Profiling the races . . .

[Athelwulf]

I got an odd E-mail in my Gmailbox last night. Here's the text:

HISTORY TEST

Please pause a moment, reflect back, and take the following multiple choice
test. The events are actual cuts from past history. They actually happened!!!

Do you remember?

-1968 Bobby Kennedy was shot and killed by
a. Superman
b. Jay Lenno
c. Harry Potter
d. Muslim male extremist between the ages of 17 and 40

1. In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred by
a. Olga Corbett
b. Sitting Bull
c. Arnold Schwarzenegger
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

2. In 1979, the US embassy in Iran was taken over by:
a. Lost Norwegians
b. Elvis
c. A tour bus full of 80-year-old women
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

3.During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:
a. John Dillinger
b. The King of Sweden
c. The Boy Scouts
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

4. In 1983, the US Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by:
a. A pizza delivery boy
b. Pee Wee Herman
c. Geraldo Rivera
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

5. In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked and a 70 year old
American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard in his wheelchair by:
a. The Smurfs
b. Davy Jones
c. The Little Mermaid
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

6.In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a US Navy diver trying to
rescue passengers was murdered by:
a. Captain Kidd
b. Charles Lindberg
c. Mother Teresa
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

7.In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:
a. Scooby Doo
b. The Tooth Fairy
c. Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

8. In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:
a. Richard Simmons
b. Grandma Moses
c. Michael Jordan
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

9.In 1998, the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:
a. Mr. Rogers
b. Hillary Clinton, to distract attention from Wild Bill' s women problems
c. The World Wrestling Federation
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

10.On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked; two were used as missiles to take
out the World Trade Centers and of the remaining two, one crashed into the US
Pentagon and the other was diverted and crashed by the passengers.Thousands of
people were killed by:
a. Bugs Bunny, Wiley E. Coyote, Daffy Duck and Elmer Fudd
b. The Supreme Court of Florida
c. Mr. Bean
d Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

11.In 2002 the United States fought a war in Afghanistan against:
a. Enron
b. The Lutheran Church
c. The NFL
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

12. In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by:
a. Bonnie and Clyde
b. Captain Kangaroo
c. Billy Graham
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

Nope, .....I really don't see a pattern here to justify profiling, do you?

So, to ensure we Americans never offend anyone, particularly fanatics intent
on killing us, airport security screeners will no longer be allowed to profile
certain people. They must conduct random searches of 80-year-old women, little
kids, airline pilots with proper identification, secret agents who are members
of the President's security detail, 85-year old Congressmen with metal hips,
and Medal of Honor winning and former Governor Joe Foss, but leave Muslim
Males between the ages 17 and 40 alone because of profiling.

Let's send this to as many people as we can so that the Gloria Aldreds and
other dunder-headed attorneys along with Federal Justices that want to thwart
common sense, feel doubly ashamed of themselves - if they have any such sense.

As the writer of the award winning story "Forrest Gump" so aptly put it,
"Stupid is as stupid does."

Come on people wake up!!!
Keep this going. Pass it on to everyone in your address book.
Our Country and our troops need our support

I wanna know what yer thoughts on racial profiling (and this E-mail) are. Thanks in advance.

— Peace, Love, Health, and Happiness to all! Âðelwulf.

 

[Neildo]

It's idiotic. One can list many bad things that have happened and sort them by race. Because each bad thing was picked and chose to show only those races, does it mean every single race should be watched and treated as if they're all bad people? What is listed in that e-mail is 12 incidents spanning almost FOURTY years! What about the rest of the other ungodly amount of crimes committed by other races in those 40 years? I can sure come up with a list greater than just 12 to show that non-Muslims are worse.

Racial profiling is simply picking and choosing a few bad incidents over time and generalizing it to have a reason to target a specific group of people. People do not feel right if there isn't at least ONE enemy to fight against. If everything were all peaceful, I'm sure people would still find a reason to create tension for that reason.

- N

 

[Athelwulf]

Yes! Someone with sense!

I totally agree with ya, Neildo.

 

[vslayer]

i would feel fine if republicans didnt exist, why do i need an enemy if we are at peace

 

[Athelwulf]

I concur.

 

[guthrie]

Well, the thread title is wrong anyway, since being a muslim is not being a member of a "race". (And lets not get into the genetics/ social spects of "races" anyway. Suffice to say that the way things are just now its far more a social construction than a genetic one.)

 

[Tiassa]

(1) The Requerimiento is a document that was read to indigenous American tribes, instructing them to submit to political, social, and religious dominance. Furthermore, failure to comply would result in the destruction of the unwilling, who were blamed for their own demise. The Requerimiento is a product of:

(A) Polish Jews
(B) Florida Seminoles
(C) Mormons
(D) European Christians​

(2) Encomienda, a form of slavery intended to better the slave, was applied against indigenous American tribes by:

(A) French atheists
(B) Chinese mystics
(C) Shi'ite Muslims
(D) European Christians​

(3) In the seventeenth century, women were hauled half-naked through the streets in the back of horsecarts in the middle of a snowing winter for disobedience and heresy by:

(A) The Anasazi
(B) The Roman triumvirate
(C) Russian witches
(D) White, European-descended Christians​

(4) The belief that it was morally cruel to teach Africans to read was held by:

(A) African kings
(B) Hindu sages
(C) "Flower Power" and "Free Love" advocates
(D) European-descended, American Christians​

(5) "Jim Crow" laws designed to prevent social integration of freed slaves and their descendants--a multigenerational effort--were the product of:

(A) Communist principles
(B) Capitalist theories
(C) German National Socialists
(D) American Christian mores​

(6) Who banned liquor consumption while allowing the prostitution of 10 year-old girls?

(A) California witches
(B) Mormons
(C) Communists
(D) American Christians​

• • •​

My point, of course, being that you can vilify anyone. One thing that can be said of American cultural difficulties is that they're presented in a more complex manner. A seventh question I considered was, "Who hates motherhood more?" It was a coin-flip, however, between certain strains of Islam and certain strains of American Christianity, with both Roger Waters and the Irish Catholics thrown in just for a chuckle. Part of the difference is that we in America put up a great effort to present a respectable façade, and much like Victorianism, the secrets kept out of sight are scandalous. "Woman is the nigger of the world," sang John Lennon, and it's Americans who put up the greatest conflicting efforts to insist that it isn't true while living out the accusation.

If you mark millions of people according to the most spectacular historical events given traditional focus, that's all you're doing. You're not actually getting to know those people any better.

The list in the topic post is obviously composed with sinister intent. The 1979 takeover of the US Embassy? Well, duh; has the author read the history leading to that event? It seems very presumptuous and even dangerous to view that debacle so jingoistically. I'd say it's to the Iranians' credit that they didn't slaughter the whole lot.

In the end, one thing the list does point out is that Muslim extremists are dangerous. So are Christian, capitalist, communist, and other ideological extremists. But what if we write out a litany of Israeli-Jewish crimes? Or American contributions to that mess?

The problem, of course, is deciding which Jew supports Israeli crimes, or which American supports such contributions. In the end, the problem with focusing on Muslim extremists in order to make a general point in favor of profiling is much similar to the issue of black men in the Drug War. "Wealthy" black men were randomly arrested at airports; one in Houston was considered suspicious for paying cash for an airplane ticket. A subsequent search removed around $10k from the man, which was never returned to him. Black man with money in an airport must be a drug dealer, eh? Couldn't possibly be a recently-retired baseball pitcher from your own town's team (e.g. Houston Astros) catching a plane to Las Vegas, could it? Of course not: the profile says he must be a dealer.

The public was so ready to believe that some medical students were threatening the country. If they were white skaters saying similar things, they'd simply be kicked out for being annoying. (Even if one of them was a white Muslim.) Throw in those Arab physical features, however, and they must be terrorists. Note for future Eunice Stones: Refuse your attorney's advice that it would be a good thing to go on a national television show and tell your story if you're not ready to tell your story.

How does it go in a bar? Is the guy just being annoying? Did he take a swing at you? Does it matter, at this point, if he's black, white, Arab, &c.? Are you going to take a poke at a white man, shoot a black man, call Homeland Security on the Arab, or back away from the Japanese man? Really, what are the criteria?

• White guy: Slovenly American couch potato, doesn't look like he works out--nail him.
• Black guy: He must have a gun, and will probably rape my wife after he kills me. Shoot him first.
• Arab guy: He must be a terrorist. F@ck it, call the feds!
• Japanese guy: He must know karate! Back away ... back away ....​

Because that's sort of the problem I see with the list Athelwulf has offered us.

First off, how do you profile "Muslim extremists"? They're not all going to be Arab, and if that's the criterion, that's racism. Not all people who look Arab will be Muslims, and not all of them will be Arab. (A Sikh cabbie was beaten near Seattle shortly after 9/11, for example.) Not all Muslims will be Arab. As a recent debacle surrounding Portland lawyer Brandon Mayfield shows, the situation is far more complex:

• White
• American
• Muslim convert
• Between eight and fifteen points matching fingerprint connected to Madrid train bombing
• Professional contact with suspected Al Qaeda sympathizers/operatives
• And still not a viable suspect, because he's innocent​

Additionally, even the pundits have gotten around to pointing out Al Qaeda's savvy. We are told to expect a more Benetton al Qaeda.

The Mayfield case suggests that the U.S. government is at least putting up the appearance of recognizing the potential diversity of terror. It also reminds that not all Arabs are Muslims, and not all Muslims are terrorists.

What it suggests, then, in terms of the topic quiz, is that it might be a little harder to determine what is or isn't a Muslim extremist. A turban, a green jacket, and a rifle? Sure. Profile away. A bomb fuse sticking out of the shoe? Go for it. A Sikh cabbie? Well, so much for profiling. The guys coming in and out of the mosque over at Northgate? Frankly, if any of them are "extremists", it's hard to tell. They don't shout and shake their fists and flip off the cars as much as the white kids getting kicked out of the mall parking lot for skateboarding, so who knows?

And there's a great example.

If someone steps off the curb against the light so that you have to swerve, you might honk as you go by, or mutter, "Idiot", or some such. If a white skater rolls out into the street in defiant disregard for anyone's safety, some minor bigotry might come to mind: "Damn kids", or "F@cking punks", or "stupid brats", &c. And then let's imagine that a Muslim man is told by an arriving neighbor that he is needed at home, his wife has fallen and the ambulance is on its way. So he bolts, and as he launches himself through the crosswalk, it doesn't even occur to him that he's crossing against the light. But you do your best, and avoid hitting him. You don't honk. You don't curse or yell. Instead you pick up your cel-phone and dial Homeland Security.

That's approximately the conventional wisdom of that nifty little "History Test":

• If you see a black man running, he must be running from the cops because he doesn't have a basketball with him.
• If you see a Mexican running, he must be running from the cops because otherwise he's too lazy to run.
• If you see an Arab man running, some peoples is gonna die.​

And, no, it doesn't sound particularly reasonable, but it does sound strangely American.

 

[Neildo]

Damn those evil Florida Seminoles, Chinese Mystics, Anasazi Indians, Flower Power and Free Love advocates, German National Socialists, and California witches!

- N

 

[cardiovascular_tech]

we all got flaws

 

[RubiksMaster]

Hey, Athelwulf, I sent that to you!
Racial profiling is necessary. The libs always try to say that the classic white male is bad, while all others are the best people in the world.

Why would we not want to be wary of an arab looking suspicious in an airport? Why would we want to take any chance that another few planes will go down? Oh, yeah, we might hurt someone's feelings if we questioned an arab.

We don't want any feelings hurt. That is the last thing we want!

You probably think that only .1 percent of Muslims are terrorists. Well where are the other 99.9 percent? Why don't they speak up? I simply do not believe it. Call me a racist, call me a bigot. I'd rather be safe from terrorists than risk "offending" someone.

If these arabs are true Americans, and willing to help our cause, they would not care if someone wanted to remain safe.

 

[Neildo]

Why would we not want to be wary of an arab looking suspicious in an airport? Why would we want to take any chance that another few planes will go down? Oh, yeah, we might hurt someone's feelings if we questioned an arab.

The point is that it's not just "Arab-looking people" who want to commit, or have commited, harm against the U.S. If you want to do racial profiling then:

We should also be careful of every white man in case another building in Oklahoma is going to be blown up or another Bomber's Manifesto is found. So we should no longer allow any whites into Oklahoma or be allowed to send packages to the post office.

We have to be careful of every, usually white, Environmentalist in case any logging plants or other environment-wrecking coroporations are going to be blown up. So let's just detain them all since this applies to more than one area.

We have to be careful of any pro-life religious nuts, usually white, that may blow up abortion clinics or any other building that conflicts with their religious beliefs. So no white people should be allowed to have an abortion so we can protect the safety of the doctors and other medical staff there.

We have to be careful of any, usually white, people that may assassinate the President or other political official, so no white people should be allowed near any political events.

We have to be careful of all Black and Mexican people so that we don't get shot in our neighborhoods, so let's remove them from our middle-class and upper middle-class neighborhoods and put them back in their hoods and barrios. Need I mention the horrible music they bring too?

We have to be careful of all Jews so that they don't steal all our money. So let's ban all Jews from having any economic job, which basically applies to everything so let's not have them work at all. They should just be slaves again like in the good ol' book.

We have to be careful of all Italians because they may be in the Mob. So we should no longer eat at any Italian eateries in fear of eating ground up human flesh and bones rather than animal products.

We have to be careful of all South Americans in fear of smuggling in drugs to damage the health of people in our country.

We have to be careful of all Russians and Chinese because of all the espionage they do to us to use our weapons against us so let's ban all Russian and Chinese people form working in any and all technical fields and especially the Department of Defense.

We have to be careful of all young Republicans because they might be trained to help ruin our country if ever they come into office, so let's just get rid of the whole party altogether.

I do find it odd that more WHITE people have blown up things on the U.S. mainland than any other race yet it's other people we fear, lol. I need to start looking over my back before big brother detains me just to be safe of any future potential threats. This is why profiling the races is useless and those that are FOR it (usually whites) are completely IGNORANT as any racial profiling would, or at least should, apply to them more than any other race! God help us when whites really do become the racial minority so that it becomes easier to keep tabs on us which makes it all the more possible for whites to be targetted for racial profiling since people only target the racial minorities.

- N

 

[Athelwulf]

Hey, Athelwulf, I sent that to you!

You DID?!

Haha . . . Forgive me . . . I don't have my contact list memorized, it seems.

Wow, I should suspect you more.

Racial profiling is necessary. The libs always try to say that the classic white male is bad, while all others are the best people in the world.

You did get my response E-mail, right?

The white male is just as bad as the other races in the world. We are, after all, human.

Why would we not want to be wary of an arab looking suspicious in an airport?

By "looking", do ya mean "doing"? If he's just looking suspicious, that's not enough to stop him. If he's doing something suspicious, then I would consider that enough reason.

Why would we want to take any chance that another few planes will go down? Oh, yeah, we might hurt someone's feelings if we questioned an arab.

If the Arab wasn't actually doing something suspicious.

You probably think that only .1 percent of Muslims are terrorists.

I probably do, but I don't. Well, not 0.1 percent anyway. I do think that an unarguably small percent of Muslims are terrorists.

Well where are the other 99.9 percent? Why don't they speak up?

Maybe they're afraid of being accused of protecting their own kind by some of the bigoted conservatives that live in the US. Or maybe they're afraid of being accused of being a terrorist themselves. I don't know for sure, and I doubt ye'r any more sure than I. Only a Muslim would know for sure. Maybe you and I should look for someone who's Muslim and ask him or her.

Call me a racist, . . .

Racist.

. . . call me a bigot.

Bigot.

I'd rather be safe from terrorists than risk "offending" someone.

I'm sorry you feel so threatened by Muslims.

If these arabs are true Americans, and willing to help our cause, they would not care if someone wanted to remain safe.

They would, and do, care if they didn't agree with the method with which we intend to keep ourselves safe.

 

[RubiksMaster]

The white male is just as bad as the other races in the world. We are, after all, human.

Yes, but you would never know that from the libs in the media. They would have you believe we are monsters - way worse than any one else.

I'm sorry you feel so threatened by Muslims.

I am sorry you are not. You are setting yourself up for something bad.

 

[X-Bishop]

Yes racism, stereotypes, etc. are all used out of fear in order to classify and limit a specific group of people. There are some individuals in some races who, out of fear, place stereotypes upon another race, so that they can stay on top. It is out of fear that the one race will dominate their race.

 

[yuri_sakazaki]

Personally, I support racial profiling of Muslim-looking people, because when the last ten (or whatever the number is, less or more) TERRORIST attacks were by Arab Muslims, then its a pretty good chance many of them are going to be in the future. Of course, I'm not saying that they are worse than white people, but as far as terrorist attacks on America, especially from airports, they have a worse recent record. Also, a large reason that white people have a higher rate of crime than anything else in the US is because whites are the majority. They are less often criminals if you take a percent of the white people (unless you argue that less get convicted because of racism in the judicial system, but I don't buy that in this day and age.) And guthrie was getting to one of the biggest points supporting racial profiling: Islam is a way of life and culture, not race. Religion you choose, heredity you don't. "Kill the infidels" -Koran. Of course there are peaceful Muslims, but as for the statistics of recent terrorist threats especially in airports/airplanes, Muslims don't look very good.

 

[Athelwulf]

I am sorry you are not. You are setting yourself up for something bad.

Oh no, some bad little Muslim is gonna come to my house and kill me. Help, oh help. Somebody help me!

Personally, I support racial profiling of Muslim-looking people, because when the last ten (or whatever the number is, less or more) TERRORIST attacks were by Arab Muslims, then its a pretty good chance many of them are going to be in the future.

Oh . . . em . . . gee!!!!! Would ya, like, look at that! Ten Muslims have, like, attacked us! Let's, like, totally hate the rest of them! Like, okay?

Of course, I'm not saying that they are worse than white people, but as far as terrorist attacks on America, especially from airports, they have a worse recent record.

So then if a bunch of us crackers started hijacking planes and crashing them into the Pentagon, then ya'd be all for racially profiling us?

Also, a large reason that white people have a higher rate of crime than anything else in the US is because whites are the majority.

Muslims are probably the majority in the Middle East.

And guthrie was getting to one of the biggest points supporting racial profiling: Islam is a way of life and culture, not race. Religion you choose, heredity you don't.

Oh, so people should be profiled because of how they choose to live their life? That's not one of the ideals that America was founded on.

"Kill the infidels" -Koran. Of course there are peaceful Muslims, but as for the statistics of recent terrorist threats especially in airports/airplanes, Muslims don't look very good.

Neither do Christians if ya look back in history. Heard of the Spanish Inquisition? The Christian religion is just as bad as you claim the Muslim religion to be.

EDIT: Off Topic: Yuri, I find it interesting that ya chose a username with the Japanese word for "hard-core lesbian anime porn" in it.

 

[Athelwulf]

There's a point that Rubiks and Yuri seem to be missing. I know I've already said it to Rubiks, but poor Yuri is in the not-know.

Do you realize that any Muslim that wanted to attack our country could hire a blond-haired, blue-eyed, white male to do the job for them? Any one of them could! And I'm sure there are Aryan males that sympathize with the Muslims and/or are Muslim themselves.

Would ya look at that! A loophole in the system, and one Muslims can very easily take.

Would ya look at that! An Aryan male has crashed a plane into the Empire State building! We never saw it coming! And ya know why? Kuz the damn airports were too busy looking at the Middle-Easterns to care what the "innocent" Aryans were doing.

What say ye two to that?

 

[Beryl]

Why don't they speak up?

Um... a lot of them do. Maybe you don't listen, but I do. Sure, plenty don't, or at least not in a way that most of us have the opportunity to hear them: some because they don't have the means to be heard, some because they don't want the FBI showing up at their house. But some most certainly do speak up.

"Why don't they speak up?" is never a sensible argument against any group that's being discriminated against. Generally some of them do, a lot of time those who do suffer pretty cruddy consequences from it.

 

[Neildo]

Personally, I support racial profiling of Muslim-looking people, because when the last ten (or whatever the number is, less or more) TERRORIST attacks were by Arab Muslims, then its a pretty good chance many of them are going to be in the future.

The last 10 terrorist attacks were by Arab Muslims? Sorry, but no. Exactly what area and timeframe are you referring to?

Do you realize that any Muslim that wanted to attack our country could hire a blond-haired, blue-eyed, white male to do the job for them? Any one of them could! And I'm sure there are Aryan males that sympathize with the Muslims and/or are Muslim themselves.

Yup, that's the biggest threat. If someone wants to cause harm, it IS going to happen and there isn't much we can do to stop it. Laws and prevention methods have always been broken before they were in effect and will continue to do so after they're in effect.

- N

 

[yuri_sakazaki]

Athelwulf: First, before I get to the point (^^''''), Yuri is also a NAME. And thats what my intention of the screen name was, not lesbian porn. It would only make a fool of you to bring up that you know about that, though I do too because people unfortunately tell me more than I'd like. About the ten, when the last whatever in a row (because I don't know the actual number) terrorist attacks in very recent U.S. history were by them, and we're probably still in the same era of war and culture, the rest is just common sense to me. And then "lets hate the rest of them" is ridiculous... its not about hate, its about general statistics, and hate has nothing to do with just checking somebody over. Also, there aren't SO many Arabs in airports that you'd only be checking them, because there really aren't all that many Arabs in the U.S. at all (who moved to the U.S. I mean). "Muslims are probably the majority in the middle east" So? We're talking about on American soil right now. The Spanish inquisition was in a different era than 2001-2005. Times change, and trust me, ideally the Spanish inquisition would not have happened. But now the much more minor equivalent would be terrorism by mostly Arabs. If the typical trend of terrorist attacks were by white people, I would prefer they profile us. The thing where they can hire white people is problematic, but thats why you search them too, but not in place of Arabs because theres a higher statistical likelihood based on recent events that an attack would be by an Arab. Like I said, they won't be THAT busy searching the comparatively few Arabs in airports I'm basing this all on numbers, its not because I'm racist or prejudiced. And yes, profiling based on people's beliefs isn't at all what America is about, but I said what I did about that because it shows they do have a choice in being part of a group which has many members that take the words of their prophet and God out of context and out of hand to a higher degree more than people of other groups, even if its not the individual's fault that other people in their religion are idiots.