Live my life

[AJRelic]

Lets say we live in a deterministic universe. When we die we go on to live the lives of every other person existing, has, or will. In our next lives we may be kings, heroes, revolutionaries. Or we may become beggars, murderers, victims. Whoever we become is irrelevant because just as every life ends, we will become every entity for eternity; Experiencing that being's (predetermined) life the way we do our own at this very moment.

Would you be kinder to your fellow man knowing that at some point in time you'll be the recipient of that kindness, cruelty or inaction? Would you be more lenient towards them realizing that you too will make that mistake?

 

[cosmictraveler]

Wishful thinking. Won't happen because of so many other beliefs already here.

 

[AJRelic]

It's hypothetical. I'm not looking to convert anyone.

 

[spidergoat]

This is a basic premise of Buddhism. We are all facets of the same thing, so killing someone is like killing yourself. That being said, sometimes you need to kill yourself.

 

[cosmictraveler]

I think there wouldn't be much change in most people even with your idea for there are many that just do not care about others, only themselves, in this world today.

 

[Tiassa]

Sure, it's a futile question, but ....

I think there wouldn't be much change in most people even with your idea for there are many that just do not care about others, only themselves, in this world today.

Nor do they think so deeply about such propositions as our neighbor has put forth. Then again—and perhaps I'm wrong here—that seems an integral part of the question.

Would such a belief change the depth of people's considerations, or would they simply find some way to dismiss the issue and carry on as they already do?

 

[AJRelic]

I think there wouldn't be much change in most people even with your idea for there are many that just do not care about others, only themselves, in this world today.

I believe every action we take is ultimately selfish. When giving money to the homeless I don't do so solely to make them happier, but to instill a feeling of contentment within myself that someone's life is easier (if just for a moment) because of my actions.

Just because these actions do not bring others the same kind of satisfaction doesn't make them any more selfish than I, just different. They may be content with taking money rather than giving it away, but they're only fulfilling the life they were meant to.

While in this body I may not directly understand why they feel this way, but how can I feel anger towards them knowing that at some point I'll be making the same exact decisions?

The point of this topic is to make the assumption that you and I are one and the same. As I'm writing this now, I'll be reading it later as you and given the body and experiences we have, will respond in the way we feel is significant (or not at all).

 

[cosmictraveler]

I believe every action we take is ultimately selfish

I really do not see it that way at all. As an example when a person stops to help an injured animal, taking it to a vet to get help, how is that an act of selfishness? The time the person took to stop and take the animal to be helped isn't selfish, it is very unselfish if you ask me.

 

[madanthonywayne]

Lets say we live in a deterministic universe. When we die we go on to live the lives of every other person existing, has, or will. In our next lives we may be kings, heroes, revolutionaries. Or we may become beggars, murderers, victims. Whoever we become is irrelevant because just as every life ends, we will become every entity for eternity; Experiencing that being's (predetermined) life the way we do our own at this very moment.

Would you be kinder to your fellow man knowing that at some point in time you'll be the recipient of that kindness, cruelty or inaction? Would you be more lenient towards them realizing that you too will make that mistake?

My problem with the idea of reincarnation is that, given that we have no recollection of any past lives, is that supposedly reincarnated person really you? What are you if not the sum of your memories, experiences, and decisions. Take all that away and all you really have is, at best, a twin displaced in time.

 

[AJRelic]

I really do not see it that way at all. As an example when a person stops to help an injured animal, taking it to a vet to get help, how is that an act of selfishness? The time the person took to stop and take the animal to be helped isn't selfish, it is very unselfish if you ask me.

I believe the person would feel terrible for allowing the animal to suffer otherwise. Or you can take my example from above and apply it the same way. Either way there's some kind of emotional investment involved where the person's goal is to feel better with themselves. If the guy didn't care about this animal, why pay any attention to it?

Understand, to me, selfishness isn't good or evil, it's what motivates us to take action and the consequence of our behaviors is weighed against whatever moral standards we believe in.

Let's talk about a father saving his daughter. He's willing to sacrifice himself so that she may live. The ultimate act of altruism? Or to avoid the pain of having to bury his own daughter? To avoid the guilt of knowing he could have done something?

 

[AJRelic]

My problem with the idea of reincarnation is that, given that we have no recollection of any past lives, is that supposedly reincarnated person really you? What are you if not the sum of your memories, experiences, and decisions. Take all that away and all you really have is, at best, a twin displaced in time.

Exactly a point I was trying to make. There's no soul here... the way we make decisions, the way we experience life, it's no different given the person. According to this hypothetical scenario, we are who we are because of the experiences and body we're given. As I look at the religious fanatic and scowl at his delusions, he pities me for mine.

And just because I don't understand why he believes doesn't make his beliefs any less valid than my own. If I was given his body, along with his memories, I'd make the same decision, wouldn't I? And he, given mine, would do the same.

How could I feel anger towards him if I believe this?

 

[cluelusshusbund]

Lets say we live in a deterministic universe...

Would you be kinder to your fellow man...

Thats the way it effects me.!!!

...we are who we are because of the experiences and body we're given.

I dont know that its givin to us... but we are who we are because of the body an esperiences we have.!!!

If I was given his body, along with his memories, I'd make the same decision, wouldn't I? And he, given mine, would do the same.

Thers no evidence i know of to thank otherwize.!!!

How could I feel anger towards him if I believe this?

For a person who does beleive that... the amount of anger they mite still feel will be determined by the level of anger instilled in them thru the combinaton of ther particular genes an enviroment.!!!

 

[Enmos]

I believe the person would feel terrible for allowing the animal to suffer otherwise. Or you can take my example from above and apply it the same way. Either way there's some kind of emotional investment involved where the person's goal is to feel better with themselves.

I believe you are right, but it's not how people experience it. At least, I don't. I genuinely feel do it for the animal and not for any selfish reasons.
What is the difference between someone that couldn't care less about the animal's suffering and someone that want to end it's suffering?
I refuse to believe that the person that couldn't care less is less selfish.

How do guilt and remorse fit in? Is it some sort of self-punishment in order to increase the chance of getting it right next time? And how much of it has to do with the desire to be accepted by others (social pressure)?

Let's talk about a father saving his daughter. He's willing to sacrifice himself so that she may live. The ultimate act of altruism? Or to avoid the pain of having to bury his own daughter? To avoid the guilt of knowing he could have done something?

That's as selfish as you can get. He just trying to ensure the survival of his genes.
It's why we have children in the first place. Maybe not on a conscious level though

Parents of the animal kingdom (which we are a part of) sacrifice themselves all the time in order to help their offspring survive.