Why does God need a church?

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spuriousmonkey

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Why does God need a Church?

Obviously someone is going to answer that people need a church, but is this really an answer? Could it not rather be a selfish act then of people to have a church? An act that would go against God?

And why does God need Rituals such as baptising and holy communion?

And why does god need priests, a pope, or whatever representative? At least the devil does his own work?

Some questions, are there some answers?
 
God needs nothing. Church, and all of it's functions, is simply a tool which has the goal of attaining perfect happiness (guided or misguided).
 
"TOOL"

I love that word.

A friend once told me, "Relgion is simpley a tool of the mind"

That is my 2 cents.
 
Why does God need a Church?

Obviously someone is going to answer that people need a church, but is this really an answer? Could it not rather be a selfish act then of people to have a church? An act that would go against God?
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1 Thessalonians 5:10-11 (New International Version)

10He died for us so that, whether we are awake or asleep, we may live together with him. 11Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.​

To exercise the commandment of love, people must be together.
 
Churches, rituals, priests, etc. are necessary tools to reinforce the idealism of god.

Funny though, they only seem to reinforce the idea that religion is man made.
 
Without the Church, Christianity would not have survived.

So was it the Church or God who saved Christianity?
 
Why would god need something he's given us? We can't give back what we have already been given.
 
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God doesn't need anything- everything we try to do is to please Him, not sustain His life.
 
Without the Church, Christianity would not have survived.
So was it the Church or God who saved Christianity?
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Southstar, God works through his church.

spuriousmonkey, the sacraments are singular ways of how God choose to express himself and his grace to us. Sure, he might have chosen other ways, but the sacraments, because they've been chosen by God, are the best way for us. I'd liken it to back when the Israelites were sacrificing to God everywhere. In the early time before Moses they were doing what was right for them, God knowing, but when the time changed God wanted them to sacrifice only at the temple. Theologically one might be able to say the Jews sacrificing at the temple was "better" than the Jews who sacrifice in the fields, and Christians could say our communion is "better" than the Jews, like the comparison between manna and Christ. But it's really not what's the best sacrifice but what's best in the light of God's plan.
 
Sure, he might have chosen other ways, but the sacraments, because they've been chosen by God, are the best way for us.

Ideally, that would stand to reason if each and every person on earth believed in one particular god - ie. clones of one another.

But each person is individual and synthesizes information differently, as can easily be verified by these forums. So, each person would require that which inevitably would be interpreted and equally understood in order to know the revealed plan. A simple task for an onmipotent god, yet each individuals interpretation is as idiosyncartic as the person themselves.

Clearly, those sacraments do not meet these requirements.
 
for me the church is like a tree in the wilderness.

people see the tree and they come and taste the fruit. some people like the fruit and they stay and eat some more,
share some with their friends.

others taste the fruit and find that it is sour and tell people not to eat the fruit nor even go near the tree.
and those people will find other trees which have fruit that they find find sweeter and it is there they will feel at home.

those other trees may be other churches, other beliefs, sciences, relationships,
whatever, they are ways people can come to understand themselves,
and this is why the church survives, even though in my opinion it is rotten to the core.
 
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Southstar, God works through his church.
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Do you then say God, without the church, cannot work? If not, how strikingly convenient that the Church offers frivolous comforts such as community and security, the very forms of things that people expect to recieve from God, the very ideals of Heaven.
 
Ideally, that would stand to reason if each and every person on earth believed in one particular god - ie. clones of one another.
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Q, no, it's not necessarily so. First, you have to take in to consideration that many will reject the sacraments. Others, by God's wish and desire, might not ever receive them in this life. Of course, the exact theology is a bit speculative here. Furtheremore, even those who do not directly participate or believe in the sacrament, might still benefit from the sacraments.


But each person is individual and synthesizes information differently, as can easily be verified by these forums. So, each person would require that which inevitably would be interpreted and equally understood in order to know the revealed plan.
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The sacraments convey grace not human knowledge, persay. Are you saying that different people receive grace differently? I believe that too. A person's grace received in the sacrament is God's choice and a person could receive none, though God's infinite grace is in each sacrament.


Do you then say God, without the church, cannot work? If not, how strikingly convenient that the Church offers frivolous comforts such as community and security, the very forms of things that people expect to recieve from God, the very ideals of Heaven.
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Southpark, it depends. In the usual definition of the word Church, salvation and the Church's existence is a tautology. If the Church is all those filled with Christ's grace, this grace being the definition of salvation, then the church follows logically from human salvation.
 
First, you have to take in to consideration that many will reject the sacraments. Others, by God's wish and desire, might not ever receive them in this life.

Neither of those statements makes any sense. Or is not making sense gods way?

If many reject them, then those sacraments are as flawed as the delivery. Why would anyone reject that which is clearly beneficial to them?

If your god had wishes and desires, he clearly is not omnipotent. And if his wishes and desires includes denying grace to whomever he chooses, he most certainly is a god lacking compassion.

Of course, the exact theology is a bit speculative here.

Don't you mean completely speculative?
 
If many reject them, then those sacraments are as flawed as the delivery. Why would anyone reject that which is clearly beneficial to them?
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Q, people reject God even though God is beneficial. Occasionally the person really doesn't want God. Othertimes, they've been trapped into wanting something more than God. In any case, people often do things not beneficial to them, for example, a smoker or a drug addict.

If your god had wishes and desires, he clearly is not omnipotent.
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How so? Are you claiming God couldn't have wishes and desires? The dilemna here is caused by imprecise language. God desires us to make free will decision, but he also desires us to choose him. The two cannot occur without free will. The second, however, is not certain. God doesn't desire for himself to force us to choose him.


And if his wishes and desires includes denying grace to whomever he chooses, he most certainly is a god lacking compassion.
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Sometimes people are not ready. God only gives what is best for us.
 
Are you claiming God couldn't have wishes and desires?

I would presume to claim anything about gods - how could I? How could anyone?
 
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