Radical Muslim cleric killed in Gaza clashes

Michael

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Radical Muslim cleric killed in Gaza clashes

A radical Muslim sheikh's call for the creation of an Islamic emirate in Gaza sparked clashes with Hamas forces that left 21 people dead and injured at least 121 others. Hamas forces blew up the home of Sheikh Abu al-Nour al-Maqdessi, leader of the radical group Jund Ansar Allah, or Soldiers of the Partisans of God, Hamas sources said.

Jund Ansar Allah is part of the radical Islamist movement that follows the doctrines of the "Salaf," or the predecessors -- referring to the early generations of Muslims. They reject all modern influences such as politics and government. But Hamas spokesman Sami Abu Zahri dismissed statements about the establishment of an Islamic emirate as "theoretical."It is not permitted to any party or individual to enforce their own laws because this is the responsibility of the security forces," he said.
This is quite interesting to me, and a bit confusing, I don't really understand what's going on.
 
Hamas is not amenable to Salafis using Gaza as a background for their extremism.

These clashes are quite common, what is unusual is their being reported in the MSM

An indication that things have changed where media priorities are concerned

Salafis from the Gaza Strip first stepped into the global spotlight in March 2007, when jihadis from Jaish al-Islam (Army of Islam) kidnapped BBC journalist Alan Johnston, who was based in the Gaza Strip. The group is a small faction among Salafis. They held Johnston hostage for four months, threatening to kill him and showing images of him wearing a suicide belt. Abu Mustafa says it was a legitimate tactic in the struggle for Islam. "It was nothing personal. It was a message to the West that they should release imprisoned Muslims." For the moment, he adds reassuringly, foreign journalists are not in danger in the Gaza Strip.

Indeed, Abu Mustafa says, he and his comrades in arms realize they need to be patient. There's a long way to go before they can begin their struggle for global influence. First, they have to take care of an enemy closer to home: Hamas.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,566740,00.html
 
Hamas is not amenable to Salafis using Gaza as a background for their extremism.

These clashes are quite common, what is unusual is their being reported in the MSM

An indication that things have changed where media priorities are concerned



http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,566740,00.html
Where are the police? What about the due process?

I mean, isn't there a police force? Courts? Judges?

Will the HAMAS now be charged as criminals? That's what I don't get it.
 
Hamas is the government. They were elected remember?

RAMALLAH, West Bank, Jan. 26 -- The radical Islamic movement Hamas won a large majority in the new Palestinian parliament, according to official election results announced Thursday, trouncing the governing Fatah party in a contest that could dramatically reshape the Palestinians' relations with Israel and the rest of the world.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/26/AR2006012600372.html

The last batch of cops they trained were killed by the Israelis in January

The bombing targeted the civilian infrastructure of Gaza – Al Quds hospital was bombed with white phosphorus, 4 schools were bombed, 5 kindergartens were bombed, the Ministry of Finance, and Ministry of Ex-Prisoners [of Israel] were bombed. Virtually every police station and many fire stations were demolished. The central police station and police academy were bombed just as the most recent graduating class were receiving their diplomas. 200+ new policemen were killed here alone. The Parliament building was destroyed. The industrial zones of Khan Yunis and Al Foukheiry were flatted – first by bombs, then with D-9 bulldozers (sold to Israel by Caterpillar). Some of UNRWA’s shelters for refugees were bombed. The vast majority of those killed were unarmed. Israel targeted police stations as part of “the infrastructure of terror” despite the fact that, under the Oslo agreements, police are explicitly identified as civilians.
http://gazaviews.blogspot.com/2009/06/detailed-account-of-impact-of-israels.html
 
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Hamas is the government. They were elected remember?
yes, which is why I asked the question.

The last batch of cops they trained were killed by the Israelis in January
The central police station and police academy were bombed just as the most recent graduating class were receiving their diplomas. 200+ new policemen were killed here alone.
Without digressing into a thread about Israel, I'm going to assume there are some police somewhere? I mean, this man (although crazy) with a fellow citizen - how can it be legal to bomb his house? It's crazy. Dog eat Dog? Just arrest him and go through due process. I can't believe there are zero judiciary or civil institutions? I mean, even a Mosque and a Cleric dishing out Islamic law would be better than blowing the man up in him home - UNLESS, there is civil war. But, I don't think that's the case here.

It just seems strange and I wouldn't mind a more fuller explanation.
 
Radical Muslim cleric killed in Gaza clashes

This is quite interesting to me, and a bit confusing, I don't really understand what's going on.

muslims being muslim. That’s what’s going on.

And he was not a "radical muslim cleric" he was simply a bit closer to being a true muslim then those who are with hamas.

This kind of stuff is going on over many parts of the muslim world all the time. The interesting thing is why is the media reporting this particular event?

Slow news day perhaps.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
Michael, umm due proccess? you mean like destroying 2 whole countries because of one man whos goverment simply asked for proof to the same standed as any other country would before extrodition?
 
Michael, umm due proccess? you mean like destroying 2 whole countries because of one man whos goverment simply asked for proof to the same standed as any other country would before extrodition?
No Asguard that's completely different. THAT is called spreading freedom. This on the other hand is a clear case of terrorism.
 
OK I find hamas having trouble with islamist extremeists terribly funny. Looks like the learned their enforcement techniques from Isreal too. Ah, the irony.
 
yes, which is why I asked the question.

Without digressing into a thread about Israel, I'm going to assume there are some police somewhere? I mean, this man (although crazy) with a fellow citizen - how can it be legal to bomb his house? It's crazy. Dog eat Dog? Just arrest him and go through due process. I can't believe there are zero judiciary or civil institutions? I mean, even a Mosque and a Cleric dishing out Islamic law would be better than blowing the man up in him home - UNLESS, there is civil war. But, I don't think that's the case here.

It just seems strange and I wouldn't mind a more fuller explanation.

Once you blow up the cop stations and destroy the judicial and political infrastructure by kidnapping or killing the leaders, the options become limited.

What do you do when the cops are killed and the courts bombed? When the university and hospitals and schools are destroyed? When your elected officials are kidnapped and put in secret prisons? When you are completely blocked access to any economy, rebuilding, cash to pay people with and transport into and out of your country? What options remain?


Do you have something other than a blogspot for that statement? Sorry.

The entire news service. Its not a secret that the Israeli adventure in Gaza commenced with missile strikes at two cop stations or that 200 plus cops were killed, including two new batches of graduates who were at the graduating ceremony

Here is the jpost account of it:
At least two senior Hamas commanders were killed in the air strikes. One was identified as Maj.-Gen. Tawfiq Jabar, commander of the Gaza Strip police, who was killed at the Gaza Police Academy during a graduation ceremony; 70-80 Hamas operatives were reported killed in that attack.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1230111718610&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

And ynet

An independent research company revealed Sunday that 90% of the Palestinian "security personnel" killed in Gaza during the IDF offensive there in January were members of terror organizations.

The IDF says 709 gunmen were killed in the fighting, of which Hamas has claimed 343 were innocent police officers.

But the independent Israeli 'Orient Research Group', hired by former Prime Minister Ehud Olmert to investigate the identities of those killed, has released a report challenging Hamas' claim.

The report says 286 of the 343 "police officers" killed were members of terror organizations, the vast majority of them belonging to Hamas' military wings.

http://www.ynetnews.com/Ext/Comp/ArticleLayout/CdaArticlePrintPreview/1,2506,L-3720759,00.html

By this logic, any cop or solidier who defends his land and people against a foreign military is a terrorist.

What IDF soliers are saying:

Let’s take a look at what some interviewees have said about Operation Cast Lead.

“We weren’t told outright to shoot anything we saw moving but this was the implication . . . I understood from the briefing that it’s better to shoot first and ask questions later.”

“We were fired at and we fired back toward suspect spots. What is a suspect spot? It means you decided it was suspect and could take out all your rage on it.”

“Because in training you learn that white phosphorus is not used, and you’re taught that it’s not humane. You watch films and see what it does to people who are hit, and you say, ‘There, we’re doing it too.’ That’s not what I expected to see. Until that moment I had thought I belonged to the most humane army in the world.”

“The guys would simply break stuff. Some were out to destroy and trash the whole time. They drew a disgusting drawing on the wall. They threw out sofas. They took down a picture from the wall just to shatter it. They really couldn’t see why they shouldn’t . . . We were allowed to do anything we want. Who’s to tell us not to?”

“When you enter a house on a mapping action, the family look at you but here you didn’t know if this was a terrorist’s house at all. So the assumption is that everyone is a terrorist and then it’s legitimate to do just anything we please.”

Others reported widespread use of civilian human shields forced to break into neighboring homes suspected of being booby-trapped or of containing armed men, which is a recognized war crime, as is the use of white phosphorus in a congested civilian area.

Another recounted how an unarmed old man carrying a torch was gunned down on the orders of his superior who refused to allow deterrent fire as the man approached. “His was a scream I will never forget as long as I live,” said the interviewee.

The report’s many detractors say it is unreliable due to the anonymity of witnesses but, in fact, it merely confirms earlier revelations from graduates of the Yitzhak Rabin Pre-Military Academy who spoke of the cold-blooded murder of Gaza civilians.

As a result, the academy’s director, Danny Zamir, was smeared and vilified as someone who aids Israel’s enemies. As expected the IDF was exonerated by a judge who closed a military police investigation into accounts of human rights violations by troops in Gaza.
http://onlinejournal.com/artman/publish/article_4931.shtml

Note that the Israelis have refused external investigators including Goldstone
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1242212422316

OK I find hamas having trouble with islamist extremeists terribly funny. Looks like the learned their enforcement techniques from Isreal too. Ah, the irony.

I don't see the comparison. In Israel those who want to create a Jewish state are elected to power.
 
Originally Posted by swarm
OK I find hamas having trouble with islamist extremeists terribly funny. Looks like the learned their enforcement techniques from Isreal too. Ah, the irony.
I don't see the comparison. In Israel those who want to create a Jewish state are elected to power.

In Palestine those who want to create a Palestine (aka Hamas) state are elected to power.

In Palestine those Islamic extremists who were elected to power are having trouble with even more extreme Islamic extremists who claim Hamas are Jewish "appeasers."

In stead of arresting them, they assassinate them causing massive civilian collateral damage and inciting public opinion against them.

Originally Posted by Michael
"It is not permitted to any party or individual to enforce their own laws because this is the responsibility of the security forces," he said.

You can't write stuff that funny.
 
I think the whole situation of violence between different Palestinian factions is due to power struggle . Unless they clean their acts and put their house in order they will hurt themselves more .
 
All western have a false idea about whats islam mean.
Obviously this Violence can be explained by the Jealousy of a passionant man of the status of Islamic nation.
U cant take idea about islam from event like that, because if u do u should change ur view about christian and jews.
 
This is a great thread examining Islam and Muslims, inspiring even, keep it up. :)
 
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