Where does Thinking Begin?

[ULTRA]

I wasn't quite sure where to post this one, so feel free, Mods, to move it..

This is the question: Where does thinking begin? Does a worm down its wormhole actually think "Its raining, I better get outta here before I drown?"

There used to be a custom of lashing wallnut trees with chains to make them "think" they are dying, so they crop better.

Insects like ants and termites have highly ordered societies..Is this because they think, or so they don't have to?

Is there a cut-off point of cellular organisation beyond which a creature can no longer be said capable of thinking?

I define "thinking" as 'the ability to rationalise stimulae sufficiently to make a decision based on it', for the purposes of this question.

 

[cosmictraveler]

Different critters have different ways of thought. Many only use instincts to get by with then others use deductive reasoning and even others use critical thinking, like humans.

 

[S.A.M.]

I wasn't quite sure where to post this one, so feel free, Mods, to move it..

This is the question: Where does thinking begin? Does a worm down its wormhole actually think "Its raining, I better get outta here before I drown?"

There used to be a custom of lashing wallnut trees with chains to make them "think" they are dying, so they crop better.

Insects like ants and termites have highly ordered societies..Is this because they think, or so they don't have to?

Is there a cut-off point of cellular organisation beyond which a creature can no longer be said capable of thinking?

I define "thinking" as 'the ability to rationalise stimulae sufficiently to make a decision based on it', for the purposes of this question.

I would say that thinking begins with the ability to model your environment in the abstract and to represent reality as an arrangement of thoughts and ideas. It requires imagination and consciousness, cognition and sentience and hence I would not associate thinking with those organisms that lack any of the above.

 

[Emil]

I believe that we will not be able to define thinking.
Part of the thinking that makes us different from animals.

beavers:

bowerbirds:

Animals that use tools

 

[wellwisher]

Humans have two centers of consciousness. What we call conscious is the secondary center of consciousness since it evolved later. We also have a primary center of consciousness, which shared by the animals. The primary is often called the unconscious mind.

As an example of the differentiation, say you started to feel hungry. This feeling is connected to feedback from the body, which will reach awareness. That is the an example of the primary center common to even the animals.

The human secondary center is somewhat detached from the primary and is aware the body is hungry, but since the secondary has will and choice, it can chose how and when it wishes to act on the hunger. The animal does not contemplate being hungry nor how its wishes to extrapolate, but acts within the context of other primary instincts (for that species) which define how and which food it gathers. The human secondary, can override the primary to create endless diversity of expression, some of which can be totally out of touch with the natural instincts of the primary.

Practice makes perfect; if humans use the will and choice of the secondary in a repetitive way, we can create subroutines called habits, which can become unconscious routines. These are loosely similar to the instincts of the primary, but are not part of the original wiring of the brain. They exist only because of the secondary.

For example, I use my secondary to anticipate hunger will happen due to the cause and effect of the body. I can then create the habit of eating at a given time, before I get hungry. This allows me to detach from instinct. The animal does not do this, but acts on hunger via primary instincts.

 

[Fraggle Rocker]

Humans have two centers of consciousness. What we call conscious is the secondary center of consciousness since it evolved later. We also have a primary center of consciousness, which is shared by the animals.

All warm-blooded vertebrates (mammals and birds) have consciousness. It's a function of the forebrain. The human forebrain is of course uniquely massive, giving us the ability to override instinctive behavior with reasoned and learned behavior. But the other apes also have rather large forebrains, and to a lesser extent all of the primates.

Certainly all of the mammals and birds with whom we've interacted sufficiently to take notice also have consciousness. Dogs, cats, horses, parrots, all of them.

Even the cold-blooded vertebrates (reptiles, amphibians and fish) have forebrains, although they are qualitatively smaller since their metabolism doesn't provide enough oxygen to exploit the processes of a large one. The behavior of domesticated koi, for example, is much too complex to be attributed entirely to unconscious mental processing.

BTW, humans are "animals." We are clearly not plants, fungi, algae, bacteria or archaea.

 

[Emil]

Chimps outperform humans at memory task

 

[ULTRA]

Chimps clearly think, and other primates have worked out what tools they need and how to employ them. This is not really in doubt. Parrots, dolphins etc. also show a degree of mental acuity.
Spiders show a degree of planning, architecture and cunning beyond what could be expected from mere instinct, yet have tiny brains. Perhaps they have the equivalent of a 16 bit processing capacity. I wonder if thier brains are more highly efficient in a processing to mass ratio than a primate. If just a few hundred thousand brain-cells can allow the creature to think maybe there is an optimal amount below which cognative thought is no longer possible. It would make an interesting study.

 

[EmptyForceOfChi]

I wasn't quite sure where to post this one, so feel free, Mods, to move it..

This is the question: Where does thinking begin? Does a worm down its wormhole actually think "Its raining, I better get outta here before I drown?"

There used to be a custom of lashing wallnut trees with chains to make them "think" they are dying, so they crop better.

Insects like ants and termites have highly ordered societies..Is this because they think, or so they don't have to?

Is there a cut-off point of cellular organisation beyond which a creature can no longer be said capable of thinking?

I define "thinking" as 'the ability to rationalise stimulae sufficiently to make a decision based on it', for the purposes of this question.

Study the difference between a Sentient being and non sentient and you will find your answer ^_^.


Peace.