Inability to debate without personal attacks is most likely a sign of a weak position or inability to argue the point.
 
Mr. Hamtastic said:
I have tried to answer questions honestly, perhaps I have failed to do this. As far as I know I have answered them honestly.
Click to expand...

Yes, you have for the most part. Thanks.

And don't worry too much that your god is arguably the most unpleasant character in all of fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomanical, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.

He simply can't help himself. ;)
 
James R said:
Mr. Hamtastic:

Please ignore the impolite posters here. Inability to debate without personal attacks is most likely a sign of a weak position or inability to argue the point.
Click to expand...

It has nothing to do with an inability to debate. It's ennui brough on by seeing the same old stuff over and over.
 
Mr. Hamtastic said:
I have to say, I did not intend to come to a science forum to debate theology. I have been surprised by the intensity of the debates here. I would like to take a moment to explain my position, and why I am now going to apologize.
Click to expand...
for what?:confused:
I am afraid I have given the impression that I am overjoyed to suggest that in my belief system some choices lead to damnation. I am not overjoyed. It is with sorrow that I say this. I have tried to answer questions honestly, perhaps I have failed to do this. As far as I know I have answered them honestly.
Click to expand...
hey its your belief you have right to defend it.
I came to sciforums from googling a philosophical question: Can reality be proven to exist? I had a terrific time having this philosophical discussion and sought to explore the board further. I have posited thoughts on AI and the notion of a planetary government. I saw the religion category and suddenly I found my basic belief system under attack. I felt I was justified in attempting to stand in its defense, and to suggest that God/No god cannot be proven.
Click to expand...
thats whats 4ums 4
I then sought to open another thought in free thinking, where I was responded to with this:

Do everyone a favour and look up the world 'prove'. Then, go and read The Bible.
Click to expand...
wont work its called

circular reasoning: stating in one's proposition that which one aims to prove. (e.g. God exists because the Bible says so; the Bible exists because God influenced it.)

heres more ,read and learn
http://www.nobeliefs.com/fallacies.htm
*sigh* I had high hopes that such closed-mindedness would not exist on a board for scientific discussion.
Click to expand...
Ive noticed that closeminds are mainly the religionist's
I respect the belief that there is no God. I respect the belief in "flying undetectable wooly mammoths generating wind", if that is what you choose to believe. If you ask me if I find that God did/ordered X horrible, I will say no. I have no response when my God is labeled as "a dick" or a "cold-blooded ego-centric despot". This is my God you are talking about and I can't help but feel compelled to come to His defense. Not because he is not able to defend himself, but because perhaps by standing in his stead I can defer some of his judgement.
Click to expand...
we call them as we see them,and your god as described in the bible is NOT very loving,

www.evilbible.com
Therefore, I apologize if I have not respected your beliefs in some way. I would like to pursue other discussion, but so long as my God is under attack, I have trouble doing so.
Click to expand...
god is not under attack,your faith is,
 
I think you misread my post . I posited a thought that the Reality could not be proven to exist. The response was: Do everyone a favour and look up the world 'prove'. Then, go and read The Bible.

as for the rest.. ok :)
 
I am recusing(sp?) myself from further posting in the Religion forum. Not that my belief is in jeopardy, more that I need to learn a new-noncircular way of reasoning.
 
Mr. Hamtastic said:
I am recusing(sp?) myself from further posting in the Religion forum. Not that my belief is in jeopardy, more that I need to learn a new-noncircular way of reasoning.
Click to expand...

Therein lies the problem. Any reasoning you apply to the argument of your gods existence will always be circular, and will come full circle back round to the fact that you simply choose to believe.

You have two options:

1) Intellectual dishonesty

2) Demonstrate your gods existence
 
Mr. Hamtastic said:
I respect the belief that there is no God.
Click to expand...

See, with a statement like this you betray your belief system, you betray your God, and everyone else too.

You don't seem to see the extent of the effects that declaring your particular belief system has on others:

You can't just come here and declare belief in a god who will eternally damn everyone who doesn't think and do as you say should be done. By declaring such belief, you have declared a war to everyone who doesn't think the way you do. So don't expect these others to be courteous or respectful.

Beliefs aren't simply a cloak one can don and take off at will. They are something serious. Some people take them very seriously.

Moreover, by declaring belief in God, you also state that you are not a run-of-the-mill person anymore. You thereby imply that you have a happiness greater than run-of-the-mill people; that you are more patient than run-of-the-mill people; that you are stronger and more resourceful than run-of-the-mill people. And probably some more.

If you come forward and state that you believe in God, expect to take responsibility for all this might imply.
After all, you have declared belief in the Maker and Maintainer of the Universe, the Lord and Ruler over all there is.
It's time you realize that this is no small thing to declare.
 
I respect people, not beliefs. Some beliefs are not worthy of much respect (and some people aren't, but to a much lesser degree then their beliefs).
 
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