When somebody in Pakistan asks you to marry them

[PsychoTropicPuppy]

Perhaps, but there are statistically much fewer homosexuals than heterosexuals in any given population, so the percentage that choose to vent their frustrations would be that much smaller too.

It doesn't make them necessarily homosexual. It's just that this is their last option..a boy in a patriarchal society is probably never going to admit that he got fucked up his ass. A boy doesn't get pregnant contrarily to a woman.

 

[spidergoat]

Probably. I'll wager that this same culture has a high incidence of same-sex relations between otherwise non-homosexual people.

 

[PsychoTropicPuppy]

^ well I read a book that mentioned such incidences(can't recall the title), and it seemed to be a normal thing for men to take their sexual urges out on the young, feminine looking boys..

 

[spidergoat]

But it doesn't leave a visible scar, so it doesn't make the news.

 

[Michael]

No its just typically how white people behave towards coloured people.

:bugeye:


Simple questions SAM:

Do you think that neo-Nazism is an intolerance ideology?

Do you think that the basic tenants of neo-Nazism in some way led to the violence perpetrated upon that poor Portuguese woman by the WASP skin heads?

Could it be that for some individuals being taught a lifetime of WASP bigot-ideology brings about violence acts towards non-White people?


What's so hard to get here SAM? Sociology 101.
:shrug:



Perhaps American exceptionalism is the root cause for why Americans feel it is their place to stick their nose into other people's shit? Oh, and SAM, Americans come in all colors.

 

[RickyH]

In my experience, it happened a lot more than you would read about. It's hard to get an accurate study because it's dangerous, and completely censored due to american/afghani public relations.

Little boys solicite their bodies to soldiers/civillians for mres at the gate.

 

[Michael]

Because they neither want the culturally sanctioned sex nor are they allowed to marry.

In most countries they can have all the sex they want. But in Pakistan they cannot marry, so who would they be violent towards beside themselves?

Young boys.

Acid attack on boy who 'refused sex with Muslim cleric'

On his hospital bed last week, 16-year-old Abid Tanoli sat listless and alone, half of his body covered by burns that all but destroyed both his eyes and left his face horribly disfigured.

The teenager talked, with difficulty, of how his life had been destroyed since the fateful day in June 2002 when he refused to have sex with his teacher at a religious school in Pakistan.

The boy was horrifically injured in an acid attack after he rebuffed the Muslim cleric's sexual advances. Now, he has alarmed Pakistan's powerful religious establishment by pressing charges against his alleged assailants.

A teacher at the school, who cannot be named for legal reasons, and two of his friends are in prison awaiting trial for attempted murder and rape. All three deny the charges. A fourth alleged attacker is still at large.

It is the first such case to be brought against a Muslim cleric and threatens to expose a scandal of sex abuse within Pakistan's secretive Islamic schools.

 

[spidergoat]

Not all that surprised.

 

[786]

I think US has high divorce rate and depression for the reasons of pre-marital relationships... :shrug:

Peace be unto you

 

[spidergoat]

Beats acid in the face, don't you think?

 

[786]

Depends, look at the percent of people affected? No, but in terms of cruelty yes... But anyways it has nothing to do with not allowing sex before marriage... They could find prostitutes even in Pakistan, or go marry a poor ugly girl.. These cases are where the girl REJECTED them. There is clearly a difference.

Peace be unto you

 

[Varda]

Or, just like in Pakistan and India it happens rarely enough that you don't pay attention when they do, This is from a brief search, no doubt I could find more if I looked.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/10/19/article-1221077-06DF02EB000005DC-687_468x610.jpg

http://gabriellestory.com/sitebuilder/images/crimestoppers_picture_close_up-348x332.jpg

I've never seen a disfigured woman either and yet, they exist.

You have it backwards. When something happens too often, it becomes common place and no longer makes it to the news. Rare shocking things like women getting defaced always makes to the news on this side of the world.

Whats the difference to the victim [besides the fact that this one is eight, not eighteen]?

To our discussion, it doesn't matter what the victim thinks. Those two instances of violence are completely separate and you said so yourself right here:

I hardly think a woman cutting off her husbands balls for his proclivity to 18 year old mistresses is the same as an American invasion of Iraq is it?

Crimes of passion != crimes of war.
Hence, let's keep the war out of this thread.

Moving on.


Here you are again pinning it all on white peoples, even the very creation of aggression, and proposing that even when brown peoples are mean to each other which is the subject of this thread, in other words, aggression of a people over his own people and its women more specifically, it is also the white people's fault:

No its just typically how white people behave towards coloured people. Don't you live in one such representative nation? Having moved from another such representative nation? Doesn't history tell you how this works?

And the ones who do so, consider themselves as a bit more white than the others, too. e.g. the Brahmins who massacre the Dalits think they are Aryans, the "Arabs" who kill the blacks in Darfur think they are more white

You ever seen the Janjaweed Arabs? To an untrained eye he might look just like a black African but to himself he's an Arab, different from those darkies he's trying to liberate.

Here is one:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/32/Darfur_report_-_Page_4_Image_1.jpg

Interesting proposition. However, I need to point to that little piece of my post you ignored:

You must be the kind of indian that is worth any respect them. I hear that in india, you have people that collect feces with their hands and are called untouchable.
It's funny, because... everyone is brown over there, isn't that so?

So, I am not very knowledgeable in indian matters, but wasn't the cast system over there established way, way before the colonial period? Or was there another period of white men influence in india when they planted the seed of evil over there?

Or can we just stop the nonsense and have you admit that brown people are just fucking human like everyone else, and that means that they kill, rape, disfigure, dominate, exterminate too, except that they are too busy trying to dominate each other to spend time, you know, building some fucking tools or ships or something, and going somewhere where they can kill other kinds instead of just settling for killing their own.
Can we?
/slightly facetious

Thats all it takes really. You do know that the Irish have only recently become white? Its all a matter of thinking you are and you get to become one and act like one.

Here is an interesting deconstruction of British values

http://britologywatch.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/102409_0648_the2011cens2.png
http://www.ons.gov.uk/census/2011-census/index.html

I have no idea of what you where getting at here, but I just thought I'd point it out to you that northern irish are irish too, and that the reason for irish being in a different bracket is that they are not a part of the United Kingdom.

So the bus driver who wouldn't stop for me at a bus stop but stopped a little further on down the road for a white student was dong it because I was anti-American?

And the woman who politely showed me the door telling me I wouldn't find anything to my liking in her store did it because of my anti-western attitude?

Aww, boo.
Nobody threw acid on your face though, right?

As a woman of colour, the last place I would have expected to be shown the door was in the good ole US of A. So don't be pushing it on me. I used to have illusions about the broadminded western societies as well. It was my first ever experience of racism and I come from a very conservative society myself. Even the Saudis know how to treat a person better than thatinspite of the fact that there is no pretence of "enlightened peoples" there

Indian casts, untouchables, picking up feces with their hands, etc etc.
You don't have to go all the way to the good ole US of A to find instances of people being deemed undesired. Just go for a holiday at the country parts of your own nation.

Lets say I put the behaviour of individuals over what is enshrined in law. I think human quality comes across much better in interactions than it does in books.

In other words, if your side of the world, with all the religious conduct restrictions, you still manage to fill a whole blog page with burned up women. Just imagine the kinds of things they'll do if they have the freedoms we do.

Post America, its my belief that any society where whites are in power cannot really escape racism. After all, America is the best there is offer in integration of whites. And this is where I first experienced it.

Once again, just look at your own country.

Clearly there is something a bit off with muslims' God, then! Men and women who committed adultery are lashed or stoned to death, what kind of insanity is that? :bugeye: Men and women should be allowed to have free sex, to be sluts or prostitutes or making porn when they wish, let the men peeing on their face while other filming them, etc. When they die of aids, it's a bit unfortunate, though..

And how and earth the muslim men are only allowed to sleep with 4 wives? All other men are allowed to sleep with as many women as possible, no responsibility following, don't even have to remember their women names! Poor muslim men..

Well, jeez, I guess you have a point eh?
No. Actually, you will find that most women don't become prostitutes and don't make porns and don't die of AIDS.

And as sad as it may be, some people do use their freedom to ruin their lives.

Once thing is certain though, IT FEELS REALLY DAMN GOOD TO HAVE THE CHOICE.

 

[kira]

You have it backwards. When something happens too often, it becomes common place and no longer makes it to the news. Rare shocking things like women getting defaced always makes to the news on this side of the world.




To our discussion, it doesn't matter what the victim thinks. Those two instances of violence are completely separate and you said so yourself right here:



Crimes of passion != crimes of war.
Hence, let's keep the war out of this thread.

Moving on.


Here you are again pinning it all on white peoples, even the very creation of aggression, and proposing that even when brown peoples are mean to each other which is the subject of this thread, in other words, aggression of a people over his own people and its women more specifically, it is also the white people's fault:





Interesting proposition. However, I need to point to that little piece of my post you ignored:



So, I am not very knowledgeable in indian matters, but wasn't the cast system over there established way, way before the colonial period? Or was there another period of white men influence in india when they planted the seed of evil over there?

Or can we just stop the nonsense and have you admit that brown people are just fucking human like everyone else, and that means that they kill, rape, disfigure, dominate, exterminate too, except that they are too busy trying to dominate each other to spend time, you know, building some fucking tools or ships or something, and going somewhere where they can kill other kinds instead of just settling for killing their own.
Can we?
/slightly facetious




I have no idea of what you where getting at here, but I just thought I'd point it out to you that northern irish are irish too, and that the reason for irish being in a different bracket is that they are not a part of the United Kingdom.





Aww, boo.
Nobody threw acid on your face though, right?



Indian casts, untouchables, picking up feces with their hands, etc etc.
You don't have to go all the way to the good ole US of A to find instances of people being deemed undesired. Just go for a holiday at the country parts of your own nation.



In other words, if your side of the world, with all the religious conduct restrictions, you still manage to fill a whole blog page with burned up women. Just imagine the kinds of things they'll do if they have the freedoms we do.



Once again, just look at your own country.



Well, jeez, I guess you have a point eh?
No. Actually, you will find that most women don't become prostitutes and don't make porns and don't die of AIDS.

And as sad as it may be, some people do use their freedom to ruin their lives.

Once thing is certain though, IT FEELS REALLY DAMN GOOD TO HAVE THE CHOICE.

People who don't become sluts or prostitutes or make porns make their own choice, too. For all you know it probably feels good for them, too. Your point? :shrug:

And stop saying how some people in India picking up feces with their own hands, you say that already about gazillion times now and in the past. It says more about YOU, than it says about them.

 

[S.A.M.]

And stop saying how some people in India picking up feces with their own hands, you say that already about gazillion times now and in the past. It says more about YOU, than it says about them.

Nah it doesn't bother me, I'm a poo expert. Much of my research is grinding and sifting poo for metabolites.

Also we used to collect "feces" and make patties when we were little too

I'm mixed caste, so Varda is really talking about people I am related to

I think I'm supposed to get insulted, but I don't see why.

 

[kira]

Lol, I don't know how you manage to handle this situation by making humor You're a good person.

I gotta go to office, see ya & have a nice day =)

 

[S.A.M.]

Life is a comedy for those who think and a tragedy for those who feel. :shrug:

 

[Varda]

Could you please not dismiss your country's blatant disrespect for human life like it is a joke?
I mean, I typed all that stuff. Give me a serious answer.

 

[S.A.M.]

I would but I am giving it as much due as you gave to the people who live there. I mean you casually dismissed everyone in a country where women have been elected by popular vote to the highest office as essentially misogynists. A country which has got advocates like Asma Jahangir in the UNHCR fighting for the rights of these same women in the OP

So yeah, I'm giving it the attention you gave it. I'm just seeing the parts that I don't like.

 

[Enmos]

So are you saying that these women have no rights?
Are you saying that they should just marry the guy or face the consequences?

Thats what James would say, they should juts compromise with the oppression because thats the only solution. If the men are victims too, who can we hold responsible?

In theory, they have rights, but in practice its unrealistic to aim for equality.

They should just get used to it. :shrug:

Quote from Chosen People Syndrome :

Pakistani women should get used to it because that is what secular humanism decrees.

Secular humanism says that they should get used to it?

 

[GeoffP]

Secular humanism says that they should get used to it?

Sam's basic tenet is "love it or leave it".

This isn't a poverty thing, it's cultural. This is what happens when a culture tells young men they cannot have any culturally acceptable sex unless they marry. They become so desperate that they lash out when they cannot get what basically every man needs.

Well said.