The actual question - "Why don't you kill yourself?"

Enmos said:
Yes I do. What do you think causes it ?
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Then the distinction you made between my genes making me think I know certain things and my ability to restrain myself was not correct. Both would be controlled by genes.



At some level, yes I think so.
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There you go.
Both determined. Both genetic.


You were the one calling my view deterministic. I adopted it.
Is determinism really that black and white ?
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If yours isn't feel free to point out where you think you are not determined and how. What I will do is start another thread and invite Myles over to it and you and he can fight it out. Cause he sure as shit isn't going to tolerate ideas of randomness or semi-free will.


I don't remember telling you that what you think you know is governed by your genes. Can you point out to me where I said that ?
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you're right. You said it was determining how I feel.
It is determined that you feel like you do now, but there is nothing stopping you from shutting up.
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But you have the same problem here in relation to determinism. My genes are controlling how I feel right now but nothing is stopping me from shutting up. Well, 1) that seems to miss the point about how much feelings control what you do. I don't want to stop talking, which, in your view, would be controlled by my genes.

That is where I don't think you understand determinism.


At some level yes.
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Right. So saying nothing is stopping you from shutting up is a strange thing to say. You were implying that some of my acts are controlled by genes and others are not.

If you want to put forward a case for semi free will, please do. I would love to see you and Myles have a taste of arguing with each other. Maybe then you would understand my 'attitude.'
 
I said I wanted to discuss this in a civil, if Sowhat is going to be an asshole all the time he can forget it.
 
Enmos said:
I said I wanted to discuss this in a civil, if Sowhat is going to be an asshole all the time he can forget it.
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1) you basically told me to shut up.
2) now you have called me an asshole.
3) and both of us, according to you, are simply living out the dictates of our genes. I don't know why your beliefs have so little effect on how you experience other people.
 
194.
I am optimistic about Greenberg.
I also PMed him to apolagize for my part in derailing the thread. He responded in good humor. He was alive then.
But your well aimed and succinct irony - obviously including in its target me - was spot on.
 
clusteringflux said:
17 hours
10 pages
192 posts

90% of it about genes. Greenburg done killed himself hours ago!
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This is one of my fastest threads! Yay!

yay.jpg




Anyway, it's telling the way it turned, there being such an emphasis to talk about genes.
The OP question is a tough one, it's the sort of thing that wakes you up at 2 AM and doesn't let you go back to sleep.
Humans are prone to escapism.
Blaming the whole survival issue on the "genes" is a swift and relatively clean way to escape thinking about troubling things. The genes are "yours" after all, so it's not like you are obviously in denial.
 
sowhatifit'sdark said:
194.
But your well aimed and succinct irony - obviously including in its target me - was spot on.
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It was your g... ....

Well, I didn't have my hopes to high when I posted this thread. It's a delicate subject after all. Escapism, denial, superficiality and conisderations of legal consequences are to be expected.
 
genes have nothing to do with the fear of death and i have no selfpreservation instinct. genes mostly just determine physical things like appearance.

our environment (friends, family) is one reason why we don't kill ourself, but the biggest reason is that people like to live. most people also seem unsure what happens after death. you know this already.
 
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sowhatifit'sdark said:
I was pointing out the absurdity of Enmos' determinism as revealed in this quote:


After both of you talked about how your genes prevented your suicides AND he is now talking about how 'what I know' is determined' he somehow thought I was free to 'stop talking' as if this act was not guided by genes, and environment and totally determined.

And before you say he was being ironic, when I pointed this out he said



Well, gosh. No.

But if anything bothers you about any of this, Myles, my genes made me do it and they are preventing me from being swayed by your arguments.
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I agree with your last statement except I would argue that your genes and your environment have made you what you are. You had no control over either.

Why should I be bothered ?
 
Myles said:
Why should I be bothered ?
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Because you have no control of it either since your genes have set you up to react in ways that were probably better suited to the veldt. But it's good to know that this is really the root of it, so I don't take your analysis of my 'pseudo philosophical' interests seriously.

Note: I was the one that pointed out you and Enmos were leaving nurture out of your answers. But thanks for the echo in your correction.
 
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