A new concept on a Gravity powered Machine(Non-Perpetual)

Absolutely Wrong Trippy,
god will read this:

Now notice that this cannot be achieved when such a overcommable resistance gradient occurs only with respect to time vertically.In other words,you need your system to be in a cyclic circular path OR in other words the gradient should occur in a continous circular cyclic path.

I have developed a mechanism to achieve this cyclic process but it's a secret until It is published in official gazette.Actual engine will not use powder ok:::this is just an analogy.
So prove it.

Convince us.

Show us the maths, based on a generic engine cycle, that demonstrates that this is a functional reality, rather than over-looked terms in an equation.

Incidentally, editing your post an hour after it was posted, and after it has been replied to in a way that substantially alters its content or meaning is at best poor form.

I will not be going back and re-reading it.
I will not be addressing any new points added subsequent to my reply.
 
Trippy said:
because it takes work (the application of energy) to lift the ball in the first place. The work done in lifting the ball is exactly the same as the GPE that gets converted into KE in the first place.

Not always!!! It depends on the approach you are using.

Yes always. There are no clever mathematical tricks that let you remove potential energy from one side of the cycle and not the other.

I will proove you wrong. Let us discuss my that another idea on gravity engine. For example,If there is a 1 kg of solid powder to be lifted upwards,I need X amount of work done upwards.If I have to push 2 Kg of solid powder downwards,I need to consume X plus X (2X)amount of Gravitational energy. Net energy consumed = 2 X -X =X

Yes, sort of. You need twice the energy to lift twice the weight - so the energy consumed PER KG of powder is always the same. That means that you can't do clever tricks to get more energy back later.

However, if you are "pushing" the powder downwards, rather than letting it descend and recovering the energy, you are using energy in both directions - and thus you always lose energy.

I have developed a mechanism to achieve this cyclic process but it's a secret until It is published in official gazette.Actual engine will not use powder ok:::this is just an analogy.

Ah, the old "I have a secret formula that I won't tell you!" angle. Always a fun one.
 
Moderator: The "Electric cars are a pipe dream" thread was a useful and quite long thread before Aman shah and sigurdV appeared and started filling it with crap. Please clean it up and transfer their nonsense to the cesspool, where it belongs.
 
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... I have the right tech to invent a Gravity powered charger and yes it is not a PMM please. ...
True it is not a PPM. It is an "over unity" device and they all violate conservation of energy law so the patent office just immediately throws them in the trash.

PPM is not impossible in principle but over unity devices are. - Super conductive currents flow without friction losses. Electrons orbiting nuclei in ground state, and a completely isolated sun with a single distant planet orbiting it are all examples of PPM.
 
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A thread on this same topic has already been closed. The so called gravity engine in is based on the OP's misunderstanding of basic phyics. Please close it again.
 
Equations!

If you have read the explanation below the sketch on Flickr correctly and fully,
You will find a balanced energy equation for its analogy described there :

Energy supplied to lift Red ball through commutator controlled motor mode at pivot + gravitational energy required to push the resistance away + frictional losses + other entropy losses = supplied energy recovered though generator mode by commutator control at pivot(red coloured in sketch) + electricity converted from overcoming of resistance+ frictional losses + Back EMF losses + other entropy losses.

So you told patents are not given!Yes obviously,if you try to create a machine which violates laws of thermodynamics,who will give you a patent?

My technology is already tested and occurs in nature,the only problem being reducing the frictional losses.

All people are not of same kind,if they have failed because they were illogical in their science fictional work,it doesnot mean that every attempt will fail.
If you are logical,you will never fail.All other attempts failed because the people were stupidly trying to generate New Energy or were trying to make more output than input which is Illogical and funny,laughable.

Converting gravitational energy into another form of energy is also not laws of thermodynamics.
Energy can never be destroyed or created but can be converted from one form to another.
This idea got 1st prंize in few intercollege science fests.

A thread on this same topic has already been closed. The so called gravity engine in is based on the OP's misunderstanding of basic phyics. Please close it again.
Why not close the job of scientists?

Actually you are misunderstanding physics.
I even doubt that you anything about creep,stress,strain,machenism of failure of simply supported beams,etc.

Just a recap of what I mentioned on Flickr:
Hi guys,here is my analogous example of a very heavy weight red ball hanging,to explain a single cycle of my gravity engine working principle.

The splashing water on right side indicates how gravity is used to overcome water resistance,and convert gravitational energy in to splashing of water which is analogous to converted net electrical output of my engine.
The more the weight of ball,the more the resistance overcomed.

Energy is only supplied here to lift the ball up and recovered when ball comes down.It is comprising of half cycle motor and half cycle generator located at red pivot,controlled by a commutator.

Here also two downward processes occur simultaneously:

(1) recovery of supplied energy to lift the red ball through half cycle Generator mode of Motor Cum Generator at red shown Pivot.

(2)The conversion of Gravitational energy in to electrical usable energy due to Overcommable weight obstacle resistance by the gravitational energy acting for more time by slowing the downward process. (Assume that you use water turbine to convert energy consumed in splashing of water into electricity for eliminating confussion).

Note that water resistance is present only on right at downward motion of ball and not on left.

The commutator changes it’s circuit coils orientation so that during upward process you lift ball and during downward process you recover supplied energy .

The idea behind the overcommable resistance is to extend time spent by gravity to act on a heavy object/ball by a few nanoseconds due to the slowing down of the heavy ball speed due to resistance offered.The more the time gravity acts at a particular height(H=H1),the more the gravity energy gained to overcome resistance (splashing the water resistance in analogous example given) as well to rotate the half cycle generator rotor.

That was just an Very similar analogy,actual engine will be actually completely different but will work on same principle.The resistance element will be like elastic like overcommable solid,but not fluid in my original design.

I have discussed only Analogous example(Basic concept) on Flickr only due to initial Patent law compatibility.I would have revealed the whole engine design itself instead of analogy BUT ;;;
(A)"A patent document is published in Official gazette for public Opposition and further legal processing ONLY if the idea is novel AND it is never and not at all published anywhere else."—This is what patent law says.
(B)Not only this,any body can copy the invention and patent it before you if you disclose it without publication in patent office. "

"Analogy is a cognitive process of transferring information or meaning from a particular subject (the analogue or source) to another particular subject (the target)"

What is strange is “Why nobody else pointed out about such a mechanical resistance before which can be overcomed by gravitational force.”
If you still have confussion open any “mechanics of material “textbooks and study how materials and weight offer resistance.This resistance occurs due to weight of the fluid.This type of resistance can also occur due to solid body weight.

So,what my engine does is tap the energy required to go against the resistance by the gravity.

Balance energy equation for my concept:

Energy supplied to lift Red ball through commutator controlled motor mode at pivot + gravitational energy required to push the resistance away + frictional losses + other entropy losses = supplied energy recovered though generator mode by commutator control at pivot(red coloured in sketch) + electricity converted from overcoming of resistance+ frictional losses + Back EMF losses + other entropy losses.

It’s also right if said theoratically that “energy supplying and recovery process “is just like a or analogous to a catalyst,which is used to let the resistance overcomming process through gravity take place without actually any net change of electrical energy form/format from one form to another form of energy.The energy used to overcome resistance is then converted to electrical energy by a suitable energy conversion system.

Limitation of the example/Analogy discussed here:

The analogy only explains a single complete cycle of the engine in comparison to Continuous repeating cycle of the actual engine.
Water is not used in actual engine due to efficiency problems of water turbine energy conversion processes.Water splashing is turbulent and blades opposite reaction of blades to the water striking offers lot of losses.So some other much much more efficient Solid elastic type resistance system is used in actual engine.

Elaboration of my idea in brief:

The criteria for resistance system in my engine is:

1) first of all it should be overcommable.
2) it should be present only downwards and not upward.
3) The resistance system should be highly/reasonably efficient(output by input)
4) Amount of overcommable resistance should be reasonably large enough.

If the resistance cannot satisfy these conditions,then it cannot be used in my engine.

The splashing of water resistance (overcomming of water resistance)is quiet similar to the Overcomming of cantilever beam resistance by the central weight loading.The machenism of failure of two column supported beam(Simply supported beam) works similarly.Let weight W be loaded at centre.The overcomeability of a good beam should be less at initial stage.Initially there will be allmost an equal and opposite reaction from the beam for the weight loading,with little energy spent for deformation.Slowly ATOMIC Dislocation takes place(slippage of atomic planes/slippage of grain boundaries)and a point reaches where stress become unbearable(stress is resistance to deformation).As the stress become unbearable,there will be minimum equal and opposite reaction for the weight loading and then the most amount of continuous gravitational energy will be used to overcome this beam resistance/stress and finally the beam breaks.This is analogous to what happens in my engine with the exception of the speed at which all this happens.This is what I learnt in Material Science subject.No good material science Professor in machenical engineering would deny this.
The speed of this similar process is actually relatively fast,occurs in extended nanoseconds time in my engine whereas in beams it is very low speed [It occurs in beams due to mainly Creep.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creep_(deformation))

So my engine does not go against laws of physics.In fact what I have told here about mechanism of Creep due to stress becoming unbearable is the backbone of structural engineering and the first question for an interview could be “how beams fail under self weight load and external weight load.”My technology does not bend physics but uses it in a altogether different way.

It is like removing some upward resistance and hence you do not find water in left semi bowl in the analogous example(The resistance system is water in Rightside of semi bowl coupled to a energy converter water turbine.).

For example,If there is a 1 kg of solid powder to be lifted upwards,I need X amount of work done upwards.If I have to push 2 Kg of solid powder downwards,I need to consume X plus X (2X)amount of Gravitational energy.

Net energy consumed = 2 X -X =X
Which is then converted to Net electrical energy Output.This is what one of the way of satisfacting the Principle,

Mostly real Gravity engines should work on the principle that the Gravity engine/Gravity wheel systems are innovatively designed to take in (consume) much more Gravitational energy than what energy needed to lift heavy ball upward.

Now notice that this cannot be achieved when such a overcommable resistance gradient occurs only with respect to time vertically.In other words,you need your system to be in a cyclic circular path OR in other words the gradient should occur in a circular cyclic path.

Well reality is always nonsense:The way galileo's theory was a nonsense to the church priest,similarly my theory is nonsense to you.If you think,my concept is not correct,ban me.As I know,all good technologies are being suppresed like this.Atleast I am not so worst as the members at Bessler Wheels Forum (http://www.besslerwheel.com/) who are trying to make PMM and who have worst knowledge in physics.Members at bessler wheels forums were indeed quite supportive but their knowledge in physics is really bad.Atleast 3 members started arguing with me that Efficiency can exceed one.
 
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Gravity acts on a body based on it's distance from the ground (I.E. F=G((m1xm2)/r^2) where r is the distance between the two objects). The horizontal length it travels has nothing to do with the force it imparts to the object. In fact, having the long ramp you speak of would give you LESS energy then just dropping the ball from the same height as you would loose energy to friction from the ramp and air resistance instead of just air resistance.
 
Gravity is continuous, and does not act only for one shot.

With refernce to analogous example on flickr(talking of water resistance,not about powder resistance and not talking about the another gravity engine concept discussed in the recently closed forum involving semicircular path),

The idea behind the overcommable resistance is to extend time spent by gravity to act on a heavy object/ball by a few nanoseconds due to the slowing down of the heavy ball speed due to resistance offered.The more the time gravity acts at a particular height(H=H1),the more the gravity energy gained to overcome resistance (splashing the water resistance in analogous example given) as well to rotate the half cycle generator rotor.

If this is nonsense then the concept of creep is also incorrect and then there will be no meaning of calculating weight loading in structures in complex engineering.

Every Material Science textbook will give same explanation on Creep which I have given above.That is:
"The machenism of failure of two column supported beam(Simply suppo..................resistance to deformation).As the stress become unbearable,there will be minimum equal and opposite reaction for the weight loading and then the most amount of continuous gravitational energy will be used to overcome this beam resistance/stress and finally the beam breaks."

But to understand what is creep,you should know the concepts of stress,dislocation,weight loading,etc which mechanical and civil engineers use daily.

Note that overcomming resistance comcept is similar to concept of creep with the exception that creep occurs over a very long time whereas the process of downward overcommable resistance occurs in simply extended nanoseconds time.

Also note that the Flickr webpage uploaded image shows Water resistance only on right side and not on left side.
 
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The more the time gravity acts at a particular height(H=H1),the more the gravity energy gained to overcome resistance

That's nonsense, as you've been told before. The time an object is at a particular height has nothing at all to do with it's gravitational potential.
 
What you think is nonsense.
If what you think is correct then Material science ,Mechanics of material,machine design textbooks have to be rewritten.
Gravity is continuously acting on a body,It does not act only for one shot.

If you you said is correct,then the concept of Creep is also NonSense and there will be no need to do any calculaton of weight loading over structures.And then there will be nothing like Atomic dislocations and no stress will be produced.
By the way do you know what is stress,atomic dislocation sue to slipping of atomic plane/ grain boundries and what is Creep?
Have you studied metallurgical material science?

If you hold any object by a hinged support continuously at a height(like a cantilever),will gravity act only for a single pulse on the object????

No No,it will act Continiously and hence there is a continuos opposite reaction force from the holder/hinged support and thus making the net further increase in P.E. to allmost zero.
<--------- |— -------->= 0

What if the speed of heavy attached ball to rod reduces for nanoseconds by trying to go against water resistance?

The more the time offered for ball to stay at a position,the more gravity acts on it.

The key to any gravity engine design is to somehow use gravity as energy input.

It's also right if said theoratically that "energy supplying and recovery process "is just like a or analogous to a catalyst,which is used to let the resistance overcomming process through gravity take place without actually any net change of electrical energy form/format from one form to another form of energy.The energy used to overcome resistance is then converted to electrical energy by a suitable energy conversion system.

The idea is using the gain in gravity immediately as the heavy ball pushes the overcommable resistance,instead of a static Non-Overcommable resistance.

To achieve this,the resistance used should be Overcommable and not 100 percent fixed.
 
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Gravity is continuous, and does not act only for one shot.

With refernce to analogous example on flickr(talking of water resistance,not about powder resistance and not talking about the another gravity engine concept discussed in the recently closed forum involving semicircular path),

The idea behind the overcommable resistance is to extend time spent by gravity to act on a heavy object/ball by a few nanoseconds due to the slowing down of the heavy ball speed due to resistance offered.The more the time gravity acts at a particular height(H=H1),the more the gravity energy gained to overcome resistance (splashing the water resistance in analogous example given) as well to rotate the half cycle generator rotor.

If this is nonsense then the concept of creep is also incorrect and then there will be no meaning of calculating weight loading in structures in complex engineering.

Every Material Science textbook will give same explanation on Creep which I have given above.That is:
"The machenism of failure of two column supported beam(Simply suppo..................resistance to deformation).As the stress become unbearable,there will be minimum equal and opposite reaction for the weight loading and then the most amount of continuous gravitational energy will be used to overcome this beam resistance/stress and finally the beam breaks."

But to understand what is creep,you should know the concepts of stress,dislocation,weight loading,etc which mechanical and civil engineers use daily.

Note that overcomming resistance comcept is similar to concept of creep with the exception that creep occurs over a very long time whereas the process of downward overcommable resistance occurs in simply extended nanoseconds time.

Also note that the Flickr webpage uploaded image shows Water resistance only on right side and not on left side.

F=G((m1xm2)/r^2 is continuous, it is all the energy you can get from height of r to the ground.
 
What you think is nonsense.
If what you think is correct then Material science ,Mechanics of material,machine design textbooks have to be rewritten.
Gravity is continuously acting on a body,It does not act only for one shot.

If you you said is correct,then the concept of Creep is also NonSense and there will be no need to do any calculaton of weight loading over structures.And then there will be nothing like Atomic dislocations and no stress will be produced.
By the way do you know what is stress,atomic dislocation sue to slipping of atomic plane/ grain boundries and what is Creep?
Have you studied metallurgical material science?

Have you studied basic physics? Because your posts say no....
 
Without studying physics,how will I get admitted to Bangalore's prestigious college?,be logical.

Note that this overcommable resistance process occurs at blink of an eye:very fast.
In the case of creep,it takes many years and consume lot of continuous gravitational energy acted on it.
 
What you think is nonsense.
If what you think is correct then Material science ,Mechanics of material,machine design textbooks have to be rewritten.
Gravity is continuously acting on a body,It does not act only for one shot.

If you you said is correct,then the concept of Creep is also NonSense and there will be no need to do any calculaton of weight loading over structures.And then there will be nothing like Atomic dislocations and no stress will be produced.
By the way do you know what is stress,atomic dislocation sue to slipping of atomic plane/ grain boundries and what is Creep?
Have you studied metallurgical material science?

If you hold any object by a hinged support continuously at a height(like a cantilever),will gravity act only for a single pulse on the object????

No No,it will act Continiously and hence there is a continuos opposite reaction force from the holder/hinged support and thus making the net further increase in P.E. to allmost zero.
<--------- |— -------->= 0

What if the speed of heavy attached ball to rod reduces for nanoseconds by trying to go against water resistance?

The more the time offered for ball to stay at a position,the more gravity acts on it.

The key to any gravity engine design is to somehow use gravity as energy input.

It's also right if said theoratically that "energy supplying and recovery process "is just like a or analogous to a catalyst,which is used to let the resistance overcomming process through gravity take place without actually any net change of electrical energy form/format from one form to another form of energy.The energy used to overcome resistance is then converted to electrical energy by a suitable energy conversion system.

The idea is using the gain in gravity immediately as the heavy ball pushes the overcommable resistance,instead of a static Non-Overcommable resistance.

To achieve this,the resistance used should be Overcommable and not 100 percent fixed.

Funny you mention civil engineering. My GF has a masters in civil engineering and she says your wrong. But again, go ahead and waste your money building this thing. When it doesn't work like your think don't say we didn't warn you.
 
Without studying physics,how will I get admitted to Bangalore's prestigious college?,be logical.

Note that this overcommable resistance process occurs at blink of an eye:very fast.
In the case of creep,it takes many years and consume lot of continuous gravitational energy acted on it.

Is that an online college or something?
 
She says that F=G((m1xm2)/r^2 and that it means you can't possibly get more work out dropping something then it takes to lift it. In fact you're going to lose energy on the drop due to air resistance, but anyone in high school could tell you that.
 
Moderator note: two threads on the same topic have been merged.

Usually, reposting a thread that has been closed by a moderator is taken to be overriding a moderator's edit, and results in a ban for the user reposting the thread. In this instance, we'll assume that you, Aman shah, weren't aware of the policy. But now you are.
 
Aman shah:

Let's remove gravity from your engine altogether. That way the dummies here can be taught what you are proposing. After all a gravity engine is a gravitational force engine is a force engine, right?

Give us a simpler source of force since we obviously don't understand gravity. How about a rubber band? It's easier for us to understand. Let's assume the average rubber band produces a force F = kx where k is something like the modulus of elasticity and x is the distance it's stretched.

Take a common household rubber band and install it in your gravity machine at the point where you have gravity producing the force. Connect your force machine to a 100 W light bulb and shoot a video of this bulb shining for 10 minutes. Put an analog clock in the picture so we can watch the hands turn. That will help the skeptics.

Come back tomorrow and post a link to your video. Then we can learn more from you after that on this thread.
 
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