I was wondering why the christian god only has been around for 2000 years? Why did it take so long for him to finally convey the 'true' christain message to the people.
maybe someone has an answer.
maybe someone has an answer.
the age of the christian god
- Thread starter spuriousmonkey
- Start date
Why ask?
You know they're going to have an answer and you know they're going to make pointless bible references and you know in the end they will have effectively said nothing.
You know they're going to have an answer and you know they're going to make pointless bible references and you know in the end they will have effectively said nothing.
me stupid
The Book of John
Christian's believe God the Father has been around forever. The Alpha and Omega.
In the context of the question, that Jesus Christ having been around for only 2000 years, in his human form this is true, but Christians also believe Jesus is the "Word". As the Son of God he too has existed eternally.
John 1
The Word Became Flesh
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it. "
I can't say that this will convince you, but that's the short answer.
Christian's believe God the Father has been around forever. The Alpha and Omega.
In the context of the question, that Jesus Christ having been around for only 2000 years, in his human form this is true, but Christians also believe Jesus is the "Word". As the Son of God he too has existed eternally.
John 1
The Word Became Flesh
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it. "
I can't say that this will convince you, but that's the short answer.
Biblical God, of course according to bible, existed for quite long time..! Jews, Christians and Muslims refering to God of Adam, God of Abraham down to Jesus & Mohammed.
I've seen somewhere on the net that Abraham written in hebrew or arabic is equivalent to Brahmma written in sanscrit. Sara Vs Sarasvati, wife and consort of Abraham and Bramha respectively. Brahmma is not worshipped like Shiva or Vishnu, but venerated as very wise and cause of creation in Hindu pantheon. I'm not sure about the connection.. It could be a coincidence.. not sure... for and against could be discussed by experts, in detail without getting passionate or lunatic..
I've seen somewhere on the net that Abraham written in hebrew or arabic is equivalent to Brahmma written in sanscrit. Sara Vs Sarasvati, wife and consort of Abraham and Bramha respectively. Brahmma is not worshipped like Shiva or Vishnu, but venerated as very wise and cause of creation in Hindu pantheon. I'm not sure about the connection.. It could be a coincidence.. not sure... for and against could be discussed by experts, in detail without getting passionate or lunatic..
words, words and more words
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it. "
Seven Great Words, again based on the sacred three sounds A U M. These produced creation, or the manifestation of the seven planes of our solar system. They are committed not to human entities, but to the seven great Devas or Raja-Lords who are the ensouling lives of a plane; hence in the various initiations their collaboration is necessary, before these key words can be committed to the initiate.
http://beaskund.helloyou.ws/netnews/bk/initiation/init1060.html
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it. "
Seven Great Words, again based on the sacred three sounds A U M. These produced creation, or the manifestation of the seven planes of our solar system. They are committed not to human entities, but to the seven great Devas or Raja-Lords who are the ensouling lives of a plane; hence in the various initiations their collaboration is necessary, before these key words can be committed to the initiate.
http://beaskund.helloyou.ws/netnews/bk/initiation/init1060.html
Bridge,
The term ‘son’ implies offspring. Doesn’t this mean that the father would have to come first and the son comes later? In which case the son cannot have existed eternally.
If they both existed eternally then the term ‘son’ has no real meaning as we understand it.
The use of the word ‘son’ seems more to do with the emotiveness that can be conjured when talking about sacrificing one’s only begotten son. Otherwise it doesn’t seem to have any value apart from its use in the Christian indoctrination process.
Just a minor point, and I know how Christians aren’t too keen on logic but…
The term ‘son’ implies offspring. Doesn’t this mean that the father would have to come first and the son comes later? In which case the son cannot have existed eternally.
If they both existed eternally then the term ‘son’ has no real meaning as we understand it.
The use of the word ‘son’ seems more to do with the emotiveness that can be conjured when talking about sacrificing one’s only begotten son. Otherwise it doesn’t seem to have any value apart from its use in the Christian indoctrination process.
maybe I do
christians might believe that there god has been around forever, but why has this god never been mentioned before as the christian god. Surely an allpowerful god could correct the false notions that have been created about him. Surely it was not in the best interest of mankind to not make gods own presence not clear right from the start. From day one people must have gone straight to hell, because they didn't know god was around and they didn't know how to live a proper life, since jesus hadn't even been born yet. What's the logic in that...i don't see it.
Very good observation. Temporal perception is key. The Word has existed eternally with God who is three in one. The Word was incarnated as Jesus, 2000 yrs ago. Thus, the Word was Jesus; Jesus was the Word Incarante and Jesus was the Son of God. If they are the same entity, just like H2O = Ice = Water = Steam, it follows that, in essence, the Word who is also referred to as the Son of God has existed as long as God has. Instead of looking at the molecular strcuture [which seems to be the rationale on this site] you look deeper at the atomic structure - alas! They're the saaaaaaaame thing!?!?
Temporal reference again. People on this website really have a problem with this. 2000 yrs ago, the Word became incarnate through Mary as her son. Since God was the one who effected the pregnancy and no man did, well, you'd assume He's the Father.
I agree to an extent, but as was shown above, it still has meaning. In any event, only those who understand Christianity and don't just criticize it would understand that the context in which Son is used functions as an analogy to the sacrifice which God made in coming down to earth in the first place.
Christian Education Thread
Well, Christianity has been around for only 2000 yrs [go figure]. In essence, the Hebrew god [God of the Jews] is the Christian God, except that we understand his nature differently.
He's trying, but you just aint listening. Matthew 13:14-15; "... "These people will listen and listen but never understand. They will look and look, but never see. [15] All of them have stubborn minds!...
Well, He actually did.Gen 1:28; "God gave them His blessing and said: Have a lot of children...".
Well they, were actually instructed.Gen 1:28-29; 2:15-17; 3:17-19... etc
The Christians on this site need to start a Christian Education thread like one of those "... For Dummies" books - and I'm not referring to anyone as a dummy. Smart people read those books.
Well from your illustrated understanding of Christianity... that's good.
Hmm... please don't mind my attempted humour.
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Hmmm, I like that idea of the Christian Education Forum. I'm not christian but it would help others who have no faith and read the bible to understand it better.
Originally posted by MarcAC
The Word has existed eternally with God who is three in one. The Word was incarnated as Jesus, 2000 yrs ago. Thus, the Word was Jesus; Jesus was the Word Incarante and Jesus was the Son of God. If they are the same entity, just like H2O = Ice = Water = Steam, it follows that, in essence, the Word who is also referred to as the Son of God has existed as long as God has.
Can God take any form as He feels it is necessary.. Do all christians agree with the reincarnation of the Word as Jesus, the Son ?
Starting a fresh thread to elaborate on this would be interesting.
Marcac,
The phrase ‘what tangled webs we weave when we practice to deceive’ comes to mind. Having created the myth of Jesus without completely thinking through the implications resulted in the eventual farce of the trinity in a futile attempt to avoid admitting the mistake of creating the Jesus myth in the first place. That’s the trouble with fantasies, they have no basis in reality so just like cartoon characters they can be used to claim that anything is possible, even the impossibility of 3 separate things being one thing, when to even the simplest mind that is clearly impossible and defies intelligence definition.
Once you introduce god the father and god the son and a ghost then you have three entities and not one. There is no conceivable way that you can rationally argue that three things are one.
The OT clearly states there is only one god. The Christianity myth screwed up and created a massive contradiction for itself which pretty much condemns it to the scrap heap of other impossible fantasies where it belongs.
And ‘sacrifice’, what sacrifice? I think you don’t understand your own religion. God (the father) didn’t sacrifice anything; if you read your myth correctly you’ll find that Jesus allegedly sacrificed himself. But sacrifice implies a real loss but how can eternal god(s) lose anything? Certainly not their lives.
Only if you define eternity as beginning in the 4th century when the fantasy of three in one was created in a transparent attempt to overcome the Christian embarrassment of claiming there is only one god and at the same time claiming a father god and a son god.
The phrase ‘what tangled webs we weave when we practice to deceive’ comes to mind. Having created the myth of Jesus without completely thinking through the implications resulted in the eventual farce of the trinity in a futile attempt to avoid admitting the mistake of creating the Jesus myth in the first place. That’s the trouble with fantasies, they have no basis in reality so just like cartoon characters they can be used to claim that anything is possible, even the impossibility of 3 separate things being one thing, when to even the simplest mind that is clearly impossible and defies intelligence definition.
Now I fully understand your desperation and need to show there is a precedent for the impossibility of three things being one thing but the H2O story doesn’t work. Ice, Water and Steam are not H2O, but three separate substances that use H2O as building blocks. A more appropriate analogy is house bricks which can be used to construct a house in one case and then a mansion in another case. They are both made from bricks but no one would claim that the house and the mansion are the same thing.
Once you introduce god the father and god the son and a ghost then you have three entities and not one. There is no conceivable way that you can rationally argue that three things are one.
The OT clearly states there is only one god. The Christianity myth screwed up and created a massive contradiction for itself which pretty much condemns it to the scrap heap of other impossible fantasies where it belongs.
LOL. Dream on kiddo. And by “rationale on this site” I assume you mean we tend to keep to reality rather than trust to fantasies.
”Son” still implies a product that came later. Since I have just destroyed your trinity farce you are still stuck with explaining a father/son relationship where both cannot be eternal.
So you are saying that people have just made a simple mistake by assuming Jesus is a son, right? So that means that John 3:16 is equally nonsense “for god so loved the world he gave his only son …”.
Right!!! Or it might just be that I understand Christianity so well that I can see right through its transparent attempts at deception.
And ‘sacrifice’, what sacrifice? I think you don’t understand your own religion. God (the father) didn’t sacrifice anything; if you read your myth correctly you’ll find that Jesus allegedly sacrificed himself. But sacrifice implies a real loss but how can eternal god(s) lose anything? Certainly not their lives.
Re: Christian Education Thread
my point was that these instructions never arrived with the first humans. He let generations of humans go pass by without making his presence clear.
these quotes are from the bible...the bible hasn't been around since the first humans came about, since they probably couldn't even read or write then. We also know that there have been many other religions before christianity. So why would god create this confusion and condemn people to ignorance and possibly hell.
my point was that these instructions never arrived with the first humans. He let generations of humans go pass by without making his presence clear.
these quotes are from the bible...the bible hasn't been around since the first humans came about, since they probably couldn't even read or write then. We also know that there have been many other religions before christianity. So why would god create this confusion and condemn people to ignorance and possibly hell.
jesus christ was born 2,003 years ago. below is a picture of what jesus would look like if we were to do an autopsy. anyway, god suposidly created the earth 6,000 years ago.
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Johann, my man
lets make a few clarifications on your previous post. We don't really know exactly when Jesus was born. Oddly enough even the experts are not sure. I have read accounts that Christ was born anywhere from 7 BC to 2 BC but hardly anyone thinks the year was exactly as we now base our calendar's starting point.
Why?
One reason aside from poor record keeping methods, is the Jewish calendar is based on a 29.5 day lunar month and a 354
day lunar year.
Only according to the fundamentalists who read the genealogies like Bishop Usher. He claimed that he had deduced the EXACT age of the earth, to the day:
October 22, 4004 BC.
Amazing isn't it? Either my Bible has some pages missing or his Bible was a lot more accurate than mine. Stop and think about it. How would he know on what month, day, hour or minute everyone was born? For that matter think about how many changes have been made to the measuring of years through the ages.
If Usher were alive today his theory would be ripped to shreds by more logical thinkers. Unfortunately, Church authority wasn't questioned much in the old days.
lets make a few clarifications on your previous post. We don't really know exactly when Jesus was born. Oddly enough even the experts are not sure. I have read accounts that Christ was born anywhere from 7 BC to 2 BC but hardly anyone thinks the year was exactly as we now base our calendar's starting point.
Why?
One reason aside from poor record keeping methods, is the Jewish calendar is based on a 29.5 day lunar month and a 354
day lunar year.
Only according to the fundamentalists who read the genealogies like Bishop Usher. He claimed that he had deduced the EXACT age of the earth, to the day:
October 22, 4004 BC.
Amazing isn't it? Either my Bible has some pages missing or his Bible was a lot more accurate than mine. Stop and think about it. How would he know on what month, day, hour or minute everyone was born? For that matter think about how many changes have been made to the measuring of years through the ages.
If Usher were alive today his theory would be ripped to shreds by more logical thinkers. Unfortunately, Church authority wasn't questioned much in the old days.