Who the hell advised Trum to bomb Syria?

Now that you understand that., can you understand why Trumps election has been so contentious and frightening globally and not just in the USA? ( Given his campaign rhetoric)
No, given that the campaign rhetoric of Trump was, in comparison with Clinton, much more peaceful. Clinton had war with Russia in her program, the only war which endangers mankind because it could escalate into a nuclear war. In Trumps campaign, the worst was war with Iran and economic war with China - stupid but not dangerous for mankind.

Ok, now Trump is doing what was Clinton's program, and this, indeed, becomes frightening globally. But somehow not to NATO governments, they like it, all.
 
Why hasn't Daesh used Sarin? Certainly they have no moral problems with it's use, so why haven't they used it?
They have used chemical weapons. No link ready now, so not clear what they have used, but have seen claims about this during the last days.
 
The Khan al-Assal chemical attack was a chemical attack in Khan al-Assal, Aleppo, Syria, on 19 March 2013, which according to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights resulted in at least 26 fatalities including 16 government soldiers and 10 civilians, and more than 86 injuries.[2]Immediately after the incident the Syrian government and opposition accused each other of carrying out the attack, but neither side presented clear documentation.[2][4][5] The Syrian government asked the United Nations to investigate the incident, but disputes over the scope of that investigation led to lengthy delays. In the interim, the Syrian government invited Russia to send specialists to investigate the incident. Samples taken at the site led them to conclude that the attack involved the use of sarin

..............................
?
 
The world asked for an investigation into the Malaysian air craft shoot down (Ukraine) too and look what happened to that...
We have had an investigation where Ukraine (the main suspect) had veto powers and Malaysia (the victim) had no saying at all. http://www.whathappenedtoflightmh17...-of-malaysia-of-the-joint-investigation-team/ We have got what one can expect from such a construction. Namely that the Ukraine is in no way suspect. :D
The situation in Syria can be resolved with just one sentence spoken by Assad. "I resign and call the country to UN monitored elections ASAP"
it would be that simple....
LOL. The result of this "resolve" would be the question who rules up to election time. Daesh? Al Qaida? Al Qaida renamed into FSA? What would be done with all the Alewites, Christians, Druses, and other non-Wahabis, if the Wahabis named FSA start to rule?
 
No, given that the campaign rhetoric of Trump was, in comparison with Clinton, much more peaceful. Clinton had war with Russia in her program, the only war which endangers mankind because it could escalate into a nuclear war. In Trumps campaign, the worst was war with Iran and economic war with China - stupid but not dangerous for mankind.

Ok, now Trump is doing what was Clinton's program, and this, indeed, becomes frightening globally. But somehow not to NATO governments, they like it, all.
What you mean comrade is Trump was more Putina friendly. That doesn't translate to more peaceful. Putina's repeated invasions of neighboring states and his participation in the gassing of Syrian children are far from peaceful.

What Putina wants from the US is a licence to continue its violence, and Putina believed Trump was most likely to give him that license. That's why Putina favored Trump.
 
We have had an investigation where Ukraine (the main suspect) had veto powers and Malaysia (the victim) had no saying at all. http://www.whathappenedtoflightmh17...-of-malaysia-of-the-joint-investigation-team/ We have got what one can expect from such a construction. Namely that the Ukraine is in no way suspect. :D

LOL. The result of this "resolve" would be the question who rules up to election time. Daesh? Al Qaida? Al Qaida renamed into FSA? What would be done with all the Alewites, Christians, Druses, and other non-Wahabis, if the Wahabis named FSA start to rule?
Quantum Quack is correct; Assad could end this fight in an instant by leaving office. But he hasn't and he won't, for the same reason Putina will never surrender power. If they do they become vulnerable to criminal prosecution. So the wars and the violence the foment continues. Moreover, Putina would never allow Assad to surrender without another Russia vassal to replace him. Both Assad and Trump are threatened by democracy and the truth.
 
Given that Trump is a pathological liar, you would have to be a fool to take him seriously.
Nobody claimed to take him seriously. Taking campaign promises seriously is stupid anyway. If not supported, as in the case of Clinton, a history of warmongering, which made her promises plausible.
He wanted to increase the war budget. You don't do that unless you want a war.
Not in modern times, where the main advantage of producing weapons for the state is that you do not have to produce anything worth its money. You don't need a war today to destroy them so that you have to build more of them. Technical progress destroys their value anyway in short time.
Nonsense.
You think a no-fly zone for Russian and Syrian airforce over Syrian territory is possible without war with Russia?
 
No.
Saddam's move to the Euro, recorded event. The weakening of the sanctions on Iraq and prospect of their falling apart - common knowledge. The role of the petrodollar - common knowledge. The domination of the US executive administration by oil and military interests - common knowledge. The nexus of: threat to the petrodollar/PNAC agenda/oil and industry profit motive - observation.
Is that last observation where you locate your doubts? They appear, superficially, to be derived from simple misreadings, so far in this thread.

All of this stuff was just ordinary and recognized and obvious possibility, at the time, in my crowd. It was the standard proposed explanation for W's push for invasion, the WMDs and terrorist links being obvious lies.

They were already, on their own, at the time, talking seriously about moving away from the dollar in concert with Saddam's move to the Euro. They have since done so, on their own - trading in Euros, in Yuan, etc. You can ask them about their motives, if you're puzzled - they don't seem all that mysterious to me.

They were at the time and until very recently subject to severe trade constraints, which limited their income and unilateral options while raising their production costs. That was due to change, to their advantage, if the petrodollar had been severely damaged by Saddam.
We'll see, going forward, now. Iraq's oil industry is under the US thumb still, but Iran's influence and options are increasing year by year.

No. KSA is dependent on the income stream in dollars and the US alliance for security, etc. The PNAC agenda of removing their choice in the matter depended on getting Iran and Iraq under thumb first.
That guy completely ignores the critical currency issue, as well as the production cost differential. And his comments on increases in production somehow overlook the sanctions - he talks as if Saddam were running at capacity as he spoke, with infrastructure in good repair and no constraints on trade, so that major increases in production would require new infrastructure and several years, while Iran, Russia, and China were apparently no factors at all.

That almost reads as deliberate deception - could he honestly have overloooked that kind of stuff?

The US did go to war, and did automatically and as predicted force its energy costs up by doing so - to the enormous profit of Exxon, Chevron, Halliburton, et al. I don't have to "believe" - I can read about in history books.
All you can read in your history books is that the oil price went up - as it obviously would. You cannot read that the US government went to war with the goal of increasing the oil price, in spite of the damage to its own economy, which is what you allege. I think this is pretty ridiculous, myself. I also think the article I quoted shows that Saddam, if he made any threats along the lines you suggest, would have been unable to do what you allege. Whether 3% of the world's supply is available or not, and if so whether it is sold in dollars or another currency, is not going to shake the dollar or the global oil trade, or make oil companies totter.

"The guy" I quote is actually an expert on the energy economy and business.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Yergin
You, however, do not offer any corroboration of your thesis, apart from ascribing base motives to the various officials involved. I suspect your comments about it being a common interpretation "in your crowd" says more about the echo chamber of the left than anything else. However if you can cite any reputable commentator who shares your view, I'd be happy to reconsider this judgement.
 
Fine, I see my "blog" it even helpful to understand that the "Declassified U.S. Report on Chemical Weapons Attack" starts with a lie:
We assess that Damascus launched this chemical attack in response to an opposition offensive in Northern Hamah province that threatened key infrastructure.
Compare with the map I have posted the day before, April 3., at my "blog":
C8fE3_gXcAAiSPp.jpg

You can see that at that time the danger to key infrastructure was already over. There was some danger - the whole purple area was controlled by the islamists, endangering Hama as well as encirclement of the Christian town Maharda - but the purple area was at that time already taken back by the government forces, leaving only the light blue one as a gain of the offensive. So, it was clear to everybody that the danger to any infrastructure was already over, and the offensive has failed.

The remaining parts are also nonsense, not more than polemics based on videos anybody can see in the web.
 
If not supported, as in the case of Clinton, a history of warmongering, which made her promises plausible.
She is experienced at statecraft, that was her job. Trump is vindictive and petty, and understands almost nothing about diplomacy, while practically worshiping the military.
You think a no-fly zone for Russian and Syrian airforce over Syrian territory is possible without war with Russia?
Yes. In the end Russia wants status and a good economy. They don't want an apocalypse.
 
Fine, I see my "blog" it even helpful to understand that the "Declassified U.S. Report on Chemical Weapons Attack" starts with a lie:

Compare with the map I have posted the day before, April 3., at my "blog":
C8fE3_gXcAAiSPp.jpg

You can see that at that time the danger to key infrastructure was already over. There was some danger - the whole purple area was controlled by the islamists, endangering Hama as well as encirclement of the Christian town Maharda - but the purple area was at that time already taken back by the government forces, leaving only the light blue one as a gain of the offensive. So, it was clear to everybody that the danger to any infrastructure was already over, and the offensive has failed.

The remaining parts are also nonsense, not more than polemics based on videos anybody can see in the web.
And you think any of this makes sense comrade?
 
She is experienced at statecraft, that was her job. Trump is vindictive and petty, and understands almost nothing about diplomacy, while practically worshiping the military.
So, an experienced crimnal warmonger is better than an unexperienced warmonger? Makes sense only if one really wants war.
Yes. In the end Russia wants status and a good economy. They don't want an apocalypse.
If Hillary wants war, they cannot avoid the apocalypse. They will not allow the US to rule over Russia, the Yeltsin time was horrible enough.
 
Reasoning:
There have been no reports of ISIL using Sarin that I can find... none!
If Sarin were available to rebel groups ISIL would surely have access too.
 
idlib1697327356.png
Apparently an image of the Idib bombing that involved the alleged chemical attack. (taken from a video clip)
3 strikes shown.
The one on the far right is supposed to have been the chem attack. (white colored cloud)

Claims that the far right was caused by a bombs hitting stockpiles are proven false as there appears to be no bomb explosion cloud similar to the other two.
Conclusion:
Stockpiles were not bombed.
Chems were delivered with out need for large explosions.

All we see on the far right is a chemical cloud from most likely a chemical bomb delivered by aircraft or mortar..
 
Last edited:
Reasoning:
There have been no reports of ISIL using Sarin that I can find... none!
If Sarin were available to rebel groups ISIL would surely have access too.

Perhaps.
However the rebel held town of Khan Sheikhoun is not controlled by ISIL, so whether or not ISIL has serin is meaningless for this thread unless your goal was obfuscation.
 
In Trumps campaign, the worst was war with Iran and economic war with China - stupid but not dangerous for mankind.
nah ... that is only your naive interpretation.

What you see now is getting close to what Trumps Campaign rhetoric was all about.. "Make America great again " means "Make Trump great again" and anything that achieves that end is what it is about.
Global domination is what Trump is about...using the USA military as his vehicle

regardless, even with Syria, China and Nth Korea .."You aint seen nothin' yet"
 
Last edited:
Back
Top