Rehabilitation for Criminals - would it ever be enough.

Quantum Quack

Quantum Quack

Life's a tease...
Valued Senior Member
I am not sure how to pose this question that has been running around in my head for ages.

It seems that for some time now the Judiciary are tending towards rehabilitation of convicted criminals more and more as a part in their reduced sentencing.
I wanted to get some discussion if possible about how much value there is in philosophy and morality of rehabilitation.

To pose an Ideal:

Imagine in the not to distant future [in a galaxy far far away] medical science is able to treat and rehabilitate the criminal mind, the irrational mind and provide a complete cure for the conditions and conditioning that led to the crimes being committed.

I ask these few question:
Would it be enough to satisfy the need for justice?

Is punishment still required even though rehabilitation of the criminal is complete?

Is our maturity as a species in question when we require punishment for crimes committed even though we have the power to avoid those crimes in the first place?

Premise in abstract:
Most criminal behaviour are the product of systemic and personal abuse that conditions a person to act with criminal intent. That the criminal is in fact acting in a compensatory fashion for the percieved crimes already committed against him in the past.

I do understand that this is often an emotive issue and by all means let it all hang out so to speak.

Care to discuss?
 
What country do you live in? I live in America and we could use a bit more of progressive spirit towards the issue of rehabilitation. Our prison population has been growing ominously since the seventies and in 2003 it went over two million. We imprison a larger percent of our population than any other nation.

I favor rehabilitation over incarceration. I don't think a judicial system should be about revenge as such. It may sound cliché but our methods of incarceration don’t do anything to fix the root problems of what causes crime.

The formula of confine, beat, rape, release, doesn’t make law abiding citizens out of people. Violent offences should warrant prison time, but drug and property crimes just don’t warrant incarceration.
 
See, that's the problem with you damned liberals. Rehabilitation, what is that? Sounds to me like nothing but being soft on criminals, teaching 'em how to knit or whatever Nancy skills that you think they might actually help them get out of their ghetto lives and have some hope of holding a job and living a decent law-abiding life once they're released.

My opinion is that we're just not hard enough on criminals, we need to up the ante as it were. It's a well known fact that things are just flat out worse than they used to be, children don't respect their elders, and this country is going to hell in a handbasket. Criminals need to know that when they get caught they'll be held longer, beaten harder, and raped by bigger dicks. That's the only way to combat crime, to set up the government to be a drunk and angry father who will beat you to within an inch of your life with his belt for talking back to your mother. You've got to put the fear of the law into them, it's the only thing they know. That's the reason the draconian code worked so well, by the way, we'd all probably be better off if anyone (especially a person of color) accused of a crime was just executed on the spot.
 
When you rehabilitate a criminal to fully cure him, are you not manipulating his mind to use as a means to society's ends? Are you not forcing him to be useful to society?

On the other hand, it's useless to merely keep criminals around in jail and feed and clothe them and let them out only to bring them back to jail in a little while.
 
The problem is the crime, not the criminal. In our country, over 700,000 American citizens are arrested every year for marijuana. More than half of all inmates are incarcerated for non-violent crime associated with drugs.
 
"maybe we should put the innocent in jail and let the guilty roam free"
Some one once said.

"Where by the jailor becomes the jailed."
some one else,
and

"Society gets the criminals it deserves"

Possibly by focussing on the issue of rehabilitation society can learn how to prevent the disease and cure the problem rather than just relying on quarrantine......

For example:
If society devoted more resources towards providing education, poverty relief and social justice, then the need for society to pay the price for it's apathy would become less.

Afterall it is society that is paying the price .........yes?

I'm from Australia by the way......
 
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Hi Quack
Just a few thoughts

The reasons for imprisoning a person are but not limited to:

To reflect societies out rage at the transgression (particular length of sentence)
To act as a deterrent to others
To be punitive
To in some cases protect the person from him/her self
To protect society from the person
When all other avenues have been exhausted but failed
As far as I'm aware rehabilitation is not a motive to incarcerate but it is seen as an ideal time to do it



>>>Would it be enough to satisfy the need for justice?<<<

I would find no matter how altruistic or genuine the motive ,to alter someones personality or ego is far to invasive

>>Is punishment still required even though rehabilitation of the criminal is complete?<<<

As far as I'm aware rehabilitation is not a motive to incarcerate but it is seen as an ideal time to do it,so yes its still necessary

>>>Most criminal behaviour are the product of systemic and personal abuse that conditions a person to act with criminal intent. That the criminal is in fact acting in a compensatory fashion for the percieved crimes already committed against him in the past.<<<

Over 95% of inmates in my experience (Australia) had substance abuse directly involved in their crime or lifestyle
 
Thomo, thanks for your post.

Would society be happy with just comprehensive rehabilitation or does the need to punish overrule any gains made by such rehabilitation?
 
>>>Would society be happy with just comprehensive rehabilitation or does the need to punish overrule any gains made by such rehabilitation? <<<

With no punishment it would appear that you would get one freebee crime ,then you got "rehabilitated",I'm sure thats not your intent but a crime deserves punishment.
There is precious little rehabilitation in gaol. Ok it comes from within ultimatley but the ideal time to do is lost.
 
don't get me wrong i have no set postion or ulterior motive on thi ssubject. I find it vexatious as I am sure most people do as well.

i agree teh time in Gaol coul dbe better spent with intensive rehabilitation, and ceertainly this woudl be better than just keeping them for a number of years, destroying any ability to reenter society and expect redeeming behaviours....

But I wanted to test the abstraction of an ideal. Complete rehabilitation would serve no purpose if the person was spending the rest of his life behind bars howver fro lighter sentences the prisoner and most importantly society could do well with an intensive rehab program. especially if it comes to drug dependancy etc....
 
>>>Complete rehabilitation <<<

It has a chilling ring to it,how much of your original personality would you lose?

>>>would serve no purpose if the person was spending the rest of his life behind bars <<

Not entirely correct IMHO :) a life behind bars is not ideal but is a life none the less,if rehab improved that life is the rehab not then worth while?
 
>>>Complete rehabilitation <<<

It has a chilling ring to it,how much of your original personality would you lose?
Click to expand...

Complete rehabilitation would include the enhancemnet of an individual personality and not the mind washing scenario that you may be thinking of.

Proper rehabilitation and not motivated for control purposes...sort of thing is what i have in mind.....


>>>would serve no purpose if the person was spending the rest of his life behind bars <<

Not entirely correct IMHO a life behind bars is not ideal but is a life none the less,if rehab improved that life is the rehab not then worth while?
Click to expand...
Yes I do agree that rehab could improve life behind bars for the criminal but siciety is not all that interested in that prisoners life afterall.....sad as it is.......
 
>>>Is our maturity as a species in question when we require punishment for crimes committed even though we have the power to avoid those crimes in the first place?<<<

Is it possible that the fact that we have punitive measures is an indication that we set high standards of conduct and morality for our members? Therefore we have a mature society.
 
>>>Proper rehabilitation and not motivated for control purposes...sort of thing is what i have in mind.....<<<

Sounds like a nice ideal.....one thought, it is the differences in us that makes society the interesting place it is.
 
Sounds like a nice ideal.....one thought, it is the differences in us that makes society the interesting place it is.
Click to expand...
good question, however I would dare say that a person who has developed his personality to it's full potential would fail to be type cast into the genre of ciminal personalities and therefore interest or diversity of personality would be enshrined and maintained.

Scenarios of every one being the same just wouldn't happen. I dare say human nature would make that impossible.

I guess we get to the nightmare scenario where by people are expected to conform to a set government criteria as to what is nice and what is nicer.....but in my ideal i would let the person dictate direction as long as it involved the basic human rights of others.

I get the impression that you feel that criminality gives society flavour and I guess you are not wrong. It really comes down to whether you like the taste or not...hey?
 
>>>I get the impression that you feel that criminality gives society flavour and I guess you are not wrong. It really comes down to whether you like the taste or not...hey? <<<

I wouldn't have put quite like that :)
I do know personally a fair few and there is some real characters!...on a more serious note gaol is an ocean of wasted talent ,wasted lives and anger. Still you dont go to gaol for no cause.
 
>>>Would society be happy with just comprehensive rehabilitation or does the need to punish overrule any gains made by such rehabilitation? <<<

Victims and the families of victims (and possibly society as an entity) would probably not be happy.Revenge is often touted as the current catch phrase "closure".but revenge is a human motivator just as it usually has negative effects the presence of gaols could possibly been seen as a positive result.
 
so, if we assume for a moment that criminality is not of some genetic inherited causality, then really the only apporach is to rehabilitate society so that the societal causes of criminality are removed. In other words get the kids to blossom and solve the problem that way.
better education, social support structures, better parenting etc etc.

Rehabilitate society in conjunction with rehabilitating the inmate.
obviously rehabilitating the inmate alone would be insuficient.....
 
>>>so, if we assume for a moment that criminality is not of some genetic inherited causality<<<

To say "your average criminal " will invariably lead to over simplification and over generalisations but there are common traits:
-Generally some form of substance abuse
-A risk taking personality
-A lack of the tendency to consider the consequences of your actions

Address these traits and you will do wonders for possible and past offenders.Importantly get them young.

>>>Rehabilitate society in conjunction with rehabilitating the inmate.
obviously rehabilitating the inmate alone would be insuficient..... <<<

Yes but don't undermine societies principals in the process

In passing it occurred to me one way of reducing the number of criminal acts is to reduce the number of acts that are criminal
 
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