What is the best science fiction or fantasy book???
- Thread starter Quigly
- Start date
Frank Herbert:
Destination Void
The Jesus Incident
The Lazarus Effect
A trilogy about the effort to conceive & build an AI computer, which, when finally created, promptly declares itself God, kills all of humanity but a select few whom it obsessively insists must learn to "WorShip" it properly, (it is housed in the ship in which it was built) or face destruction at its hands.
Strange, but fascinating.
Destination Void
The Jesus Incident
The Lazarus Effect
A trilogy about the effort to conceive & build an AI computer, which, when finally created, promptly declares itself God, kills all of humanity but a select few whom it obsessively insists must learn to "WorShip" it properly, (it is housed in the ship in which it was built) or face destruction at its hands.
Strange, but fascinating.
Sumbitch!
I never heard of the last one...
Perhaps that explains why Lazarus Effect seemed to end without really resolving matters.
At the time I read the three I mentioned, I had read the Dune works up to God Emperor, plus a couple of other Herbert works like The Eyes of Heisenberg, I think another was called Santaroga Barrier or Hellstrom's Hive,( though even as I mention the latter, the title sounds wrong) and I was somewhat accustomed to Herbert's plots seeming to lead... well, sorta nowhere for a bit... I swear to God Children of Dune had a "feeling" to it which to me resembled nothing so much as a hashish buzz, because all of this stuff seemed to be percolating and going round and round, yet going nowhere.
But I digress...
I presume the last title you mentioned to be out of print.
Hell, I can't even find a copy of Jesus Incident to replace the one I had. It had been on the order of a decade since I read the 3 books, and while sorting thru boxes after a move I found Destination Void & re-read it...
This would have led to re-reading the others, but alas...
All the stores have on the shelves from Herbert are the Dune works, ('specially the 'prequel' crapola his parasitical, grubbing son seems to have become obsessed with producing) and some older stuff like Eyes of...,etc.
So!
You've helped me greatly with perhaps no such intention whatever, and my thanks!
I shall have to start rooting around online & at some used bookshops to find Ascension Factor...
Gotta find out what became of them kooky clones & their "tin God"!
Salute!
I never heard of the last one...
Perhaps that explains why Lazarus Effect seemed to end without really resolving matters.
At the time I read the three I mentioned, I had read the Dune works up to God Emperor, plus a couple of other Herbert works like The Eyes of Heisenberg, I think another was called Santaroga Barrier or Hellstrom's Hive,( though even as I mention the latter, the title sounds wrong) and I was somewhat accustomed to Herbert's plots seeming to lead... well, sorta nowhere for a bit... I swear to God Children of Dune had a "feeling" to it which to me resembled nothing so much as a hashish buzz, because all of this stuff seemed to be percolating and going round and round, yet going nowhere.
But I digress...
I presume the last title you mentioned to be out of print.
Hell, I can't even find a copy of Jesus Incident to replace the one I had. It had been on the order of a decade since I read the 3 books, and while sorting thru boxes after a move I found Destination Void & re-read it...
This would have led to re-reading the others, but alas...
All the stores have on the shelves from Herbert are the Dune works, ('specially the 'prequel' crapola his parasitical, grubbing son seems to have become obsessed with producing) and some older stuff like Eyes of...,etc.
So!
You've helped me greatly with perhaps no such intention whatever, and my thanks!
I shall have to start rooting around online & at some used bookshops to find Ascension Factor...
Gotta find out what became of them kooky clones & their "tin God"!
Salute!
The Foundation Trilogy, by Isaac Asimov. If you can get past the first book then the rest are absolutely amazing works of art. Foundation is literally the foundation for a lot of modern science fiction, I believe he introduced or sensationalized the idea of a galactic Empire. He paralleled the Empire's history with that of Ancient Rome's, but he also created many new things as well. He invents a group of "psychohistorians" that can predict the future of humanity by complicated mathematical processes. Five hundred years (?) before it happens, the founder of psychohistory, Hari Seldon, takes his fellow psychohistorians to a distant planet at the edge of the galaxy, where they will compile all of the scientific knowledge the Empire has amassed and prepare it for the birth of the New Empire later on. Really really good stuff, I wholeheartedly recommend it to anyone.
Childhood's End is another Clarke book. Probably the best sciency science fiction book ever (whereas Rama and TFT have little in the way of science involved). The beginning is strangely similar to that of Independence Day (even though Clarke's book was written quite awhile ago) with many enormous alien spaceships appearing over Earth's major cities. They take over the planet peacefully, and remain over Earth's cities for fifty years, so that at the end of that time everyone alive will have lived in a world where the flying saucers have always existed. When this time expires, all but one of the ships disapears (they were fake) and the alien leader I believe makes his first appearance to the denizens of Earth, appearing before a photo op and holding a small child in each hand. There is so much more to this story, even if it is actually quite short. It's basically an idiots guide to First Contact situations.
Enders Game was good, but I never really understood why so many people liked it so much. Yes it was good, but I don't think it was that good.
Dune is of course required reading if you're into scifi.
Childhood's End is another Clarke book. Probably the best sciency science fiction book ever (whereas Rama and TFT have little in the way of science involved). The beginning is strangely similar to that of Independence Day (even though Clarke's book was written quite awhile ago) with many enormous alien spaceships appearing over Earth's major cities. They take over the planet peacefully, and remain over Earth's cities for fifty years, so that at the end of that time everyone alive will have lived in a world where the flying saucers have always existed. When this time expires, all but one of the ships disapears (they were fake) and the alien leader I believe makes his first appearance to the denizens of Earth, appearing before a photo op and holding a small child in each hand. There is so much more to this story, even if it is actually quite short. It's basically an idiots guide to First Contact situations.
Enders Game was good, but I never really understood why so many people liked it so much. Yes it was good, but I don't think it was that good.
Dune is of course required reading if you're into scifi.
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Hellstroms hive is the right title for it. The Santaroga barrier is ratehr good, especially once you find out what the characters names are from.
For a real good look at herberts stuff, go to:
http://tim.oreilly.com/sci-fi/herbert/index.html
There I learnt about the fact he planned the first three books as a whole. And more about what he was trying to do with his books.
You have read Chapterhouse dune havnt you? And how was the ending to God emperor of Dune? I think its one of hte most extraordinary endings Ive ever seen in a book.
Well, the ascension factor isnt that great. i put it down to the fact it was after all a collaboration, thus diluting the masters style.
I have gotten all my Herbert from 2nd hand shops, theres still a lot around in the UK nowadays, I have everything hes written of scifi, except one book. But yes, they arent reprinting that many of them, which is annoying, since destination: void could teach some more modern scifi authors a thing or two.
For a real good look at herberts stuff, go to:
http://tim.oreilly.com/sci-fi/herbert/index.html
There I learnt about the fact he planned the first three books as a whole. And more about what he was trying to do with his books.
You have read Chapterhouse dune havnt you? And how was the ending to God emperor of Dune? I think its one of hte most extraordinary endings Ive ever seen in a book.
Well, the ascension factor isnt that great. i put it down to the fact it was after all a collaboration, thus diluting the masters style.
I have gotten all my Herbert from 2nd hand shops, theres still a lot around in the UK nowadays, I have everything hes written of scifi, except one book. But yes, they arent reprinting that many of them, which is annoying, since destination: void could teach some more modern scifi authors a thing or two.
I disagree about Childhoods end, pollux. Its not really that good. It gets across part of what hes trying to say, but not in a very good manner, and as well,. Rama has far more science in it as far as I can remember, but i read them years ago, whereas I finally got round ot reading Childhoods end a couple of years ago but wasnt really impressed. Clarke has always struck me as believing in the inherent sensibleness of humanity, which is just a little too optimistic and narrow. My copy of childhoods end has a plaudit from I think C S lewis about it being a novel that is aware of the necessity of higher things or something like that, and ive also read that LEwis thought scifi was total bunk or suchlike.
I'm reading that article you posted right now. The author of it seems to be in concordance with my opinion of Childhood's End--
Here
It is really that good. It's a book that outlines the way a peaceful invasion should proceed, a manual that an alien intelligence could pick up, read through, and say "yeah, that's a good idea--humans are pretty screwed up, but we could help them if we implemented this." There is a lot more fantasy involved with this than most of Clarke's other stuff, the psychic children, for one, that turn into superbeings and destroy the planet at the end. The science is angled more socially than technologically, I guess.
Here
It is really that good. It's a book that outlines the way a peaceful invasion should proceed, a manual that an alien intelligence could pick up, read through, and say "yeah, that's a good idea--humans are pretty screwed up, but we could help them if we implemented this." There is a lot more fantasy involved with this than most of Clarke's other stuff, the psychic children, for one, that turn into superbeings and destroy the planet at the end. The science is angled more socially than technologically, I guess.
ahhh, but much as i daydream of it, I am not sure hyperconsciousness is possible. Moreover:
"But while Herbert places great value on higher consciousness, he does not see such a state as "the" answer to mankind's problems. "
And i see clarkes social stuff as being a little too simplistic.
And on chapter 2, you get:
"Herbert attributes his rural upbringing with having instilled in him a "landmark consciousness" rather than a "label consciousness," a predisposition that found fruit in his later interest in general semantics."
One of these days i might try to track down the influence of GS on scifi, its mentioned by and influences Heinlein, influenced Herbert, and was used fully by Van Vogt.
"But while Herbert places great value on higher consciousness, he does not see such a state as "the" answer to mankind's problems. "
And i see clarkes social stuff as being a little too simplistic.
And on chapter 2, you get:
"Herbert attributes his rural upbringing with having instilled in him a "landmark consciousness" rather than a "label consciousness," a predisposition that found fruit in his later interest in general semantics."
One of these days i might try to track down the influence of GS on scifi, its mentioned by and influences Heinlein, influenced Herbert, and was used fully by Van Vogt.
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Interesting site. Fascinating the way he explored and developed themes through successive works leading up to the culmination represented in a "magnim opus", somewhat like a philosopher working through a proof on a hypothesis via allegory (or not?)
Actually I have not read Chapterhouse Dune, nor anything written after it from the "series". After God Emperor, I sorta got fed up with the stasis the setting was languishing in.
I mean, the reign of Leto II was what - three thousand years, and they still have only one planet that produces techno-gizmos, ("many machines on Ix"...heh...) and they are still at the same tech level in general with the lasguns and shields and whatnot... ...That ending was superb, though.
Was the collaboration on Ascension Factor with a Bill Ransom?
For some reason this name sticks in my head as one associated with Herbert... Perhaps because of a different collaborative effort.
Yes, Bill Ransoms the one he collaborated with for the Pandora trilogy.
But you have to read the next two books. One of the points of the series is that stasis is desired by the currently powerful, and also by many people who fear change, yet in the real universe, change always occurs, and you have to adapt to it. So, Leto ambles down his golden path, dragging the rest of humanity along, in a lesson that lasts for 3,000 years, long enough to imprint it on their bones, by stultifying their lives so much that humanity never wants continous stasis again. So read the next two, it all changes.
But you have to read the next two books. One of the points of the series is that stasis is desired by the currently powerful, and also by many people who fear change, yet in the real universe, change always occurs, and you have to adapt to it. So, Leto ambles down his golden path, dragging the rest of humanity along, in a lesson that lasts for 3,000 years, long enough to imprint it on their bones, by stultifying their lives so much that humanity never wants continous stasis again. So read the next two, it all changes.
Frank Herbert's Dune trilogy would have to rank near the top. He had a very good understanding of religion, history, politics, and how the three intertwine, and applied his understanding very imaginatively to a science fictional/fantasy setting. Phillip K Dick, Arthur C. Clarke, Ray Bradbury, Orwell (1984), Huxley, and a few others come to mind in the science fiction arena.
There's a Forgotten Realms series called "The Avatar Trilogy" which takes place during the Times of Troubles when all magic went haywire and the gods fell from their pedastals. I read the second book in the series and I also bought the first one with the intention of rereading, but I'm currently into Frank Hebert's Dune.
\m/ fantasy \m/
\m/ fantasy \m/
CrypticFortuneCookie
Registered Member
Watership Down by Richard Adams. Absolutely amazing epic ala the Oddysey. I'm more into literary type fantasy, so my other recomendations would be Beowulf (the Seamus McHeaney translation is the easiest read, but any of them are good) and Grendel by John Gardner.
i like pretty much anything by Steven King.
especially
Tommyknockers
The Stand
the Gun Slinger series
Carrie
...... i could write many more
but i heard that he's got a bad name.
one of my friends went as far as calling him "airport trash" or something like that.
why is that?
especially
Tommyknockers
The Stand
the Gun Slinger series
Carrie
...... i could write many more
but i heard that he's got a bad name.
one of my friends went as far as calling him "airport trash" or something like that.
why is that?
Can't pick one, but can narrow it down to around a hundred:
The Foundation books, Asimov
the Dune books,Herbert
The Forever War, Haldemen(what do people who have read both think about forever war vs. starship troopers? I think the edge is with haldemen although its been quite a while since i read either.)
All the interconnected Heinlein books(stranger in a strange land, time enough for love, number of the beast, etc.)
The Unpleasant Profession of Jonathan Hoag, Heinlein
The Dispossessed, Le Guin
The Sirens of Titan, Vonnegut(not his very best book overall, but in the sci-fi area I think it wins)
1984, Orwell
and then a bunch of Theodore Sturgeon short stories, whose names i can't remember.
edit: forgot to put the enders game books...they should be up their too.
The Foundation books, Asimov
the Dune books,Herbert
The Forever War, Haldemen(what do people who have read both think about forever war vs. starship troopers? I think the edge is with haldemen although its been quite a while since i read either.)
All the interconnected Heinlein books(stranger in a strange land, time enough for love, number of the beast, etc.)
The Unpleasant Profession of Jonathan Hoag, Heinlein
The Dispossessed, Le Guin
The Sirens of Titan, Vonnegut(not his very best book overall, but in the sci-fi area I think it wins)
1984, Orwell
and then a bunch of Theodore Sturgeon short stories, whose names i can't remember.
edit: forgot to put the enders game books...they should be up their too.
I loved the Robert Jordan "Wheel of Time" Series, I read the first 6 or 7, but I am getting tired of waiting for them to come out. I think I will just wait until the series is complete and read them all over again.
You would probably enjoy the "Sword of Truth" Seriesby Terry Goodkind, I really did, but it is another of those incomplete series.
Tad Williams has some that I really enjoyed:
Fantasy: The "Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn" Series
SciFi/ Fantasy: The "Otherland" Series
I am a Stephen King fan, I just hope he survives long enough to finish the gunslinger series.
I am not sure what genre it would fit into, but I really enjoyed the Anne Rice book "Servant of the Bones".
There is one book that I really enjoyed, but I can not remember the Author or the title. Attached is the cover art (by Micheal Whelan). Anyone have an idea?
- KitNyx
You would probably enjoy the "Sword of Truth" Seriesby Terry Goodkind, I really did, but it is another of those incomplete series.
Tad Williams has some that I really enjoyed:
Fantasy: The "Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn" Series
SciFi/ Fantasy: The "Otherland" Series
I am a Stephen King fan, I just hope he survives long enough to finish the gunslinger series.
I am not sure what genre it would fit into, but I really enjoyed the Anne Rice book "Servant of the Bones".
There is one book that I really enjoyed, but I can not remember the Author or the title. Attached is the cover art (by Micheal Whelan). Anyone have an idea?
- KitNyx