Time Travel and Multiple Universes

[Diabolical Mind]

Time travel, as I was told/taught is traveling forward or backward in time. (Personally, why does everyone assume that you must travel... why can't you just stay still? In other words, why can't we just 'stop' time? Don't answer that though ) Okay, while typing, I just came up with another thought. Is time traveling, REALLY 'traveling'? Could it possibly be 'speeding' up time or 'rewinding' it. In other words, instead of moving from point a to point b, you catalyze the way time flows, or "fast foward" and "rewind" as I've previously said. Oh well, just trying to get the 'correct' definition of time travel.

Anyway, assuming that time traveling is moving from point a to point b then we are implying that your body, or what is time traveling, is just changing it's position. So, the whole "law of conservation" isn't broken, at least not yet. Now, we are also implying that time has a shape, because we are 'moving' from point a to point b, thus no 'fast forwarding" has occurred. Now, how are we moving from point a to point b? This must be clarified. If time DOES have a shape, then it must have boundaries, because all shapes have lines and are connected to one another. Now, just right there, we have said a lot. It may not seem like it, but I have. If time has a shape and shapes are closed figures like a circle, square, triangle etc... then time DOES end. If time goes on forever, then it is NOT a shape. Then, it would appear to be a shape, but one couldn't see the end of it nor beginning, assuming that there is an infinite past. Now, there is going to be a lot of assuming going on, because time travel has not yet been accomplished. Back to how we are moving from point a to point b. We must also clarify the direction which we are moving towards. If time goes on in a straight line, then we can only go straight. This also says a lot. This says that time has its own dimensions? (<----correct me if I am wrong right there) This says that time 'flows' forwards and possibly backwards. Forwards and backwards= 1 Dimension. What about the other directions? Upwards, downwards? Left, right? Who the fawk knows, that's not why I'm here! Ughh! Now, assuming that time ONLY has one 'dimension' or direction towards which to move, then one IS traveling through time. BUT! If time 'flows' as it appears to do, (I'm saying 'flow' because there isn't anyother word with which to describe how time moves... I could say move... ohwell) then... the ONLY way to travel through time... is to move faster than what time 'flows'.

I'm going to admit before I go ANY further, that I have no knowledge of physics at all besides what I've read in Hyperspace. Before I continue at all, I want someone to post something about what I've said... maybe add something, remove something. It's going to get good gais... I promise... cuz I'm gonna go into MULTIPLE UNIVERSES! YAY!

 

[jmpet]

I'm going to admit before I go ANY further, that I have no knowledge of physics at all besides what I've read in Hyperspace.

You should put that in the beginning of the post- it saves a lot of people time.

 

[Oli]

Time travel, as I was told/taught is traveling forward or backward in time. (Personally, why does everyone assume that you must travel... why can't you just stay still?

Taking "time travel" as a given:
You do stay still - physically and in relation to your surroundings.
The "travel" is from one moment/ time period to another - treating time as another dimension (similar to length/ width/ height).

Okay, while typing, I just came up with another thought. Is time traveling, REALLY 'traveling'?

You're at one "place" in time and then another - how else would you describe it?
It's a linguistic thing, since we don't have time travel as an everyday occurrence then we don't have the vocabulary to express it, so we use familiar metaphors.

Could it possibly be 'speeding' up time or 'rewinding' it. In other words, instead of moving from point a to point b, you catalyze the way time flows, or "fast foward" and "rewind" as I've previously said. Oh well, just trying to get the 'correct' definition of time travel.

Meh, that depends on how you travel.
H G Wells's Time Machine did do that, (the movie shows it very well, passing of the seasons etc. as the inventor watches), other "vehicles" in fiction just "disappear" from one moment in time and "reappear" at another.

Anyway, assuming that time traveling is moving from point a to point b then we are implying that your body, or what is time traveling, is just changing it's position.

Yes and no (again): it depends on how the author wants the thing to work, H G Wells's machine remained in place, Strontium Dog (a character in the 2000AD comic) had a "time bomb" which moved a victim into the past by a number of seconds, when the victim "arrived" at the past the planet was no longer underneath him (as it moved through space) - almost instant death from explosive decompression.

So, the whole "law of conservation" isn't broken, at least not yet.

If you're "moving" (don't forget that because spacetime is the fabric of reality, you can swap any one dimension for any other [theoretically]), so motion is motion.

Now, we are also implying that time has a shape, because we are 'moving' from point a to point b, thus no 'fast forwarding" has occurred.

I'm not quite sure how you get that it has a shape.

Now, how are we moving from point a to point b?

Well that's the problem

If time has a shape and shapes are closed figures like a circle, square, triangle etc... then time DOES end. If time goes on forever, then it is NOT a shape.

Doesn't follow: strictly speaking a circle doesn't have an end, or what if time is an infinitely long helix?

If time goes on in a straight line, then we can only go straight. This also says a lot. This says that time has its own dimensions? (<----correct me if I am wrong right there) This says that time 'flows' forwards and possibly backwards. Forwards and backwards= 1 Dimension.

If you restrict yourself to, say, height, you can only move in straight line, same with any of the other dimensions.

What about the other directions? Upwards, downwards? Left, right?

Nope, see above, if you're moving in one dimension only then you can only move in a straight line.

BUT! If time 'flows' as it appears to do, (I'm saying 'flow' because there isn't anyother word with which to describe how time moves... I could say move... ohwell) then... the ONLY way to travel through time... is to move faster than what time 'flows'.

Not strictly true: you could "jump" forward (or back), or figure some hyperspacial-type shortcut (but the overall effect would still be that of "moving faster than time" since you get to the future before your contemporaries who are doing the old fashioned one second per second way).

 

[Diabolical Mind]

Nice! I love you. Moo-ah. <---That's me kissing you, if you're a male. *hugs* The only thing I disagree with you is time having a shape. As you have said, time travel is a linguistic thing for which there is no word. So, if you are moving forward in time, you are invariably moving through something for which there is also no word. For that something, I just gave it a shape. On the part about a circle having an end... i was referring to how it is closed. Look at this 'O' You see how it is closed? If you were inside the 'O', you could not get out of it, and it is therefore closed. That's what I was talking about. We are IN time... and IF time has a shape then it could possibly end.

I'll continue the rest of my thread tomorrow... I just wanted to get the definition of time travel clarified. In my next post, I will make a numerical list of statements which set out to describe time travel. All numbers bigger than the last depend on the smaller number being true. This means that if number 1 is false, all of the other statements are false. Then, with the definition clearly set, I will talk about other arguments/stuff about time travel.

 

[PieAreSquared]

by then the thread should be moved to where it belongs

 

[Oli]

Nice! I love you. Moo-ah. <---That's me kissing you, if you're a male. *hugs*

Eeeuw, kisses.
Or something.

The only thing I disagree with you is time having a shape. As you have said, time travel is a linguistic thing for which there is no word. So, if you are moving forward in time, you are invariably moving through something for which there is also no word.

If you're moving in only one dimension (or along a dimension) how do you know what shape it is until you get outside of it?
If you can only move along, say, a log spiral (and that's all you can perceive) how do you know that it's anything other than a straight line?*
You can only go backwards or forwards...

For that something, I just gave it a shape. On the part about a circle having an end... i was referring to how it is closed. Look at this 'O' You see how it is closed? If you were inside the 'O', you could not get out of it, and it is therefore closed. That's what I was talking about. We are IN time... and IF time has a shape then it could possibly end.

Ah, I was thinking of moving along the circle (not inside it).
But, we are also IN length, ( and height, and width) - it's only the fact that we perceive the combination of those that lets us see shape and realise they exist.

I'll continue the rest of my thread tomorrow... I just wanted to get the definition of time travel clarified. In my next post, I will make a numerical list of statements which set out to describe time travel. All numbers bigger than the last depend on the smaller number being true. This means that if number 1 is false, all of the other statements are false. Then, with the definition clearly set, I will talk about other arguments/stuff about time travel.

Okay, but don't be surprised if this thread ends up in Pseudoscience - it IS pure speculation.

* [Edit] Actually you could infer the shape even if you were limited to movement along a spiral, but the allowable movement remains backwards or forwards [EndEdit]

 

[Oli]

by then the thread should be moved to where it belongs

Pfft said that!
You just jumped in while I was typing.
Yup, I noticed BenTheMan checking it out, I'd put money on it being shifted.

 

[BenTheMan]

Hi DM---

I'm moving this thread to pseudoscience, NOT because time travel isn't something that can't be contemplated scientifically, but because it seems that this isn't the aim of this thread.