Micah 6:8-applicability to other religions besides christianity

[Mr. Hamtastic]

8 He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?

Okay. This verse was put out there by Micah, a minor prophet, pre Jesus. It seems to sum up JC's teachings pretty well, like the Jews were being too legal, and needed to seek God more, rather than stress the scibes and pharisees' rules. Am I misunderstanding this?

Does this apply to Judaism? Islam? Others?

Meaning, the rules are helpful guidelines, but they should not be the crux of any religion?

 

[S.A.M.]

It sounds like my favorite verse from Surah al Baqarah

Qur'an 2:177
It is not righteousness
That ye turn your faces toward East or West;
But it is righteousness -
To believe in Allah
And the Last Day
And the Angels
And the Book
And the Messengers;
To spend of your substance out of love for Him
For your kin
For orphans
For the needy
For the wayfarer
For those who ask,
And for the ransom of slaves;
To be steadfast in prayer
And practice regular charity;
To fulfil the contracts which ye have made;
And to be firm and patient in pain (or suffering) and adversity
And throughout all periods of panic.
Such are the people of truth the God-conscious

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

Does this mean I can have a loan?

Seriously, though, while I see the parallel, it seems pretty rule-driven in the qur'an... The bible's version is next door to Wicca-"An ye harm none, do as ye will", just with the relationship to God being the centerpiece.

 

[one_raven]

Okay. This verse was put out there by Micah, a minor prophet, pre Jesus. It seems to sum up JC's teachings pretty well, like the Jews were being too legal, and needed to seek God more, rather than stress the scibes and pharisees' rules.

One of my favorite Bible quotes is along similar lines of thought, apparently:

NIV Romans 3:19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin.

In other words - it is what is in your heart and intentions which matters most.

Does this apply to Judaism?

Since it was in Micah, I would have to assume that it does. :bugeye:

Actually, I question the validity of using the Tanakh as part of the Christian Bible, personally (as did many of the founding fathers of the Church - until the First Ecumenical Council) so I would have to ask if it applies to Christianity.

 

[S.A.M.]

Does this mean I can have a loan?

Seriously, though, while I see the parallel, it seems pretty rule-driven in the qur'an... The bible's version is next door to Wicca-"An ye harm none, do as ye will", just with the relationship to God being the centerpiece.

And whats rule driven in the Quran? Its the same thing - not ritual [turning your head east or west] but faith, good acts and forbearance, all of which are a sign of the God conscious.

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

JC almost enforces it, so I'd say yes. I see the tantrum at the temple as being JC angry at the Religious Leaders controlling the people, and lining their pockets, by ignoring this verse. Most people who teach christianity for a living, to congregations, disagree violently with this suggestion.

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

And whats rule driven in the Quran? Its the same thing - not ritual [turning your head east or west] but faith, good acts and forbearance, all of which are a sign of the God conscious.

I guess the specificity of the verse is what turns me off. It expects that you are not capable of simply doing the right thing, as God would have you, therefore you need special instructions. I have a rebellious nature, though, and tend to not want to do any specific instruction at all. Generalize, and I'll work with it. Personal thing, that's all.

 

[S.A.M.]

I think its an example of righteous acts that targets specific needs of the time. Besides, its always good to know that things like slavery are not good [not that people have paid any attention to stuff like that anyway]. The Quran is usually quite specific when there are general rules of behaviour. Leeway is usually greater when moral or legal issues are addressed.

 

[Adstar]

8 He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?

Okay. This verse was put out there by Micah, a minor prophet, pre Jesus. It seems to sum up JC's teachings pretty well, like the Jews were being too legal, and needed to seek God more, rather than stress the scibes and pharisees' rules. Am I misunderstanding this?

Does this apply to Judaism? Islam? Others?

Meaning, the rules are helpful guidelines, but they should not be the crux of any religion?

Beautiful verse:
Those who love Mercy love the Gospel message, which is the revelation of Gods mercy towards sinners. Also being humble towards God allows us to accept the conviction that we need His mercy.

This does not apply to Torah judaism or quranic islam. Both require punishment to be carried out upon wrongdoers. An acknowledgement of wrongdoing will not save an jewish adulterer from stoning. Nor will it save an 1slamic thief from having their hand cut off. Mercy is not part of their creed.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[S.A.M.]

Forgiveness is an essential part of Islam, we begin every supplication with the words, Bismillahii rrahmanii rraheem , In the name of God, most gracious, most merciful

Even the Saudis have a Pardon committee. Victims can choose to pardon the ones who have sinned against them and they will no longer be tried or punished.

 

[one_raven]

This does not apply to Torah judaism

Please explain to me what you mean by "Torah judaism". As opposd to what?
Given that this verse is found in the Tanakh, it is quite obviously part of Judaism.

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

Adstar, while I understand what you're saying, I think you are minimizing what it means. For example, was/is the promise implied in this verse available to Jews pre Christ? As an abrahamic religion, is this, or any other, verse applicable to Islam?

More to my point, do other religions I have not named view the personal relationship with their deities vital, or not? Could native american shamanism be seen as this, with shamans as the "priests" with direct access to the deities?

 

[Adstar]

Please explain to me what you mean by "Torah judaism". As opposd to what?
Given that this verse is found in the Tanakh, it is quite obviously part of Judaism.

The jews of today are selective in following the Torah. When was the last time you heard of a Jewish person being stoned ? The Torah stipulates that it is madatory for an adulterer to be put to death. All true Jews follow the Torah. Not just the dietry requirements and some other selected items, But all the Torah.

The religion called judasism that developed after the fall of jerusalem and dispersment of the jews in 70 AD is another religion. It has more to do with the teachings of the "sages" then the Prophets of the Torah.

Of cource in Torah Judaism mercy was taught but only in infringments not covered by the Law. So if a person did comit adultery or any other serious infringment against the Law then no mercy could be given, the option was taken out of their hands.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Adstar]

Adstar, while I understand what you're saying, I think you are minimizing what it means. For example, was/is the promise implied in this verse available to Jews pre Christ?

What promise? where is there any promise mentioned in this verse?

8 He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?

Tell me where is the promise in that verse?

More to my point, do other religions I have not named view the personal relationship with their deities vital, or not? Could native american shamanism be seen as this, with shamans as the "priests" with direct access to the deities?

I know very little about the shamanism of american tribes. As far as i know they deal with animal or earth spirits, not deities. As far as i know deities are worshiped in hinduism and some other multi god religions.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

The promise of the verse is bound up in the meetability of the requirements. The fact that it does NOT say "and follow all the law" is a promise in and of itself. If you followed the instructions given in this verse, then God's law was followed.