Rise Of Atheism
- Thread starter yank
- Start date
yank said:
You are misled then. Atheism is not a system of belief. I suggest you start with some background reading about what atheism, and agnosticism are, and then come back.
Atheism - lack of belief in the theistic God.yank said:
Some atheists go further and have a belief in the non-existence of God, but it is not required to be an atheist.
Often there is a distinction between the WEAK atheist (one without belief) and the STRONG atheist (one with belief in the non-existence).
Agnosticism is related to knowledge, not belief.
So you can have agnostic theists, agnostic atheists, or atheists and theists that are not agnostic.
I have no links to numbers.
here are a few I've found, they might help.
http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2006/03/atheism_is_the.html
http://www.canicula.com/wp/?p=125
http://www.car-forums.com/s8/t20774.html
http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/living/religion/14121950.htm
http://forum.ebaumsworld.com/showthread.php?t=128005
http://www.atheistnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?t=11793&
you will notice that a lot refer to the non-religious, non-religious does not necessarily mean atheist, atheism is not simple non-religious.
there are some who say they are atheist that dont really understand what an atheist is, (these are usually the religious, trying to make a point, or agnostics, or deists).
there are no god/gods, all it would take is one single instance of the thing for it to exist, where is that one thing.
atheist from the greek atheos a (without) and theos (god).
Atheism is "without belief in god." Therefore, an atheist would have "no belief."atheism, is not a belief, just the opposite, atheism is the natural way of things, the religious have just diversified in to fantasy.
dictionary.con defines it as
1. Disbelief in or denial of the existence of God or gods.
2. The doctrine that there is no God or gods.
however two points here, it's not a belief, so there cannot be any disbelief, and there cannot be be any denial, for to deny something you must first believe it exists. I believe that atheism, is an indifference to the issue of God's existence, dictionary.com's second statement is closer
encarta defines it as, unbelief in God or deities.
most dictionaries get it wrong, because they were originally written and printed by theists.
We are all born atheists til our parents or priest abuse us with the religious mind virus
atheism is individual, there is a commonality amongst atheist, but each has his own opinion, however atheism has a basic tenet. it's just a way of life, there are no clubs, no churches, atheism is what you are, before religion has taken hold, nobody who has been atheist from birth or rediscovered it/cleared his head, would go back to being religious not without the use of drugs or brain damage.
http://www.intheagora.com/archives/2006/03/atheism_is_the.html
http://www.canicula.com/wp/?p=125
http://www.car-forums.com/s8/t20774.html
http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/living/religion/14121950.htm
http://forum.ebaumsworld.com/showthread.php?t=128005
http://www.atheistnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?t=11793&
you will notice that a lot refer to the non-religious, non-religious does not necessarily mean atheist, atheism is not simple non-religious.
there are some who say they are atheist that dont really understand what an atheist is, (these are usually the religious, trying to make a point, or agnostics, or deists).
there are no god/gods, all it would take is one single instance of the thing for it to exist, where is that one thing.
atheist from the greek atheos a (without) and theos (god).
Atheism is "without belief in god." Therefore, an atheist would have "no belief."atheism, is not a belief, just the opposite, atheism is the natural way of things, the religious have just diversified in to fantasy.
dictionary.con defines it as
1. Disbelief in or denial of the existence of God or gods.
2. The doctrine that there is no God or gods.
however two points here, it's not a belief, so there cannot be any disbelief, and there cannot be be any denial, for to deny something you must first believe it exists. I believe that atheism, is an indifference to the issue of God's existence, dictionary.com's second statement is closer
encarta defines it as, unbelief in God or deities.
most dictionaries get it wrong, because they were originally written and printed by theists.
We are all born atheists til our parents or priest abuse us with the religious mind virus
atheism is individual, there is a commonality amongst atheist, but each has his own opinion, however atheism has a basic tenet. it's just a way of life, there are no clubs, no churches, atheism is what you are, before religion has taken hold, nobody who has been atheist from birth or rediscovered it/cleared his head, would go back to being religious not without the use of drugs or brain damage.
usp8riot
Registered Senior Member
Even the religious have individual opinion. They just all have a commonality of the same religion or ideals, as atheists have a commonality of ideals. There's different religions and denominations just as there is types of atheists and so on. You can try to categorize religion all you want, but it won't work. To make it seem like us against them. I don't go to church. I usually thought it was 'stupid' and gave me that icky feeling. Now I just don't go because nobody I know in church shares my exact same beliefs, just like atheists don't group together in a church or place of belief because they don't share exact same beliefs. I was an atheist and went to religion. I am one in none I guess, either that or you are generalizing, which I take it as the latter.
No - all atheists have one thing in common - they do not hold to the belief that God exists.usp8riot said:
You are either theist or atheist.usp8riot said:
You either have a belief that God exists (any God at all: the Christian God, the personal God, Zeus, Jupiter etc) or you don't have that belief.
It really is that simple.
Fair enough - but you are still a theist.usp8riot said:
There are only 2 types of atheist: all atheists don't have a belief in God's existence, and there are some that have a belief in God's non-existence.usp8riot said:
That's it.
That's the only 2.
It is easy to categorise atheists into one or other of these camps.
And all of them have the same lack of belief and one group also share the same belief (in the non-existence of God).
There is no deviation from this.
Theists on the other hand have a whole plethora of varying beliefs - and many have no idea what they actually believe in.
But they all have the same underlying belief in a God - usually just one - and it is in the description of this God in which their beliefs differ.
Most would argue that you could not have consciously been an atheist and then turn to become a theist.usp8riot said:
At best you just didn't know which God you believed in, and were probably apathetic to religion, especially the structured religions.
But an apathetic theist is a long way from being an atheist.
i am an atheist and fit into the catagory of having the belief of no god. i dont care what other people think of me thats just the way that i am
yank said:
It's not about 'here' though is it? It's about the terms, and they are universal.
You can't start a debate if you don't understand the terms, and clearly, you don't.
redarmy11: sarkus clarifies it for us, thus,
so geeser it's more than likely that usp8riot is'nt lieing just mistaken. as I agree, a definite impossblity.sarkus said:
usp8riot
Registered Senior Member
I found out on my own. Here is a quick copy of one of my posts from another board, although it's a couple years old and have since found more theories. This here is just reinforcing the idea of God, not exactly explaining how He could exist. Read more of my posts if you want to know. I don't have time to search, copy, and paste everything. And when explaining your ideas of God, don't expect someone to come up with a short simple answer:
"God realizes we are not perfect. He made us this way. Well, you may think if he is a perfect God, then why didn't he make us perfect? That takes us back to a simple law of mathematics again. A composition of objects can never be mathematically perfect, i.e., if we have two perfectly round spheres in a dynamic 4D space and try to combine them to be perfect, it's mathematically impossible because perfection is the simplest, most efficent state one object can be in. Actually, saying one object would be redundant since the very essence of perfection can only be one. If you count both spheres as being one, then you have an asymetrical shape which is mathematically inefficient for storage. If you consider them separate as two perfect circles they would still be considered insufficient when one would be more efficient and allows for an infinite volume since the value of pi is a variable. Hence, there is no such thing as two mathematically perfect objects. And as One, sequentially being the father of all after it, One knows the starting point of all after, it's history, and how it algorithmically evolved because it is the one that can see all that came after it.
And if God is infinite, hence an infinite universe. If it wasn't it would come to a stopping point and even if that stopping point was composed of a border circle, the border circle itself couldn't be perfect or else it would negate the fact that the universe started from one perfect circle. And if anything perfect was outside the border of the universe, if we suppose it had one, would negate the previously stated perfect object which would be a very inefficient use of space which defies the laws of perfect. So there can only be one perfect object (God) anywhere. Coincidentally, it relates to pi being infinite. This provides an infinitely ever-expanding area for an infinite God and an infinite universe while retaining the laws of mathematics and still being perfect at the same time.
And any event that takes place in the universe can based on a mathematical operation. That's why I also believe that nothing is random/chaotic as some scientists would believe. Everything can be calculated by God and sometimes by us in less complex reactions. But randomness creates inefficiency, chaos, and that which God has no control over or else it wouldn't be a pure random process. And since that being true, I don't believe in random processes. I have yet to ever see one exist. I believe God has laws by which he created life and as well as to morally guide us by. He is a God of perfection, of order, and law. God doesn't have to abide by the law, he is perfection, which means he is the law. Atleast the law as He made our universe.
Taking that He has infinite wisdom, He may be able to conceive another perfect universe somewhere using different laws which it would seem to break the law of perfection, if you will. I'm an open source guy open to any new information so I leave that possibility open since God is the greatest mathemetician of all. I can't figure out how there could be another perfect universe out there unless I'm a little off on my definition of perfect. But the most efficient use of volume is the sphere and if you add another perfect universe coexistent to ours, then the sphere would create null space, an imperfection. But with an infinite galaxy, who would need more space? Or dual infinities for that matter? And creating double standards of laws would seem contrary if you're using the simplest, efficient, algorithm there is; 0 and 1."
But taking that one guy here couldn't understand one of the simplest, logical reasons for God, about the rolling ball, even when put in lamens terms, I don't expect many to understand this. I know some people don't pick up logic that well, or claim to anyway.
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usp8riot
Registered Senior Member
If I thought it would be advantagous to make friends on here or jester with others, I wouldn't mind saying some of the commentaries are funny. But I believe it best not to get too aquainted with people nor too dislikened by them. To rightfully treat someone, you can't be their friend or their enemy. If you are a friend, you will be more likely to not stick up for wrong if the person does wrong to someone and if your enemy, you are more likely to persecute them if done something wrong. So forgive me if some of you may find my lack of emotion boring. I may have joked here and there on earlier posts but I think I should start acting more the way I believe even if it doesn't give me any more friends.