Proof of the supernatural

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Dywyddyr said:
But you suggested it for some problems.
In other words you're detached from reality and promoting utter crap.
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it worked for me, and i think it could work for others, science may rule it out, but you should never rule something out. but you should only try it after rational solutions don't work.
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
but you should never rule something out.
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Unless it's blatantly stupid.
You know, like claiming it's demons or some such sh*t.

but you should only try it after rational solutions don't work.
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Oh you mean "When you can't think of anything else be an idiot", that sort of thing?

what about all the people in the world who believe in demons
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Belief doesn't make things real.

and have benefited from performing cleansings and blessings and such?
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No one has.
Unless you meant it exactly as worded - those who performed the "cleansings and blessings" have benefited - because it's increased the respect they've gained from the terminally gullible.
 
garbonzo said:
There is no natural if it is unexplained. Unexplained means supernatural.
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No. Unexplained means there is no current explanation.
If you label something as natural or supernatural then you are claiming that the explanation, whatever it may be, sits within that realm.
But unexplained is not synonymous with supernatural, and to think so is simply wrong.
 
I'm just glad I'm in tune with the spiritual world, some go their whole lives being miserable, not knowing that their might be an option to get rid of their misery.
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
I'm just glad I'm in tune with the spiritual world
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Um, you're not "in tune with the spiritual world", although you may hold the mistaken belief that you are.

some go their whole lives being miserable, not knowing that their might be an option to get rid of their misery.
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And some, apparently, spend their lives being deluded not knowing that there's an option to become educated ...
 
I would say, I am enlightened, because i don't just see things the way they appear, and I can agree that there are things science cannot explain, because it's not in science's domain.
 
well, I'm only saying it because it worked for me and it could work for others, isn't that the same as when you recommend a solution to someone? I only say it because I have a different perspective on someone.

This thread is about the proof of supernatural, i think that the supernatural plays a huge role in our lives, most ignore it, others don't and they benefit. This is what I believe in, I think there's a difference between mental illness and demonic possession

http://messiahshouseofyahvah.org/ArticlesAndMore/DemonPossession.V.MentalIllness.html

i'm not the only one with my set of beliefs, and there's no harm in anything i say. only offering alternatives.
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
well, I'm only saying it because it worked for me
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Zero evidence.

This thread is about the proof of supernatura
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And, after over 300 posts, none has come forward.

i think that the supernatural plays a huge role in our lives
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That's because you're irrational.

I think there's a difference between mental illness and demonic possession
http://messiahshouseofyahvah.org/ArticlesAndMore/DemonPossession.V.MentalIllness.html
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And your link doesn't actually support that.

and there's no harm in anything i say.
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Apart from the promotion of irrational unscientific crap you mean?
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
it worked for me, and i think it could work for others, science may rule it out, but you should never rule something out. but you should only try it after rational solutions don't work.
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Can you describe what "worked for" you?
Are you sure that it is not the act of believing that helps you rather than any reality behind what you believe in?
For some it is simply their belief in God, in the supernatural, that gives them strength, guidance etc. But do not confuse that with the veracity of what it is they believe in: the act of believing might have its own rewards irrespective of whether what is believed in is real/true or not.
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
it could be many things, could be what my parents have done or what i have done unknowingly that affects me.
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Tangible and real things, yes. For example, your parents could have mortgaged the family home and been unable to repay it and the downfall of that is that you all become homeless. Or they painted the family furniture with led based paints and the children licked it and became ill, or they left asbestos exposed insde the house and people fell ill.. But you are talking about something that is not real.

i believe in god, and i also believe in evil, and what happened did not have a logical explanation, and i believed that maybe these evil forces behind it, and the fact that getting rid of these evil forces helped my family, further solidified my beliefs
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Further descent into madness..

It is more than likely that you and/or your family were doing other things at the same time that had the actual results to the problems facing your family and you are attributing it to getting rid of demons.

i believe there are illnesses, mental illnesses and such, and i think science would help in such cases. but in some cases, when science can't help, an exorcism, blessing or cleansing may need to be performed.
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I disagree.

I think that people who rely on such measures are doing so to avoid facing their problems head on and dealing with them, instead preferring to delve into some sort of fantasy land of demons and magic. It also brings you comfort and makes you feel better about yourself because you have turned something that would otherwise be mundane and ordinary, into something that is extraordinary, which makes the solving of the problem all that more heroic and extraordinary.
 
Sarkus said:
Can you describe what "worked for" you?
Are you sure that it is not the act of believing that helps you rather than any reality behind what you believe in?
For some it is simply their belief in God, in the supernatural, that gives them strength, guidance etc. But do not confuse that with the veracity of what it is they believe in: the act of believing might have its own rewards irrespective of whether what is believed in is real/true or not.
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Here is a little bit of my story, there was a time in my life where nothing was going well, illnesses, losses, etc. we weren't doing good, my cousin he was going through divorce and addictions, then our businesses were failing miserably, we found someone who told what might be going wrong with us, blessed the house, prayed for my cousin, made him change his house. Things went much better after that. he was cured through god, thanks to a priest. There was nothing anyone else could do

i guess i should say that what i believe is real, because I get a response. There is also no other belief like believing in god.
 
I'd suggest that things went better because your cousin wanted them to and because your cousin needed a psychological impetus to do so. Your cousin needed a change, but needed an excuse to make the change.
He was given an excuse, made the change, and because things picked up you have attributed his change in fortune to God, not to himself.
I find that a pity, that you have been convinced that his fortune is not of his own making. Change in one's surroundings is often a catalyst for change of fortune. One does not need God for that.

As previously said, you seem to find psychological benefit in the belief in God, but that itself is not evidence or proof of the veracity of what you believe in, only of the psychological benefits you have felt from the process of believing.
 
Bells said:
I think that people who rely on such measures are doing so to avoid facing their problems head on and dealing with them, instead preferring to delve into some sort of fantasy land of demons and magic. It also brings you comfort and makes you feel better about yourself because you have turned something that would otherwise be mundane and ordinary, into something that is extraordinary, which makes the solving of the problem all that more heroic and extraordinary.
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well i have never thought of it that way, to me it looks like science is trying to make something supernatural mundane. and it seems like science has a tendency to best explain things with it's current understanding, so maybe sometimes it can be wrong.
 
Sarkus said:
I'd suggest that things went better because your cousin wanted them to and because your cousin needed a psychological impetus to do so. Your cousin needed a change, but needed an excuse to make the change.
He was given an excuse, made the change, and because things picked up you have attributed his change in fortune to God, not to himself.
I find that a pity, that you have been convinced that his fortune is not of his own making. Change in one's surroundings is often a catalyst for change of fortune. One does not need God for that.

As previously said, you seem to find psychological benefit in the belief in God, but that itself is not evidence or proof of the veracity of what you believe in, only of the psychological benefits you have felt from the process of believing.
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I understand, it's only the believers that feel the poof of god, i can't make others see it.

well, most of the credit goes to god, and some of it to my cousin for listening to the priest.
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
to me it looks like science is trying to make something supernatural mundane.
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Since, so far as any actual evidence goes, there IS NO SUCH THING as the supernatural it would be rather hard for any discipline - science or otherwise - to make it look mundane.
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/sci...r-death-in-biggest-ever-scientific-study.html
science may be onto something and one day it could be considered normal, and not supernatural.
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Uh what?
I don't consider that "supernatural" at all.
Merely that there's (maybe) some difference between a (reported) "clinical death" and actual death.
Oh and there's also the distinct possibility that Dr. Parnia is interpreting his evidence in a somewhat skewed manner - The one ‘verifiable period of conscious awareness’ that Parnia was able to report did not relate to this objective test.
 
Dywyddyr said:
Uh what?
I don't consider that "supernatural" at all.
Merely that there's (maybe) some difference between a (reported) "clinical death" and actual death.
Oh and there's also the distinct possibility that Dr. Parnia is interpreting his evidence in a somewhat skewed manner - The one ‘verifiable period of conscious awareness’ that Parnia was able to report did not relate to this objective test.
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my point is that science denied it for so long, but now is coming to terms with consciousness existing after death.
 
brokenbutnotbeat said:
my point is that science denied it for so long, but now is coming to terms with consciousness existing after death.
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You obviously didn't read my post at all did you?
1) Science isn't "coming to terms" with it - all that may (possibly) happen is that "death" gets a new definition. I.e. what we currently classify as "dead" turns out not to be.
2) There is NO reliable data to support your claim.
 
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