Strange Form of Buddhism NO ATHEISTS

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lixluke

Refined Reinvention
Valued Senior Member
This Buddhist was telling me about his religion.
I wanted to know more information about what exactly this is all about.
NO ATHEISTS.


Here is what he described:
The universe created itself through a chain of events.
The universe is you.

The universe is ruled by the force called “Mystic Law” (Cause and Effect).
This force is within all beings.

Or the universe is ruled by a being called “Mystic Law”.
After a great battle, the being released the most sacred power into the universe.
Sacred power is: (love? Creation? Cause/effect?)
Although a being that rules over the universe unleashed this power, the ruler of the universe is not a being, but a force, cause/effect.

The universe is regrettably undergoing chaotic change.
Time in the Universe goes much faster than on earth.

There are many planets with life.

Earth/Solar system is a young part of the universe. Milky way is also young.
Many previous civilizations were lost, and recreated on Earth.

Earth is a rural planet.
A rural planet is where beings attach to material things, but are not yet organized.

Humans are in training.
The humans purpose is to save the universe from destruction by chaotic change.
In order for this to happen, humanity has to awaken their powers.
Upon awakening, and understanding of your true self, answers will come by themselves.
Humans undergo a long battle daily against chaos.
Soon, a great battle will start, and humanity will fight.

Star seeds arrive to earth holding great history and wisdom.
Therefore, there is much more to life than what we know on earth.
Part of this wisdom is the understanding of the Mystic Law.

Love is the key to fulfilling the mission of awaking your power, and battling chaos.
The ruler and protector of the universe has been lost.
The ruler supposedly dies to unleash the great power, but this is unconfirmed.
It is our destiny to find this being.
 
I know it is a Nichiren form which uses the power phrase:
Nam Myoho Renge Kyo.
 
What's the question?

The universe created itself through a chain of events.
The universe is you.

The universe is ruled by the force called “Mystic Law” (Cause and Effect).
This force is within all beings.
Click to expand...
I generally agree with this.

The rest is largely examples of traditional Buddhist cosmology, an early form of scientific inquiry. Sometimes universal laws are defined as a being, sometimes not. The being is probably yourself.

Upon awakening, and understanding of your true self, answers will come by themselves.
Click to expand...
Yes.
I am an atheist :p , but most Buddhists are, too. Some are not, the result of Buddhism's flexibility in adapting to native cultures where it was introduced.
 
According to him, the universe is yourself.
Then I ask him what is this sacred power. Then he does not want tell me.
That is pretty screwed up.

I just found something about www.fromthestars.com.
 
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OK. I have to mention that my friend is huge fan of Sailor Moose.
Although I have never watched it, I am sure much of his ideas come from that cartoon.
 
cool skill said:
According to him, the universe is yourself.
Then I ask him what is this sacred power. Then he does not want tell me.
That is pretty screwed up.

I just found something about www.fromthestars.com.
Click to expand...
Your mind creates the universe by experiencing it.
 
cool skill said:
This Buddhist was telling me about his religion.
I wanted to know more information about what exactly this is all about.
NO ATHEISTS.


Here is what he described:
The universe created itself through a chain of events.
Click to expand...
ask him HOW does he knows this?did he see it happen?
The universe is ruled by the force called “Mystic Law” (Cause and Effect).
This force is within all beings.
Click to expand...
whats this force looks like?whats it made of?
Or the universe is ruled by a being called “Mystic Law”.
After a great battle, the being released the most sacred power into the universe.
Sacred power is: (love? Creation? Cause/effect?)
Although a being that rules over the universe unleashed this power, the ruler of the universe is not a being, but a force, cause/effect.

The universe is regrettably undergoing chaotic change.
Time in the Universe goes much faster than on earth.
Click to expand...
typical meaningless unsubstantiated mumbo jumbo fantasy.
There are many planets with life.
Click to expand...
WHERE? SHOW us some!
 
It is confusing to call the law of cause and effect "mystic law", but it is very simple. Causes preceed effects, which then become causes for other things, seamlessly. It is fascinating that Buddhist philosophers came up with this by introspection and observation.
 
cool skill said:
This Buddhist was telling me about his religion.
I wanted to know more information about what exactly this is all about.
NO ATHEISTS.


Here is what he described:
The universe created itself through a chain of events.
The universe is you.

The universe is ruled by the force called “Mystic Law” (Cause and Effect).
This force is within all beings.

Or the universe is ruled by a being called “Mystic Law”.
After a great battle, the being released the most sacred power into the universe.
Sacred power is: (love? Creation? Cause/effect?)
Although a being that rules over the universe unleashed this power, the ruler of the universe is not a being, but a force, cause/effect.

The universe is regrettably undergoing chaotic change.
Time in the Universe goes much faster than on earth.

There are many planets with life.

Earth/Solar system is a young part of the universe. Milky way is also young.
Many previous civilizations were lost, and recreated on Earth.

Earth is a rural planet.
A rural planet is where beings attach to material things, but are not yet organized.

Humans are in training.
The humans purpose is to save the universe from destruction by chaotic change.
In order for this to happen, humanity has to awaken their powers.
Upon awakening, and understanding of your true self, answers will come by themselves.
Humans undergo a long battle daily against chaos.
Soon, a great battle will start, and humanity will fight.

Star seeds arrive to earth holding great history and wisdom.
Therefore, there is much more to life than what we know on earth.
Part of this wisdom is the understanding of the Mystic Law.

Love is the key to fulfilling the mission of awaking your power, and battling chaos.
The ruler and protector of the universe has been lost.
The ruler supposedly dies to unleash the great power, but this is unconfirmed.
It is our destiny to find this being.
Click to expand...


'The universe created itself through a chain of events' - For something to create something it has to exist before the thing it creates. For something to create itself, it would therefore have to exist before it existed. This is a contravention of the first rule of logic that something cannot simultaneously be and not be in respect of the same concept.

Hence if you accept this proposition, no further logical discussion is possible. Discussion is of course aviailable but it cannot be logical. This is what I have normally found with buddhists, although my contact is only with 'western' ones. They do not wish to have any logical or rational discussion of their belief. Buddhism really does seem to need completely blind faith to overcome its logical impossibility.

regards,


Gordon.
 
spidergoat said:
It is confusing to call the law of cause and effect "mystic law", but it is very simple. Causes preceed effects, which then become causes for other things, seamlessly. It is fascinating that Buddhist philosophers came up with this by introspection and observation.
Click to expand...

And what do you believe was the first effect and what was its cause?

regards,

Gordon.
 
Buddhists don't believe in a first cause. They postulate a never ending cyclical universe, a logical deduction from the premise.
 
The Buddha believed in the "uncreate", which was never created, and thus is not subject to creation, preservation, destruction or anything else that created things are subject to. This is how The Buddha says eternal bliss is possible in a world where everything is ever-changing, bound to ceaseless suffering.

As for cause and effect, the Buddha believed that every moment was an entirely new existence or reality. This new existence or reality is determined by its previous cause. He also said speculating about such things as the origin of the universe was useless.

As for the universe being you, The Buddha never said that. He said that there was no soul or self, but a mind that was spiritual, and all of our thoughts create our world.
 
VitalOne said:
He said that there was no soul or self, but a mind that was spiritual, and all of our thoughts create our world.
Click to expand...
Actually, he didn't say that either.

When asked if the Soul/Self exists he basically said the same thing when asked about speculating about the origins of the universe.
It is essentially a useless, unnecessary waste of time.

Annata is a practice or strategy, as opposed to a "belief".

Some good reading on the topic
 
one_raven said:
Actually, he didn't say that either.

When asked if the Soul/Self exists he basically said the same thing when asked about speculating about the origins of the universe.
It is essentially a useless, unnecessary waste of time.

Annata is a practice or strategy, as opposed to a "belief".

Some good reading on the t
opic
Click to expand...

Anyone who reads actual Buddhists scripture (primary sources) instead of secondary sources will find that The Buddha does indeed reject the ideas of the soul and self as well as many other ideas, he also tells people to give up worshipping God (he even gave many atheistic arguments against the idea of God but believed in many celestial beings like devas and suras).

Here, the very question came up on whether The Buddha believed in the soul or not. The Buddha himself said:

"The Tathagata teaches that there is no self. He who says that the soul is his self and that the self is the thinker of our thoughts and the actor of our deeds, teaches a wrong doctrine which leads to confusion and darkness."

"On the other hand, the Tathagata teaches that there is a mind. He who understands by soul mind, and says that mind exists, teaches the truth which leads to clearness and enlightenment."

"Verily, I say unto thee, thy mind is spiritual,but neither is the sense-perceived void of spirituality." (Gospel of Buddha, Chapter 52)

Many times The Buddha himself rejects the idea of the self:

"There is rebirth of character, but no transmigration of a self.Thy thought-forms reappear, but there is no egoentity transferred.The stanza uttered by a teacher is reborn in the scholar who repeats the words." (Gospel of Buddha, 53.9)

"There is not a self residing in Name and Form, but the co-operation of the conformations produce what people call a man." (40.13)

"There is no self in the carriage and there is no self in man." (40.14)

"Therefore, O bhikkhus, as there is no self, there is no transmigration of a self; but there are deeds and the continued effect of deeds. There is rebirth of karma; there is reincarnation." (40.17)

"The body is like a machine, and there is no self in it that makes it walk or act, but the thoughts of it, as the windy elements, cause the machine to work." (40.20)

"Since then, O bhikkhus, there is no self, there cannot be any after life of a self. Therefore abandon all thought of self. But since there are deeds and since deeds continue, be careful with your deeds." (40.31)

The Buddha even goes as far as to say:
"The foolish man conceives the idea of 'self,' the wise man sees there is no ground on which to build the idea of 'self,' thus he has a right conception of the world and well concludes that all compounds amassed by sorrow will be dissolved again, but the truth will remain" (86.9)

So like I said, The Buddha rejects the ideas of the self and soul, but believes in the mind which is spiritual. He believes that all that we are is an aggregation of different things.
 
VitalOne said:
Anyone who reads actual Buddhists scripture (primary sources) instead of secondary sources...
Click to expand...
Did you read what I linked to?
Here's a direct link to the article.
It is hardly a "secondary source".
All the quotes in the article, which was written by an eminent Buddhist scholar, come directly from the Pali Canon - you can't get any more "primary" than that.

Where are all your quotes coming from?

"(Gospel of Buddha, Chapter 52)" is certainly not a valid reference to any book of the Pali Canon, therefore must be a "secondary source", I suppose.

What is the "Gospel of Buddha"?
Who wrote it?
It is certainly possible that whoever wrote the "Gospel of Buddha" was quoting the Pali Canon directly, but without a reference to a book in the Canon (which is the standard when discussing what the Buddha actually said), I have no way to look it up and see it in context.

You seem to know somtething about Buddhism, so I feel fairly certain you know what the Pali Canon is, correct? I hope so.
If you do, then you must be aware that anything outside the Pali Canon, can not be considered a "primary Source" since it IS the "primary source" that all else in Buddhism is based on.
 
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spidergoat said:
Buddhists don't believe in a first cause. They postulate a never ending cyclical universe, a logical deduction from the premise.
Click to expand...

Yes an infinite universe is logically possible unlike a universe creating itself at some point which is logically impossible.

The problem of a cycling infinite universe is that entropy is not apparently cycling. It appears to be a one way direction of increase (Second Law of Thermodynamics). This then causes you a real problem with infinitely old universes. You have to reset or reverse entropy (or a combination of both) or else you get 'heat death' which we clearly do not have. In fact you have to do the reversing or resetting an infinite number of times in an infinite universe. to avoid total entropy and heat death. So what is the Buddhist explanation for resetting or reversing entropy so that an infinitely old universe does not suffer heat death but does recycle if there is no external force to be the cause of those effects?


regards, Gordon.
 
I read a book by the Dali Lama about Buddhism and science. He said that ancient Buddhist cosmology was a best guess based on the tools they had, and that we should be open to what modern science reveals.
 
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