The Matrix Defense?!

M

Mystech

Adult Supervision Required
Registered Senior Member
Looking through CNN I happend uppon an article which outlines a bit about recent court cases in which defendence have used the defence that they thought they were trapped in the Matrix when they commited brutal crimes, in an attempt to be found not guilty by reason of insanity.

So far, they have.

Just last week, Hamilton, Ohio, resident Tonda Lynn Ansley was found not guilty by reason of insanity after claiming she thought her landlord was part of a conspiracy to brainwash and kill her. Ansley shot the woman several times in the head in July 2002.

"They commit a lot of crimes in 'The Matrix,'" Ansley allegedly told police. "That's where you go to sleep at night and they drug you and take you somewhere else and then they bring you back and put you in bed and, when you wake up, you think that it's a bad dream"

Last September, a San Francisco man, Vadim Mieseges, made a successful insanity bid after claiming he had been "sucked into 'The Matrix'" when he chopped up his landlady.

And Joshua Cooke, an Oakton, Virginia, man charged with murdering his parents this February, "harbored a bona fide belief that he was living in the virtual reality of 'The Matrix,' claimed his defense attorney. Cooke is scheduled to stand trial at the end of June.

Even Lee Boyd Malvo, accused in the series of deadly sniper shootings in the Washington, D.C.-area last fall, reportedly wrote the words, "Free yourself of the Matrix," in seized jailhouse sketches.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/05/21/ctv.matrix.insanity/index.html
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Anyone have any thoughts on this? Is there any validity in this defense, or is it just bunk?

The article goes on to describe other movie based insanity pleas, and I've got to admit that after reading it I do think that there is at least a small basis for these kinds of defense.
 
I have such little faith in America or Americans. 90% of what I see in America is xenophobia and an almost blinkered existence. They (for the most part) genuinely don't understand why the Arab world is so angry with them, and that's actually a sad thing.
 
People hear about this sort of thing and get the idea that in the American justice system it's easy to get away with crimes by coming up with a wacky defense, but that just isn't the case. It's very difficult to get off with an insanity plea in America. Nearly everyone who attempts to plead insanity is eventually convicted. For someone to be found not guilty by reason of insanity there has to be an overwhelming amount of evidence that the person actually is insane.

Also, keep in mind that these people aren't just released back into the street. If you're found not guilty by reason of insanity you're probably going to spend the rest of your life locked in a mental hospital. While that's certainly preferable to prison for most people, it's not as if you're really getting away with your crime.
 
Originally posted by Siddhartha
I have such little faith in America or Americans. 90% of what I see in America is xenophobia and an almost blinkered existence. They (for the most part) genuinely don't understand why the Arab world is so angry with them, and that's actually a sad thing.
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Really, what relevance did this have to the topic? You're perfectly free to start your own "Why I hate America" thread, but if you're not going to connect it to the topic presented in this thread, then please just shut up.
 
Originally posted by Nasor
People hear about this sort of thing and get the idea that in the American justice system it's easy to get away with crimes by coming up with a wacky defense, but that just isn't the case. It's very difficult to get off with an insanity plea in America. Nearly everyone who attempts to plead insanity is eventually convicted. For someone to be found not guilty by reason of insanity there has to be an overwhelming amount of evidence that the person actually is insane.
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Anyone see 15 Minutes?

"Be careful. I can kill you. I'm insane."

I think it was a great movie and a fitting commentary for the American "Justice" system.
 
Originally posted by Siddhartha
He was probably right :bugeye:

http://www.simulation-argument.com/matrix.html
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That has to be one of the stuidest bunch of tripe I have ever read. I certainly don't believe that this guy is a "British Academy postdoctoral fellow in the philosophy faculty at Oxford University" as he claims. If he is I'll have to re-evaluate my idea of Graduates of Oxford University as being educated people. Aparently in all of his studies this guy has never heard of an arbitrary claim.
 
Originally posted by one_raven
Anyone see 15 Minutes?

"Be careful. I can kill you. I'm insane."

I think it was a great movie and a fitting commentary for the American "Justice" system.
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Well try to remember that, as the article says, less than 1% of all cases in which the insanity plea is used does it acctualy work.

Pleading insanity isn't a get out of jail free card. One can't just say "Well wouldn't you have to be crazy to kill someone?" and skip out on punishment, there's got to be a lot of evidence, and past history supporting this kind of thing.
 
Originally posted by Mystech
That has to be one of the stuidest bunch of tripe I have ever read. I certainly don't believe that this guy is a "British Academy postdoctoral fellow in the philosophy faculty at Oxford University" as he claims. If he is I'll have to re-evaluate my idea of Graduates of Oxford University as being educated people. Aparently in all of his studies this guy has never heard of an arbitrary claim.
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Maybe he should start posting here at SciForums.
He would fit right in.
 
Originally posted by Mystech
Well try to remember that, as the article says, less than 1% of all cases in which the insanity plea is used does it acctualy work.
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Granted.
But the ones that DO work (think of the Twinkie defense here) are a sad enough commentary, don't you think?
 
The twinky defense acctualy worked? I remember hearing about that but didn't follow up on it.
 
im gonna break with the flock and say i think the matrix defence is valid. Crazy people have been stating that they beleive themselves to be in unreal realitys, or traped in illusions, or persued by conspiracys for much MUCH longer than the matrix has existed. The fact that this movie came out and it was very popular just means crazy people already thinking like this got to say "Hey, thats what my feelings of being in an illusion and persued by a conspiracy are all about!"

they were going to be crazy anyway, and claim that insanity did it to them, they just took the matrix name too. This sort of defence is much older than the movie.
 
Originally posted by Nasor
People hear about this sort of thing and get the idea that in the American justice system it's easy to get away with crimes by coming up with a wacky defense, but that just isn't the case. It's very difficult to get off with an insanity plea in America. Nearly everyone who attempts to plead insanity is eventually convicted. For someone to be found not guilty by reason of insanity there has to be an overwhelming amount of evidence that the person actually is insane.

Also, keep in mind that these people aren't just released back into the street. If you're found not guilty by reason of insanity you're probably going to spend the rest of your life locked in a mental hospital. While that's certainly preferable to prison for most people, it's not as if you're really getting away with your crime.
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That' sia very good point. They make it look rather easy in movies and TV but getting away with the claim of insanity is rather tough and a ardous process on the defendant's part...I believe Gotti the mob boss use that defense to get out of normal conviction.
 
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