I mean whatever they call their "holy land" spattered with blood upon their own religion embedded in lies
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I mean whatever they call their "holy land" spattered with blood upon their own religion embedded in lies
There's plenty of Jewish blood there, the Romans massacred hundreds of thousands before the Arab squatters showed up.
Good thing the Canaanites were there to keep house for the next 2000 years.
Just like they'd been there before the Israelis moved in. :shrug:
When the Balfour Agreement was signed in 1917, Jews were less than 10% of the population.
Which is less than the Hispanic (14%) or African American (12%) population of the USA
Just like they'd been there before the Israelis moved in. :shrug:
When the Balfour Agreement was signed in 1917, Jews were less than 10% of the population.
Which is less than the Hispanic (14%) or African American (12%) population of the USA
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What percentage of the "Palestinians" actually lived in land that is now Israel? Because it couldn't include anyone under 60 years old.
Buffalo Roam
Registered Senior Member
Thats not a UN report.
You're running a factory for suicide terrorism. What future are you making for Israel?
Really? Then why is it always Moslems who are commiting suicide bombings, it would seem that it is the Palestinians who are running the factory that turn out suicide bombers.
How about a citation of a Israeli suicide bomber, or a American, British or any other none Moslem suicide bomber today, Tammal Tigers, excluded.
Islamic laws oppose the practice.
This religious prohibition has had the intended effect. According to Franz Rosenthal, a scholar of the subject, ''suicide was of comparatively rare occurrence'' in traditional Muslim society. In contemporary Egypt, statistics bear out that suicide is exceedingly rare.
But those spokesmen are not telling the whole story, for Islamists consider suicide as not just legitimate, but highly commendable when undertaken for reasons of jihad (holy war). Going into war knowing with the certainty that one will die, they argue, is not suicide (intihar) but martyrdom (istishhad), a much-praised form of self-sacrifice in the path of God, a way to win the eternal affection of the houris in paradise.
A leading Islamist authority, Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi, recently explained the distinction this way: attacks on enemies are not suicide operations, but ''heroic martyrdom operations'' in which the kamikazes act not ''out of hopelessness and despair, but are driven by an overwhelming desire to cast terror and fear into the hearts of the oppressors.''
In other words, Islamists find suicide for personal reasons abominable, suicide for jihad admirable.
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But here we have the Story of a young man from Jordan, Hotari, who goes to the West Bank and become a suicide bomber.
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ZARQA, Jordan -- The Hotaris are preparing for a party to celebrate the killing of 21 Israelis this month by their son, a suicide bomber.
Neighbors hang pictures on their trees of Saeed Hotari holding seven sticks of dynamite. They spray-paint graffiti reading ''21 and counting'' on their stone walls. And they arrange flowers in the shapes of a heart and a bomb to display on their front doors.
''I am very happy and proud of what my son did and, frankly, am a bit jealous,'' says Hassan Hotari, 54, father of the young man who carried out the attack June 1 outside a disco in Tel Aviv. It was Israel's worst suicide bombing in nearly four years. ''I wish I had done (the bombing). My son has fulfilled the Prophet's (Mohammed's) wishes. He has become a hero! Tell me, what more could a father ask?''
In more than a dozen interviews with former and current members of the militant group Hamas and with Israeli security officials who track them, USA TODAY was given a rare look into the secretive and terrifying world of suicide bombers and the culture that creates them.
Lured by promises of financial stability for their families, eternal martyrdom and unlimited sex in the afterlife, dozens of militant Palestinians like Hotari aspire to blow themselves up, Israeli and Palestinian officials say. Their goal: to kill or injure as many Jews as possible in the hope that Israel will withdraw from Gaza and the West Bank. Israel captured the land in 1967.
(...)
Since 1993, nearly 190 people have been killed and thousands injured in 28 suicide bombings in Israel.
(...)
''When I walk outside, young (Palestinian) children come up to me and say, 'Conduct another bombing to make us happy, sheik,' '' says Sheik Hasan Yosef, 45, the senior Hamas leader in the West Bank city of Ramallah. ''I cannot disappoint them. They won't have to wait long.''
At any time, Israeli officials believe, Hamas has from five to 20 men, ages 18 to 23, awaiting orders to carry out suicide attacks. The group also claims to have ''tens of thousands'' of youths ready to follow in their footsteps. ''We like to grow them,'' Yosef says. ''From kindergarten through college.''
In Hamas-run kindergartens, signs on the walls read: ''The children of the kindergarten are the shaheeds (holy martyrs) of tomorrow.'' The classroom signs at Al-Najah University in the West Bank and at Gaza's Islamic University say, ''Israel has nuclear bombs, we have human bombs.''
At an Islamic school in Gaza City run by Hamas, 11-year-old Palestinian student Ahmed's small frame and boyish smile are deceiving. They mask a determination to kill at any cost. ''I will make my body a bomb that will blast the flesh of Zionists, the sons of pigs and monkeys,'' Ahmed says. ''I will tear their bodies into little pieces and cause them more pain than they will ever know.''
''Allahu Akbar,'' his classmates shout in response: ''God is great.''
''May the virgins give you pleasure,'' his teacher yells, referring to one of the rewards awaiting martyrs in paradise. Even the principal smiles and nods his approval.
''You don't start educating a shaheed at age 22,'' says Roni Shaked, a terrorism expert and former officer in Israel's Shin Bet secret service. ''You start at kindergarten so by the time he's 22, he's looking for an opportunity to sacrifice his life.''
Some suicide bombers, like Hotari, come to their deadly missions by a slightly different route. They turn themselves into human bombs because they are frustrated by the economic and political duress Palestinians experience in Jordan and throughout the region.
Hamas says its recruiters, most of whom Israeli officials describe as charismatic religious leaders, look for two qualities in a potential bomber: an intense interest in Islam and a clean criminal record so as not to raise the suspicions of Israel's secret service.
Saeed Hotari, who was 22, fit both of those criteria. He was ''a devout Muslim who used to pray, observed fasting and performed all his religious obligations to the letter and spirit,'' his father says. One of nine children, he left Zarqa, outside the Jordanian capital of Amman, for the West Bank city of Qalqilya in 1999 to seek a better life.
In Qalqilya, he and two other Palestinian youths went to a mosque where Sheik Jamel Tawil, a Hamas leader, persuaded them to attend a Hamas-run class on Islamic study. All would eventually be suicide bombers and would carry out their attacks within days of each other.
(...)
After several weeks of schooling, the youths often volunteer to be suicide bombers, Yosef says. ''If someone confiscated your land, demolished your home, built settlements to prevent you from coming back, killed your children and blocked you from going to work, wouldn't you want to fight for your country?'' Yosef asks.
In return for ''martyrdom,'' Hamas tells the youths that their families will be financially compensated, their pictures will be posted in schools and mosques, and they will earn a special place in heaven.
They also are promised something more risqué: unlimited sex with 72 virgins in heaven. The Koran, the sacred book of Islam, describes the women as ''beautiful like rubies, with complexions like diamonds and pearls.'' In one of the passages of the Koran, it is said the martyrs and virgins shall ''delight themselves, lying on green cushions and beautiful carpets.'' Since the time of Mohammed, martyrs have always been considered those willing to die defending Islam.
For some young Muslims, that offer is too much to turn down.
''I know my life is poor compared to Europe or America, but I have something awaiting me that makes all my suffering worthwhile,'' says Bassam Khalifi, 16, a Hamas youth leader in Gaza's Bureij refugee camp. ''Most boys can't stop thinking about the virgins.''
But in the end, says Shaked, the Israeli terrorism expert, most of the bombers don't sign up for martyrdom for the promise of unlimited sex. ''They join because of their absolute devotion to God and their desire to die with Jewish blood on their hands,'' he says. ''It's not a heroic thing, it's a holy thing.''
A would-be bomber is selected for his mission only days, sometimes hours, before it is to occur, Israeli officials say. As part of the preparation, the recruit is taken to a cemetery, where he is told to prepare for death by lying between gravesites for hours. He wears a white, hooded shroud normally used to cover bodies for burial, a former Hamas member says.
The recruit is then taken to a safe house. A video is made in which he states his consent to become a suicide bomber and his devotion to Islam. It will be played for the public after his death. A still photograph is taken that will be reproduced and displayed through the West Bank and Gaza to honor him after death.
Because secrecy is paramount, Hamas leaders will not allow the recruit to say goodbye to his family or tell them his plans.
(...)
Once at the target site, the recruit is told to remain calm, blend in as much as possible and, when surrounded by Israelis, press a switch to explode the bomb, Hamas members say.
(...)
On June 1, it was Hotari's turn. Israeli officials, quoting eyewitnesses, say two Hamas operatives drove him to the Dolphin Disco in Tel Aviv, a popular club often packed with Russian immigrant teenagers. They said Hotari slipped unnoticed into line and positioned himself among several girls, including a 14-year-old who had survived Marmash's attack in Netanya.
Then, while flirting with one of the girls, Hotari triggered the explosives. The blast was so intense that it tore limbs from the victims' bodies, scattered their flesh up to six blocks away and vaporized Hotari and the girl next to him.
It killed 21 people, in addition to Hotari, and injured nearly 100.
Now, nearly 30 days later, his parents are preparing to mark the anniversary of his death, as devout Muslims often do.
''My prayer is that Saeed's brothers, friends and fellow Palestinians will sacrifice their lives, too,'' Hotari's father says. ''There is no better way to show God you love him.''
Devotion, desire drive youths to 'martyrdom' : Palestinians in pursuit of paradise turn their own bodies into weapons, USA Today, June 26, 2001
they killed them through the years, masking with media their acts. They killed thousands with hunger and diseases, while defending themselves with "palestinians' terrorist acts" media. Their children died thousands for one Jewish child. They cried for help but countries could care less, they were already rooted. They did what they could, they fought for their freedom and were labeled terrorists.
AND that was not enough for them, they built stone walls with barber electrified wire around the Palestine...and killed those who dared cross back to their land.
MEANWHILE the other countries could care less and trumpeted the evil "palestinian terrorists" campaign
They gave some land (trash) to Palestine
They kept the rest of the land (holy) for their Israel
AND that was not enough for them, they built stone walls with barber electrified wire around the Palestine...and killed those who dared cross back to their land.
MEANWHILE the other countries could care less and trumpeted the evil "palestinian terrorists" campaign
They gave some land (trash) to Palestine
They kept the rest of the land (holy) for their Israel
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Democraphic change leads to political change. What's so sinister about that? What's up with all the surrounding predominately Arab and Muslim nations who saw the fake refugee crisis as an opportunity to stick it to the Jews?
There are no figures for the land of Israel (which occupies almost all the land now anyway) before 1949.
Except this:
Fake refugee crisis is right. None of the western nations considered them refugee enough for their own states at the time. But expected the Palestinians who were promised self determination for the first time should.
One with more walls and check points to keep out the suicide bombers at least until the Palestinians get tired of blowing themselves up. Probably another 1500 years or so.Thats not a UN report.
You're running a factory for suicide terrorism. What future are you making for Israel?
Well the Israelis decided to come back after 2000 years. :shrug:
What always gets me about this fixation on Israel is this:There are no figures for the land of Israel (which occupies almost all the land now anyway) before 1949.
Except this:
You've got this little tiny geographic area occupied by Jews, and this gigantic area surrounding it occupied by Muslims. But the Muslims are all up in arms about Israel? Surely the Palestinians could have been easily absorbed by some of the gigantic Muslim countries that surround Israel and take up 99% of the space in the middle east?
So? Are you willing to give up part of the US to China? Or Iraq?
To the Palestinians, who do not consider themselves Saudi, Morroccan or Iraqi and did not move even even it was all under the Ottomans, it is home.
In fact, having a Jewish state on land that belongs to Muslims, Christians and Jews is more problematic. Why not convert Jerusalem into a Vatican City for all three religions? And move Israel to the US? They'd love to live there, I'm sure. Their own Jewish state and all in the middle of their allies. I'm pretty sure the Palestinians would not mind sharing with any Jews who wanted to stay with them.
I would prefer for the Israelis to recognise the Palestinians right to return, but if they MUST have a Jewish state wouldn't it be better to have a big one, like NY state for instance? They already have a sizeable Jewsih population and the Israelis would love it there. The Americans would vacate at once, I'm sure, they have plenty of space to spare. Much bigger than the Middle East.
To the Palestinians, who do not consider themselves Saudi, Morroccan or Iraqi and did not move even even it was all under the Ottomans, it is home.
In fact, having a Jewish state on land that belongs to Muslims, Christians and Jews is more problematic. Why not convert Jerusalem into a Vatican City for all three religions? And move Israel to the US? They'd love to live there, I'm sure. Their own Jewish state and all in the middle of their allies. I'm pretty sure the Palestinians would not mind sharing with any Jews who wanted to stay with them.
I would prefer for the Israelis to recognise the Palestinians right to return, but if they MUST have a Jewish state wouldn't it be better to have a big one, like NY state for instance? They already have a sizeable Jewsih population and the Israelis would love it there. The Americans would vacate at once, I'm sure, they have plenty of space to spare. Much bigger than the Middle East.
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Challenger78
Valued Senior Member
Again, lets remember that Palestinians are a people, Yes, a majority of them are Muslim, but they are a people with their land. that many of them built and lived on with their families etc.
Why doesn't Bush give up his family ranch to have it occupied by Israeli's ?
There were a lot of huge Jewish friendly countries in the west too.
Why doesn't Bush give up his family ranch to have it occupied by Israeli's ?
There were a lot of huge Jewish friendly countries in the west too.
Thats great! Israel has moved back to its Green line? Removed the settlements? Given right of return to refugees? Awesome! :yay:
i was depressed because my parents divorce. so i decided to suicide bomb. :bawl:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3503275,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3503275,00.html
That's awesome! Hamas has stopped sending depressed kids to kill Jewish kids? Hamas recognized Israel as a Jewish state? Hamas has renounced terrorism? Huh? What? No? AWESOME :yay:
Right. Still under occupation then? Still discriminated on the basis of religion?
Hamas, Hizb et al. doesn't discriminate though. they bomb whoever's there without checking if they're Jews or not.
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