God created everything on this earth for man's use (so sayeth the bible). You can say that even using drugs like marijuana and cocaine and heroin can be justified because god created the plants that these drugs are derived from. Now how about god's creation of science? Can we use the laws of science to manipulate and change genetics in order to create new life forms? Life forms that haven't existed before? Are we playing god? Or are we just using the tools that he has given us to do as we please? Besides, if we can create new life then ultimately god made it possible to do so. Therefore he has to share some of the blame.
should we play god?
- Thread starter mario
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We have eaten of the tree of knowledge, how can we resist?
Interesting thing about the tree of knowledge. It's funny how the tree of knowledge was off-limits but not the tree of life. We were expelled from the garden so that we wouldn't eat of the tree of life. Why wasn't the tree of life prohibited in the beginning as well? Also, the tree of life is seen as a symbol for the kaballah. So we have eaten of the tree of life as well. God can't keep anything from our grasp. Not that he's really trying.
Interesting thing about the tree of knowledge. It's funny how the tree of knowledge was off-limits but not the tree of life. We were expelled from the garden so that we wouldn't eat of the tree of life. Why wasn't the tree of life prohibited in the beginning as well? Also, the tree of life is seen as a symbol for the kaballah. So we have eaten of the tree of life as well. God can't keep anything from our grasp. Not that he's really trying.
god doesn't share blame. god takes credit for humanity's love and mercy and compassion, but murder and genocide and various other atrocities are our fault, 'cause god gave us free will and we ****ed up.
as for new forms of life, why not? sounds like fun. i'd love to have a plant that cleans my room and digests people on command. besides, if god gave us science, then what could possibly be wrong with it?
as for new forms of life, why not? sounds like fun. i'd love to have a plant that cleans my room and digests people on command.
besides, if god gave us science, then what could possibly be wrong with it?Symbolic? I thought the bible was the word of god?
Of course, it was symbolic. But that doesn't change anything. We have still eaten from it. We eat from it more every day. The tree of life is also symbolic. And only a select few eat from it's symbology.
Of course, it was symbolic. But that doesn't change anything. We have still eaten from it. We eat from it more every day. The tree of life is also symbolic. And only a select few eat from it's symbology.
No, the bible is the word of God when noone is going around poking at the holes in it, whereas its only symbolic when athesits and the like start poking their nose in all the things that dont make sense.
i dont see any reason why we cant play God, as long as we work out the consequences before we do it.
its sort of ironic, but i think the reason we havent yet begun to play God (properly) is because of his 'word'. e.g. morals and shit like that.
i dont see any reason why we cant play God, as long as we work out the consequences before we do it.
its sort of ironic, but i think the reason we havent yet begun to play God (properly) is because of his 'word'. e.g. morals and shit like that.
I think we are not yet able to play god because we are too dumb.
Perhaps we can alter some genes here and there, sculpture nature the way we want it to be. But we are not intelligent enough to now what the consequences might be. We simply have to evolve a bit more until we can play god. Right now we can only play wacky mad scientist.
Perhaps we can alter some genes here and there, sculpture nature the way we want it to be. But we are not intelligent enough to now what the consequences might be. We simply have to evolve a bit more until we can play god. Right now we can only play wacky mad scientist.
invert_nexus said:We have eaten of the tree of knowledge, how can we resist?
Interesting thing about the tree of knowledge. It's funny how the tree of knowledge was off-limits but not the tree of life. We were expelled from the garden so that we wouldn't eat of the tree of life. Why wasn't the tree of life prohibited in the beginning as well? Also, the tree of life is seen as a symbol for the kaballah. So we have eaten of the tree of life as well. God can't keep anything from our grasp. Not that he's really trying.
The tree of life was there to give them eternal life. Before they ate from the tree of knowledge they could eat from the tree of life. When they ate from the tree of knowledge they lost access to the tree of life and therefore grew old and died.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
Mario,
Kat
Why not? There is nothing to stop us. But we should ask ourselves why we would want to. Probably the greatest value of genetic engineering will be to re-create ourselves into a more resilient format where all life threatening diseases including the disease of aging are no longer present.
No of course not since life evolved and was never created. But biological evolution on this planet has reached a point where self-aware intelligence has arrived, humans, who are now on the verge of taking control of their own future destiny and evolutionary path, or at least being able to change from a very long and entirely undirected process into one that can be planned.
Can’t say that we have ever been given anything. Everything that man has achieved and learnt has been a very long and painful struggle. Our destiny is entirely in our hands as it has always been, whether that is to destroy ourselves in a nuclear war or emerge as a more advanced species using our immense creativity and potentially growing intelligence.
As long as we don’t let myths like that prevent us from advancing then feel free to believe it.
Unfortunately there is no such supernatural safety-net. What we do next and how we alter ourselves and survive or destroy ourselves is entirely in our hands.
Kat
peaches?
okay, so that may be irresponsibility, but i would wager there are safe guards to prevent stuff like that from happening.
In the simple view, but the Kabbalah is also the tree of life. Ever heard about it? It's used to be a secret, but secrets are hard to keep nowadays. Not that I believe in either tree. But, the jews who wrote the genesis myth did.
Its obvious god didn't want us to eat from the tree of knowledge because we'd inevitably find out he was a liar (as we have- in case you didn't notice).
But, god ensured that we would eat from the tree by telling us not to. He's tricksey. Oh yes, he is.
I think playing god is at the root of a lot of religious debate. It seems that the Christian/Muslim split is based around this issue. Christians worship Jesus, who was a man who became god. Muslims stick to the principle that man may not be a god. Christians ignore the contradictions set up by this principle.
It can be said that by judging god, by saying that decisions he has made are wrong or not morally correct is a way of playing god. You are taking god's responsibilities onto your own shoulders. We all play god by not allowing our every action to be dictated by religious constraints.
I think playing god is at the root of a lot of religious debate. It seems that the Christian/Muslim split is based around this issue. Christians worship Jesus, who was a man who became god. Muslims stick to the principle that man may not be a god. Christians ignore the contradictions set up by this principle.
It can be said that by judging god, by saying that decisions he has made are wrong or not morally correct is a way of playing god. You are taking god's responsibilities onto your own shoulders. We all play god by not allowing our every action to be dictated by religious constraints.
“ Probably the greatest value of genetic engineering will be to re-create ourselves into a more resilient format where all life threatening diseases including the disease of aging are no longer present. ”
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M*W: It's closer than you think. Scientific laboratories all over the world today, with the exception of the USA, are finding ways that stem cells can turn a damaged heart into a healthy one. I've seen it happen. In fact, I would bet that there are many laboratories in America doing the same thing. America is falling behind on scientific research, and it's the right-wing Christian mentality that is hurting all of us.
Yes, there will be a day come soon where we will "officially" be able to grow new skin in the lab for burn patients, inject stem cells into infarcted heart muscle--even if it's the patient's autologous stem cells. We've been doing bone marrow transplants for decades. Stem cells are rife in bone marrow. The same type of stem cell transplantation can heal the liver (as in hepatitis or cirrhosis), the pancreas in diabetes, the neurons in the brain to cure such diseases as Parkinson's and Alzheimer's diseases. There are endless scientific possibilities that would make humanity healthier and live longer (maybe for eternity?).
We've found that there is a lot we CAN DO without embryonic stem cells. But we could do more with them. The whole ethical issue is inane. That's like calling a woman a murderer each month she passes an ovum that didn't get fertilized! Cloning is a whole different matter, and although I don't think it's ethically wrong, I don't believe we know enough about it for use in humans. We know we can clone animals (sheep, cat and dog), but the health outcomes aren't promising in the long-term. They have too many negative health issues as they mature. Sound familiar? That seems to be what's happening to humans!
Now we know disease simply doesn't hit us when we're in our mid-50s. The disease process has been going on for most of our lives yet we had no symptoms! Most of the damage has already been done, but how were we to know? No symptoms--no disease--but this isn't necessarily true. We can be healthy as a horse one day with no symptoms of anykind, and the next day, have a massive heart attack! Scientists are just now realizing that some of the diseases that befall humans have been lying dormant for 30-40 years and giving us no cause for concern. So, old age is a figment of the imagination. We're no longer "as old as we feel."
And for all those joggers and obsessive exercisers out there--there is a new syndrome called "sports heart" for short. It's being found in a much younger population of healthy people with healthy lifestyles. They exercise so much that it actually damages the heart muscle and causes a myocardial infarction (heart attack). I have a childhood friend this happened to. She was a PE teacher and head of the drill team. Always athletic, healthy and young looking, and at 51 she had a massive heart attack with NO previous symptoms!
Oh well, I digress. I think it's time we accessed what health cures are already available to us. Calling it immoral or unethical is a political stance. There's no room for politics in medicine.
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M*W: It's closer than you think. Scientific laboratories all over the world today, with the exception of the USA, are finding ways that stem cells can turn a damaged heart into a healthy one. I've seen it happen. In fact, I would bet that there are many laboratories in America doing the same thing. America is falling behind on scientific research, and it's the right-wing Christian mentality that is hurting all of us.
Yes, there will be a day come soon where we will "officially" be able to grow new skin in the lab for burn patients, inject stem cells into infarcted heart muscle--even if it's the patient's autologous stem cells. We've been doing bone marrow transplants for decades. Stem cells are rife in bone marrow. The same type of stem cell transplantation can heal the liver (as in hepatitis or cirrhosis), the pancreas in diabetes, the neurons in the brain to cure such diseases as Parkinson's and Alzheimer's diseases. There are endless scientific possibilities that would make humanity healthier and live longer (maybe for eternity?).
We've found that there is a lot we CAN DO without embryonic stem cells. But we could do more with them. The whole ethical issue is inane. That's like calling a woman a murderer each month she passes an ovum that didn't get fertilized! Cloning is a whole different matter, and although I don't think it's ethically wrong, I don't believe we know enough about it for use in humans. We know we can clone animals (sheep, cat and dog), but the health outcomes aren't promising in the long-term. They have too many negative health issues as they mature. Sound familiar? That seems to be what's happening to humans!
Now we know disease simply doesn't hit us when we're in our mid-50s. The disease process has been going on for most of our lives yet we had no symptoms! Most of the damage has already been done, but how were we to know? No symptoms--no disease--but this isn't necessarily true. We can be healthy as a horse one day with no symptoms of anykind, and the next day, have a massive heart attack! Scientists are just now realizing that some of the diseases that befall humans have been lying dormant for 30-40 years and giving us no cause for concern. So, old age is a figment of the imagination. We're no longer "as old as we feel."
And for all those joggers and obsessive exercisers out there--there is a new syndrome called "sports heart" for short. It's being found in a much younger population of healthy people with healthy lifestyles. They exercise so much that it actually damages the heart muscle and causes a myocardial infarction (heart attack). I have a childhood friend this happened to. She was a PE teacher and head of the drill team. Always athletic, healthy and young looking, and at 51 she had a massive heart attack with NO previous symptoms!
Oh well, I digress. I think it's time we accessed what health cures are already available to us. Calling it immoral or unethical is a political stance. There's no room for politics in medicine.