Japanese N-Plant Explosion
- Thread starter ULTRA
- Start date
Only that the sea has to be close by to accomodate the massive stream of cooling water. They thought they had earthquake-proofed the plant. Over-reliance on technology is frequently a bad mistake in my view.
Reportage: Nuclear experts give thier analysis of the problem so far: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/03/12/uk-japan-quake-experts-idUKTRE72B1KP20110312 ...
Reportage: Nuclear experts give thier analysis of the problem so far: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/03/12/uk-japan-quake-experts-idUKTRE72B1KP20110312 ...
...NHK reports: 3 patients exposed to radiation in Fukushima
Fukushima Prefecture says 3 patients at a hospital near the damaged nuclear power plant have been exposed to radiation.
The hospital is located in Futaba Town about 3 kilometers north of the Fukushima Number One Nuclear Power Plant. It is within the designated evacuation area of 10 kilometers around the quake-damaged plant.
The 3 were chosen randomly for radiation testing from 90 patients and staff who were waiting for airlift by helicopter at a nearby high school on Saturday afternoon.
The prefectural government says the 3 need decontamination to remove the radioactivity. They have not shown any reaction or physical symptoms of the radioactivity yet.
Edit* current radiation levels are such that one hours' exposure is the equivalent of one years' normal radiation exposure
Sunday, March 13, 2011 00:58 +0900 (JST)
Fukushima Prefecture says 3 patients at a hospital near the damaged nuclear power plant have been exposed to radiation.
The hospital is located in Futaba Town about 3 kilometers north of the Fukushima Number One Nuclear Power Plant. It is within the designated evacuation area of 10 kilometers around the quake-damaged plant.
The 3 were chosen randomly for radiation testing from 90 patients and staff who were waiting for airlift by helicopter at a nearby high school on Saturday afternoon.
The prefectural government says the 3 need decontamination to remove the radioactivity. They have not shown any reaction or physical symptoms of the radioactivity yet.
Edit* current radiation levels are such that one hours' exposure is the equivalent of one years' normal radiation exposure
Sunday, March 13, 2011 00:58 +0900 (JST)
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...Reports confirm Seawater is now being injected into the reactor in an emergency cooling operation. This will permanently damage the core: http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/13_01.html ...
Even in the best case scenario, these nuclear plants are going to be down for years. It took over three years to get Kashiwazaki-Kariwa back online, and that was with a much smaller quake and much less damage.
Last I heard, 17% of nuclear energy had been shut down; nuclear is 30% of electricity generation in Japan. So it's a significant chunk that will have to be replaced with coal, gas, or oil.
Will oil prices be further effected with Japan needing imports? We shall see.
Last I heard, 17% of nuclear energy had been shut down; nuclear is 30% of electricity generation in Japan. So it's a significant chunk that will have to be replaced with coal, gas, or oil.
Will oil prices be further effected with Japan needing imports? We shall see.
Reports say emergency declared at No.2 reactor. Venting of air appears to be helping stabilise reactors: http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/12_34.html ...
..Russia have been asked to supply more electricity to make up for the shortfall. Tokyo experiencing rolling blackouts...
..Russia have been asked to supply more electricity to make up for the shortfall. Tokyo experiencing rolling blackouts...
Should Japan have seen this coming? There have been concerns about atomic power before. this is a report I found detailing another Japanese reactor after another earthquake..http://j.mp/guo5Uu
New problem with reactor No. 3..Despite efforts to secure the water supply, cooling is failing...http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/03/12/uk-japan-quake-nuclear-cooling-idUKTRE72B3GM20110312
@ Bells:
Japan is a limestone archipelago, and they do not have any native fossil fuel deposits to my knowledge.
(BTW, I believe that's why their feudal period had very fine steel swords but bamboo armor: all metal was from import stock.)
I imagine the reason they decided to go with nuclear power is that it meant the least importation of outside resources, because generally nuclear power is going to be quite clean (generally), and because they thought they could adequately quake-proof the plants, I suppose.
Japan is a limestone archipelago, and they do not have any native fossil fuel deposits to my knowledge.
(BTW, I believe that's why their feudal period had very fine steel swords but bamboo armor: all metal was from import stock.)
I imagine the reason they decided to go with nuclear power is that it meant the least importation of outside resources, because generally nuclear power is going to be quite clean (generally), and because they thought they could adequately quake-proof the plants, I suppose.
DwayneD.L.Rabon
Registered Senior Member
So then Part of the Danger Exist to save the reactor,It should be completltely exspendaable
DwayneD.L.Rabon
DwayneD.L.Rabon
My braincell seems to recall (from somewhere) that these beasts need continual cooling even when they're off-stream. I'm not sure why this is, but it's necessary to avoid a meltdown. Perhaps the moderator just slows it down rather than stops it. The only way to do that would be to withdraw the fuel-rods, but that in itself leads to other problems. I don't know the particulars of the core in this reactor.
Update from reuters: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/03/12/us-japan-quake-idUSTRE72A0SS20110312
kmguru
Staff member
Some thoughts:
An American gentleman working in one of the plants had to evacuate in a hurry and cut his feet walking on broken glass (CNN interview of the wife). That says, they are still using the old method of clean room clothing with a disposable feet sock.
Even in mid 80's, I worked for an automation company that made special faultproof controllers for nuclear plants that can either drop the control rods or whatever safety system you designed in the event of a radiation leak from inside the reactor chamber. Looks like they did not have such a system.
Putting a plant in a Earthquake prone area should have additional designs like automatically shutting down the reactions in emergency and if that did not work send the entire core a mile deep underground and call it a day! (Geordi - jettison the warp core...)
Apparently the emergency generators failed. One would think they could have portable generators for another layer of redundancy.
I think they never did an audit to improve the safety systems and now paying the price.
An American gentleman working in one of the plants had to evacuate in a hurry and cut his feet walking on broken glass (CNN interview of the wife). That says, they are still using the old method of clean room clothing with a disposable feet sock.
Even in mid 80's, I worked for an automation company that made special faultproof controllers for nuclear plants that can either drop the control rods or whatever safety system you designed in the event of a radiation leak from inside the reactor chamber. Looks like they did not have such a system.
Putting a plant in a Earthquake prone area should have additional designs like automatically shutting down the reactions in emergency and if that did not work send the entire core a mile deep underground and call it a day! (Geordi - jettison the warp core...)
Apparently the emergency generators failed. One would think they could have portable generators for another layer of redundancy.
I think they never did an audit to improve the safety systems and now paying the price.
I once read someone-I forget who, but this seemed very wise, who noted that it is best to keep in mind the natural tendency of people to get complacent when their personal heuristic tells them nothing's gone wrong for a long time.
He advocated designing around the complacency factor, and he had a really good point.
Yep, nothing bad happens, you get sloppy.
The Homer Simpson school of reactor design..Doh!
Info here about the cooling problems from wire srevice japan http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/13_10.html
Why build it in Japan? Answer: energy self-sufficiency for a country with no oil reserves of its own.
Why build it on the coast? Answer (as far as I know): the ocean water can be used for cooling. Did you notice that this reactor doesn't have those large cooling towers you normally associate with nuclear plants?
Modern nuclear reactors are actually pretty safe, and even this one was essentially earthquake proof. The problem here was associated with the tsunami, as I understand it.
Having said that, this plant is 40 years old. Plants would not be built to the same design today.
One more interesting fact on safety in power generation: if you look at the number of deaths per kilowatt hour of energy produced by various different methods, the most dangerous form of electrical power generation is actually hydroelectric. People tend to die when dams break or are breached, and this is more of a problem than deaths due to nuclear accidents.
I think part of the problem is radiophobia and the news media know it and are milking the easy to terrorize public for what its worth.
The other part is a nuclear industry that been so underfunded and so archaic technologically, even the new reactors designs are still PWR and BWR with so many layers of active and passive safety that the expenses is astronomical! If only investment could have been made in Pebble Bed, Molten Salt or Molten Lead cooled reactors, reactors which are safer and cheaper in the long term.
The other part is a nuclear industry that been so underfunded and so archaic technologically, even the new reactors designs are still PWR and BWR with so many layers of active and passive safety that the expenses is astronomical! If only investment could have been made in Pebble Bed, Molten Salt or Molten Lead cooled reactors, reactors which are safer and cheaper in the long term.