What Defines 'Stealing the Oil'?

Zephyr said:
I read somewhere that China wouldn't mind buying weapons technology from Israel, but the US wouldn't hear of it.
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A paragraph from the essay I linked a few posts back:

"A final reason to question Israel’s strategic value is that it does not behave like a loyal ally. Israeli officials frequently ignore US requests and renege on promises (including pledges to stop building settlements and to refrain from ‘targeted assassinations’ of Palestinian leaders). Israel has provided sensitive military technology to potential rivals like China, in what the State Department inspector-general called ‘a systematic and growing pattern of unauthorised transfers’. According to the General Accounting Office, Israel also ‘conducts the most aggressive espionage operations against the US of any ally’. In addition to the case of Jonathan Pollard, who gave Israel large quantities of classified material in the early 1980s (which it reportedly passed on to the Soviet Union in return for more exit visas for Soviet Jews), a new controversy erupted in 2004 when it was revealed that a key Pentagon official called Larry Franklin had passed classified information to an Israeli diplomat. Israel is hardly the only country that spies on the US, but its willingness to spy on its principal patron casts further doubt on its strategic value."
 
No need to steal oil to make great profits. Just sell it at much higher than the production costs (roughly $10/barrel in pre-war Iraq and Saudi Arbia). GWB and his "Oil CEO government" are making historically high profits for his oil industry friends at the expense of the US public.

Following is third footnote for my recent post in the "Oil at $200 per Barrel" thread of this forum.

***To illustrated how much GWB has distorted the historic US / ME relationships, note that Bush the father had the logistic support of and even some troops from Syria in the first war against Saddam's Iraq. Prior US presidents, especially Clinton, were able to work for peace in the ME, but GWB is only able to make wars there and destroy the development of democracies there. (There was one in Pakistan and Lebanon prior to GWB's wars and none has been achieved. Even nations are being destroyed - Sudan etc. and Iraq will soon be split into three separate ones. Then there will be civil war in Turkey as the Kurds in the south try to join the new Kurdistan created from destroyed Iraq.) In the thread “worst President” there is no contest for the title.

The $200 oil GWB is producing and the suburban infrastructure created by cheap gas when combined with the "twin deficits" GWB has produced (Clinton had budget surpluses, without GWB's war costs, “reward your friends” economic policies, oil CEO government for oil industry, etc.) plus lack of local food, will be reason why US collapses into chaos of armed gangs, looking for food in suburban basements.
 
Carcano said:
Remember how so many people predicted that the US would turn Iraq into a puppet state and then proceed to 'steal the oil'...that being the supposed original intention? Actually, this line of reasoning is ongoing.

But, now that a significant amount of time has passed, maybe its time to take a look and see if this is really happening.

Is the US getting Iraqi oil for free or for less than market value? Are they even buying it in significant quantities?
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In my humble opinion they never intended to steal the oil, because they never needed to. All they went to Iraq to do, was to protect the dollar monopoly on oil, i.e kick Saddam out, who was selling oil for Euros.
 
Nickelodeon said:
What?
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The US can print as many dollars as it likes, and then buy oil with it, I believe is what Ron was saying. Whereas, the rest of the world has to work for its cash (you see, in the rest of the world, money is actually worth something) and then buy dollars to buy oil.

Which is completely ridiculous.
 
Nickelodeon said:
Billy, you really think the US is destined to implode. Haven't people been saying this for years? ...
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Yes, and the evidence is accumulating that I have good foresight. See post of extracts from article that appear in Forbes in thread "How DUMB can US Voters Be? " of the Politics forum, small part of that post is reproduced here:

http://www.forbes.com/personalfinan...oapbox_inl.html

There, you will find three graphs (for those too lazy to read the long text):

(1) US personnel saving rate, (1960 to 2006). Showings it has gone from +12% to -1.7%; (Half of this 46 years of drop under GWB's economic guidance, as is the conversion from Clinton's surpluses to GWB's record setting federal deficits!)

(2) Debt Service Payments as percent of disposable income and CPI, (consumer price index, 1980 thur Q1 of 2006). Showing Debt Service fraction of your spendable income is up 40% and CPI has slightly more than doubled. Thus, even if your salary has more than doubled, your dept is 40% harder to carry. - Probably the main reason why first graph now has -1.7% saving rate. I.e. "Joe American," like "Uncle Sam," can no longer pay his expenses, but must continuely go deeper into debt each year. (How long do you think that can last, or is that a paraniod concern?)

(3) Existing median home price and CPI, (1990 to 2006). Showing they tracked each other well until 1996, but now home price is up 240% and CPI only 160%. Obviously this also can not last, but must correct. Never can any significant component of an average (any sort of average) continue to increase rapidly compared to the average itself.
 
All of the oil-producing countries of the world have either been bullied or bribed into only selling oil in dollars. For example, Saudi Arabia, from where most of the 9/11 hijackers came from, is great buddies with the USA despite the scant civil liberties of its citizens, harems, and their government wanting to bring back slavery....the reason? They agreed to only sell oil in dollars. The second they went back on this agreement they'd be labelled "terrorists".

It's widely known as "The Global Extortion Racket"
 
Nickelodeon said:
What's stopping countries from selling oil in other currencies?
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Two things, mainly:

(1) US bases in Saudi Arabia and the agreement with Royal House of Saudi to punish any other country (by pumping excess of oil demand to destroy the price they would receive) if they dared sell oil for Euros etc. The US part of agreement was to insure democracy did not come and sweep away the unpopular royal family, which is very backward in all human rights, compared even to China. - Women not allowed to drive, appear in public without male relative, many political prisoners (higher % of population than China, etc.)

(2) Thread and example of Iraq which dared to try to sell oil for Euros. Iran is now threatening to do so, so of course US will (probably via Israel proxy) make war on them also. Saudi Family kept there side of the agreement when Iraq began selling oil for Euros. - Remember when the price did dip to less than $15/barrel a few months before the war began? (During the uncertainty of war, the Saudi fields could not pump fast enough to hold oil price down, but by then US was punishing Saddam for his sin against the dollar.)
 
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G. F. Schleebenhorst said:
Even Russia, although that might soon change.
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Yes, Russia has now passed Saudi Arabia as world's greatest oil producer. I think Norway or at least the North Sea field is number three after the now second place Saudis, Perhaps US is # 4 and Venesuala or Nigeria is #5. Please some one Google and correct my guess (I am sure Russia recently claimed first postion, so look at date of your search results. Russia has been #1 for a month or two in the past, but will now hold that position into the foreseeable future.)
 
LARRYTHECABLEGUYJR said:
who cares abowt eourope or the midle east america shuld blow up the intire midle east and frans to.
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Good to see Dixie's "red necks" still can not think.
 
The US lost it's base in Saudi Arabia, but the whole US economy is based on oil, so he felt it necessary to secure the oil for the market. They didn't want to steal it as such, they just want to keep it flowing with no interference. They did steal billions from the US treasury for contractors and all sorts of shady dealings, however, none of which is audited. It was also a windfall to the defense industry.
 
spidergoat said:
The US lost it's base in Saudi Arabia, ...
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Is that true? All of them? I did not read of it, and think I would have noticed. When did it happen, and why? More details and reference please.

If true, it is potentially a very significant shift. Perhaps the Royal family is beginning to question how much of an asset (to them) the US is? I.e. if US or Israel does strike Iran, having US airbases in the kingdom may be too offensive to their extreme Islamic population and the royal family may fear they will lose control?

After his successes in driving Russians from Afghanistan (with CIA supplied equipment, especially stinger missiles) Bin Laden offered to drive the "godless communist government" from Yemen, but the Saudi Royal family would not let him. Soon after this rejection, Bin offered to drive the very secular Saddam from Kuwait, and was again rejected by the royal family, who instead asked the US into the kingdom, providing air bases, etc. This desecration of the holy land (for him) by presence of foreign forces so near to Mecca, their importation of alcohol, etc was completely unacceptable - the final straw. He openly opposed the royal family, and they striped him of his Saudi citizenship, froze his wealth (at US request) and 9/11, staffed by Saudis was the result. Just one of at least a dozen* of cases where the CIA's man turned against the US in the end.

If the US in the kingdom is no longer the royal wish, the dollar is doomed, soon. The deal that has propped it up is coming apart.
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*Saddam was another, fighting Iran for 8 years, helped by US satellite photos showing Iranian troop concentrations for targetting with the gas attacks. - Same gas the US installed government is now trying him for, but only for its use on his Kurds, not when US was helping him make gas attacks on Iranians. - Nothing wrong with gas attacks, only breaking from CIA control, trying to sell oil for Euros etc.. :bugeye:
 
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