Of course they don't. They only operate within the parameters of logic.
It is time for us athiests to stand up for ourselves.
- Thread starter fellowtraveler
- Start date
I apologize on the count, that you are not capable of making your own decision.
I am only reading the book to confirm, that what I already know is true. I don't need any book or person to tell me what is wrong and what is right. I can think for my self. God gave me a brain to think correctly, not to think like you.
Actually. You are completely wrong. I always said I believed in God, until unexplainable things started happening to me. After that I started to really believe in God and everything around me changed. So, this only means that I was in control of what will happen to me. You are wrong in so many ways I would not even use my own words to explain to you what life is about.
God knows. God did not make you do the things you do. He is aware he is always changing and building, because people change and people build.
LOL, if you really think about, this forum is for kicks and giggles really. It does not help you get anywhere in life, but it is a mere past time activity, keep busy, get an idea of what other people think on some more complex subjects. My opinion though lol.
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What are you talking about? 'Known' to be true by whom? Wikipedia?
I've already porvided the reasoning behind the fact that I know for a fact to be true. Regardles of whether Wikipedia knows that it is a fact or not.
hey when you get bored of this silly discussion, go check out my blog, it's cuteee
www.phoneutria.us
Years ago i worked wit a "functional" skitsofrenic... he clamed he wasnt mentaly ill but the army psycharitrist said he was... i ask him... but didnt you notice that you had changed... an he said... he didnt change... everbody else had changed... an that he no longer jus beleived God was real... he now knows God is real cause God "audibly" talks to him ever day... does God talk to you.???
And again you resort to ad homs.
Read Gödel.
Read any of the links provided in Wiki.
No, you have provided specious obfuscation, not reasoning, of why you believe it, not why you know it's true.
What?
OK here then:
1. If a certain proposition is undecidable then it is impossible for a subject to fall under A or B. The subject must fall under C. In other words, it is impossible for the subject to decide (conclude) whether or not the proposition is true or false. He must consider the validity of the proposition to be inconclusive.
2. We can all agree that when operating within the parameters of a particular system of justification, it is possible for propositions to be undecidable. In other words, it is possible for a subject to be unable to arrive at a conclusion regarding the validity of a proposition according to the system of justification that he is implementing.
3. All propositions are either true or false. If a proposition is true, it is true regardless of whether or not:
A. The subject has concluded the proposition to be true.
B. The subject has concluded the proposition to be false.
C. The subject has not arrived at a conclusion on the proposition.
D. It is impossible for the subject to arrive at a conclusion no the proposition.
If a proposition is false, it is false regardless of the same 4 scenarious (A,B,C,D).
4. In order for a proposition to be absolutely undecidable, it must be possible for a subject to be unable to arrive at a conclusion regarding the validity of the proposition regardless of the system of justification that he is implementing.
5. Justification is any material that compels a particular subject to a conclusion. In other words, if a subject has concluded that X is true, then his justification is whatever material compelled him to his conclusion. (Whether or not his conclusion is correct or incorrect.) The material that compels a particular subject to a conclusion depends on that subject.
6. For all propositions possible, all subjects must fall under either only A, only B, or only C.
7. If justification depends on the subject, then there is no perspective (A,B,C) in which it is impossible for the subject to fall under for any proposition.
8. If it is impossible for a subject to not be able fall under A or B regardless of their justification, and if #4, then absolutely undecidable propositions are impossible.
Fail again.
You have provided not an ounce of reasoning.
As usual you have listed your beliefs, without support, as if they were fact:
Again you state:
This is a pre-supposition and NOT a fact.
And again:
I stated "undecidable" NOT "absolutely undecidable".
Either stick to the subject (i.e. my statement) or give up.
what am i suppose to look for? Hmmm pretty cool. I like most of the things on there, since I never knew such things existed.
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I change everyday. Everyone stays the same. I don't talk directly to God. Sometimes something happens and I get a hint, and I get a thought in my head that tells me that was God.
How can you be certan the hint you get is not from the grate deceiver "Satan".???
i've made a decision.
so you already knew about djinn before anyone mentioned it. mad skills bro.
All the facts I'm presenting operate within the parameters of logic. Thus, paradoxes, infinites, things that are true and false at the same time, things that are neither true or false, operate outside of these contraints. All of the facts being presented are only applicable within the parameters of logic.
Thus, within these parameters there are some important things that must be established before proceeding. What would you say about the following?
1. Should we use logic as a practical form of reasoning in order to draw conclusions about reality?
2. Do propositions exist in 1 of 2 possible states of true or false?
3. Does a subject's conclusion about a proposition have an effect on the actual state of the proposition?
4. Is it possible for a subject to be completely certain about his conclusion regarding a t/f state of a proposition that is different from its actual state? (In other words, is it possible for the subject to conclude that X is true if X is actually false?)
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Except that you are not presenting facts, merely suppositions.
This being the most notable:
Since we know that there are undecidable propositions that doesn't hold up.
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Incorrect. Even if that load was correct, it wouldn't change the fact that propositions can only be either only true or only false.
Fruthermore, nothing can be proven considering you haven't established what is valid about the following:
Wrong, as I have shown.
Once again you're making claims based on nothing more than your own personal view.
I can only assume (since you have so far presented no evidence whatsoever) that you're going to continue spouting your own "thoughts" as fact and that you have nothing solid to contribute.
Wrong again: if something is undecidable then it is neither true nor false.
Yeah I have a tendency to ignore nothing.
Because, I know when Satan is trying to scare me. Satan only deceives, he does not help you. I do watch TV sometimes history channel, about Anti-Christ and whatever not. I sometimes doubt that it is God and I do think maybe my purpose is for Satan, but I snap out of it and I find my way. Satan always strikes when weak, in doubt, and scared. That is why everytime something like this happens, I only realized the truth. I realized the bad. than I realized the good. Which only leaves truth, regardless of good or bad.