Reality Vs Perception

[razz]

I'm a non Christian,... I watch the forum on a daily basis, reading both Christians and non Christians slapping fact back and forth, debating who is right and wrong : "God exists, is God an alien, who said what to whom where within the bible and is it possible.. etc and I must say I get very tired of seeing both sides make absolute claims of truth .... Truth is based upon reality, since reality is based upon perception, and we all perceive things differently as individuals, then, your version of the truth is not necessarily mine or anyone else's... expecting another to take on your point of view or beliefs is not only arrogant but is indeed irrational.

Why is this so? .. Simply put you experience, endure and understand a myriad of sights & pictures, smells & tastes, sounds & feelings etc that are stored, deciphered and indeed rationalised and understood based on millions of intricate factors like education, location, environment, religion, upbringing, parental bias, discipline, brutality, kindness, etc etc etc the list goes on... these things all alter, and inevitably cause your unique life experience and view on life to absorb and form opinions factual or not, that are unique to you.
You only know, what you've experienced... no two people experience the exact same lives.

I have experienced quite alot by human standards, but through all my opinions and beliefs, beyond all my tantrums and soap box theories, a little part of me knows NOTHING IS ABSOLUTE....
My rational mind understands the bible as utter bullshit because there are too many holes, mistakes, flaws, contradictions and outrageous claims that simply are too unstable for me to base my entire life around... I imagine many Christians quietly see these irregularities in the bible to, but their faith either vindicates or shows them something I simply cant see .... I'm still positive I can recognise a load of hogwash should I see it, but my subconscious reminds me of a saying I heard as a child " ANY MAN WHO CLAIMS TO KNOW EVERYTHING, SHOULD ALSO KNOW HE DOES NOT" ... Nothing is absolute without all the answers, since not you nor I posses all the answers, possibility remains eternal... Many can't grasp this statement, many have simply absolutely decided God is or isn't real! water is wet! the sun is hot!...... But What if none of this is real?.... What if we are all victims of a cruel hoax? ...As unlikely as it is to me....maybe this is all some kind of matrix type deal where we are all just clones in storage being fed random images and stimulus?.. you cant guarantee I'm wrong ... you cant guarantee God exists... You cant guarantee laws of science etc are never going to be disproven ... all you can do is form an opinion, be comfortable with who you are.. enough to understand that without adapting to new possibilities, without keeping an open mind that all you believe may just be false, without this freedom to throw away the old and learn new things there will be NO personal growth and NO real understanding of anything..... Leave the absolutes for the ignorant.. Understand we here on earth know very little about the true nature of anything in the multiverse. we just like to think we do. Any thing is possible, so all we have is our own personal perception they may or may not be accepted by the many. ... Respect the views of others in life and on the forum, Christian or non Christian... no matter how unlikely their point of view.. they may just be right.
No this does not mean you have to accept their opinion, just their freedom to voice it.
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Cheers...
RazZ :bugeye:

 

[MacM]

Decent Post

Razz,

Nice job. Ever think of politics?

Actually, I make one exception to your arguements. Basically you seem to say anyone can voice any opinion. Within reason I could accept that.

However, the problem comes when Creationists attempt to force non-scientific views of faith into classrooms as being science.

There I draw a line and demand science remain true science, not distortions of evidence, fabrication totally unsupportable and outright shear nonsense based on nothing but the unproveable existance of God made it all.

 

[True Wisdom]

You have found enlightenment!

 

[True Wisdom]

Re: Decent Post

Originally posted by MacM
Razz,
However, the problem comes when Creationists attempt to force non-scientific views of faith into classrooms as being science.

I'm not sure about nation-wide but public schools in California, K-12 and collges, teach evolution as a standard subject in science classes as if it was no longer a theory. Not once have any creationist ideals were taught or forced upon students.

 

[razz]

MacM..

I agree with your sentiments 100% .. but maybe rather than push one ideal over another or teach others that one mans opinion is worth more than anothers .. why not teach both points of view?

Dont get me wrong .. I'm very much into sciences etc and agree that evolution and other such theories make much more sense than the bibles mythical tales, ..but having all view points, theories and assumptions from both sides will be sure to create and stimulate more credible opinions dont you agree?

My way is not the only way.. I have the right to see both sides of the coin and choose wich I prefer to identify with.
You must first know what you have inorder to know, what you have not.
Cheers
RazZ

 

[Cris]

But Razz, if the object is to determine truth and there are opposing opinions then why accept both when at least one cannot be true.

Where truth is not obvious then argument and debate will rage. This is a spice of life and one of the zestiest. And religious debate is possibly the most contentious.

 

[razz]

Cris..

Both opinions must be left on the table for how can one even concider he or she has found the truth when niether side has all doubt of validity removed?

Many christians are brought up never being given the choice to truely doubt or decide for themselves, instead they are told from birth God is, says, God wants, God is all that matters, Christians are going to heaven and athiests to hell.

Humans have always so arrogantly assumed to have found absolutes, from a flat world statements to the earth being the centre of the universe etc ..

No one said you have to accept both as being correct all at once, simply concider both still have merit until the day you can undoubtedly prove otherwise to all.

Concider all view points before making an opinion and even then understand that you may be wrong nomatter what the apparent truth. .. Nothing is absolute... it just seems that way for now.
What you claim to be the truth relies on millions of other factors to also be absolute and core stable.... something no one can guarentee.. so for now ..keep all possiblities open.

Can you guarentee me God and creation did or doesnt exist? can you guarentee me science wont update, change or prove its theories should new information never dreamed of suddenly come available?

As i said humans only know what humans encounter, so what previously unthought of mysteries lay unexplained just waiting to be discovered by humans a thousand years from now?.. will they look at us as we looked upon the scholars of galileo's day and laugh because we believed so strongly and absolutely in the child like theories of God or evolution? What if we are all wrong? what if we are all looking in the wrong direction and fighting over incorrect theories altogether? what if christians are right there was no absolute evolution? what if Evolutionists, athiests etc are right and there is no absolute God as taught in the bible?

I say.... know as much as you can and even then understand you still know sweet bugger all... in the arguement about Evolution and Creation nothing should be discounted as totally untrue just yet.. rather than makeing an absolute statement, simply say it is "more likely" or "less likely" then debate to your hearts content but allow people their own opinions... you might just learn something nomatter what side of the fence your on.