We have seen black holes. Has anyone ever seen a white hole?
White Holes
- Thread starter joepistole
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Actually, no, we haven't seen black holes, and we never will. What we have done is observe the effects of a large concentration of mass, that according to our current knowledge should be a black hole.
Also, there is strong indications that white holes are the same as the black holes, or are at least indistinguishable for an observer.
Also, there is strong indications that white holes are the same as the black holes, or are at least indistinguishable for an observer.
Well, It is almost certain that we've seen one, but haven't recognized it as being one. I have a theory that a star a black hole absorbs will have its energy shunted to the corresponding white hole, which would make the white hole appear like a star. Maybe not true, but who knows. Theoretically, since white holes are spewing matter, then it must come from somewhere. Since a black hole does just the opposite, then I think that matter is broken down on the quantum level and somehow transported and expelled to and from a white hole. The good thing is, we can send probes to white holes and study them up close, which can't be said of black holes. So it is likely we've seen a white hole, its just that we mistook them for something else or they are invisible, like black holes.
We have seen black holes. This is an image of one taken by a space telescope(I think Hubble. Its not photoshopped or anything.).
The curvature you see is the gravity of the black hole bending light. The area of pure black you see is the event horizon. The curvature is the only way to detect a black hole. Heres another pic:
Again, there is a a curvature and an area of pure black( which is only possible if theres a black hole absorbing light). In both pictures, you can clearly see the bending of light caused by the gravity. The sun does the same thing. During an eclipse, you can see stars behind the sun do to the fact that the gravity of Sol bends light around it.
The curvature you see is the gravity of the black hole bending light. The area of pure black you see is the event horizon. The curvature is the only way to detect a black hole. Heres another pic:
Again, there is a a curvature and an area of pure black( which is only possible if theres a black hole absorbing light). In both pictures, you can clearly see the bending of light caused by the gravity. The sun does the same thing. During an eclipse, you can see stars behind the sun do to the fact that the gravity of Sol bends light around it.
The first picture is a part of a planetarium show at the Denver Museum of Nature and Science, and is computer generated for the show. A video available here: http://www.dmns.org/main/en/General/Planetarium/CurrentShows/blackHolePlanetarium.htm
The second one is taken from wikipedia, and is in no way a photograph.
The second one is taken from wikipedia, and is in no way a photograph.
Picture taken by the Chandra observatory of a black hole apprently feeding on two nebulas or gas clouds.
Also, the reason its so bright around a black hgole is because of gravity. the huge amount of stars being pulled into it obscure it. Theres a black hole at the center of just about every galaxy. Their what makes up galactic nucleai. The huge amount of radiation and quasars they give off is what causes the center of a galaxy to appear very bright.
Thanks, I have heard that a universe may exist at the bottom of a black hole. So in effect, our universe may be a white hole.
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yea well my fingers were never one to obey very well.The reason is not actually stars, but just gas and stellar matter - even the largest of black holes don't consume a very large number of stars. The matter pulled into the black hole is accelerated to very high speeds and gets very hot, making it radiate light and turning the surroundings of a black hole very bright.
The centers of galaxies in general appear very bright because of very high concentrations of stars, compared to the outer parts of galaxies. The immediate surroundings of the supermassive black hole may be rather bright as well, but as far as I know, that doesn't contribute much to the overall brightness of the galaxies center.
if black holes take in energy and white holes spew out energy. doesent it kind of point towards them being like gateways?. i dont support this notion personaly, but to be honest thats the first thing that logicaly pops into my mind when confronted with that information.
go into a black hole and come out of a white hole, its hard to talk about this and not make it sound like some dodgy porno.
peace.
go into a black hole and come out of a white hole, its hard to talk about this and not make it sound like some dodgy porno.
peace.
I am not really familiar with the subject, but it seems to me that the white holes are a theoretical construction at best, not something actually observed, either directly or indirectly, as black holes have been.
About the gateway expression: If I am not mistaken, the black holes "take in" energy, but it doesn't disappear in any way, so that it might pop out at a different location. All the energy that the black hole takes in is converted to its mass, and the radius of the event horizon increases. That energy stays there in the form of mass until the black hole evaporates (should that theory be true), and the energy is released at the same location.
In any case, should both my statements be falsified by evidence, it would still remain a fact that black holes will turn all the matter and energy that crosses the event horizon into a mathematical point, removing any structure it might have and information it might carry, so "traveling" through a black hole remains a science-fiction topic. What actually happens to the information entering the black hole is another question though, as the energy released by evaporation from the black hole seems to be uniform and carrying no energy.
About the gateway expression: If I am not mistaken, the black holes "take in" energy, but it doesn't disappear in any way, so that it might pop out at a different location. All the energy that the black hole takes in is converted to its mass, and the radius of the event horizon increases. That energy stays there in the form of mass until the black hole evaporates (should that theory be true), and the energy is released at the same location.
In any case, should both my statements be falsified by evidence, it would still remain a fact that black holes will turn all the matter and energy that crosses the event horizon into a mathematical point, removing any structure it might have and information it might carry, so "traveling" through a black hole remains a science-fiction topic. What actually happens to the information entering the black hole is another question though, as the energy released by evaporation from the black hole seems to be uniform and carrying no energy.
Please show me a image of a black hole. As far as I know there hasn't been any as yet only seeing stars rotating around an object that astronomers believe is a black hole. No white hole exist as yet that I remember seeing.
Well, it is possible white holes are invisible, like black holes. Also, I think that wjile there are a higher concentration of stars near the center of a galaxy, about 10, maybe 15% of what you see is pulled there by a super-massive black holes.
Anyway, I don't think all of the mass is used to expand the event horizon. I mean, if it swallows a star, then it should gain the mass of a star. But it doesn't. Which leaves the question: where does the excess matter go.
I'm fairly certain that the Big Bang was either a collapsing black hole or a newly born white hole. Either one fits with the gravitational singularity theory. Also, I think that we don't live "the" Universe, but rather one universe. Let me explain. There is a theory that we live inside our visible "Universe", or how far we can see into the Universe. We can't see more then about 12-14 billion lightyears away from us. Anything past that and we can't see it. In essence, our universe is like a gigantic galaxy, with other Universes flying through space.
Anyway, I don't think all of the mass is used to expand the event horizon. I mean, if it swallows a star, then it should gain the mass of a star. But it doesn't. Which leaves the question: where does the excess matter go.
I'm fairly certain that the Big Bang was either a collapsing black hole or a newly born white hole. Either one fits with the gravitational singularity theory. Also, I think that we don't live "the" Universe, but rather one universe. Let me explain. There is a theory that we live inside our visible "Universe", or how far we can see into the Universe. We can't see more then about 12-14 billion lightyears away from us. Anything past that and we can't see it. In essence, our universe is like a gigantic galaxy, with other Universes flying through space.
The first statement is correct, the second one is not. There's no question to answer because it DOES gain the mass of whatever falls into it. Everything that enters a black hole stays there until it finally is released through Hawking radiation.
On the topic of white holes, there's absolutely NO physical reason such a ridiculous thing could/should exist. The thought is simply a bit of logical fantasy created because since there are "black" holes then perhaps there are "white" holes as well. It's physical nonsense, nothing more.
It is called an ultranova and it wipes out entire galaxies as well as other nearby galaxies.
If you mean "death" as in the meaning of a star, where the nuclear fission stops and the star collapses, there is no equivalent for a black hole, as there is nothing producing energy there, its only a gravitational well. Still, the black holes aren't infinite in time, as the Hawking radiation reduces its mass and energy over time, and its speed is a reverse function of the black holes mass - the larger a black hole is, the slower it evaporates and the smaller the black hole gets through that process, the faster it will take place. As the radiation is so weak for any decent size black hole, they are not really getting smaller, but a situation can be imagined where a black hole is situated in a very low density region of space and can actually get smaller due to the radiation, finally leading to a runaway reaction where the last of the black hole radiates away in a flash.
I am not very familiar with the subject, but I believe that theoretical calculations are showing that the first black holes created in the early stages of the universe may have been of a size that allows some of them to have reached the runaway radiation phase, where the last part of the black hole radiates away at a very high rate. That is sometimes suggested as a source for some of the gamma-ray bursts observed, especially the highest energy ones.
wikipedia said:
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rian.wrenn
Registered Member
Well what i thik about black and white holes is that they exist. But not as the sigularaty of infanent mass and high gravity as people see them. I think that the holes are connected to another universe and the reason that black holes suck in things is that it is trying to keep the amount of matter a constant between the universes.
So I think
back hole=taking out matter
white hole=putting back matter
So from our prospective, secne we have only detected black holes, then from my theory we can extract that our universe has more matter in it than adjasent unierses. And to the other universes there would not be a black hole taking in matter, there would be a white hole spuing out the matter collected from our universe.
Its like a baloon, blow it up, say that the air you put into it is matter then let it go. My theory, so far atleast, ive only had 10min to think about it after reading this then going to the bathroom. Thx 4 the question though
So I think
back hole=taking out matter
white hole=putting back matter
So from our prospective, secne we have only detected black holes, then from my theory we can extract that our universe has more matter in it than adjasent unierses. And to the other universes there would not be a black hole taking in matter, there would be a white hole spuing out the matter collected from our universe.
Its like a baloon, blow it up, say that the air you put into it is matter then let it go. My theory, so far atleast, ive only had 10min to think about it after reading this then going to the bathroom. Thx 4 the question though