Islam Democracy and Women

[surenderer]

Hello All,
It is a common misconception that Islam has problems with democracies and women however that FACTS show that if one forgets the rantings of fundamentalists who are the extreme minority most muslims daily lives do not confirm the idea of a faith that is intrinsically anti-western or antimodern.The most populous Muslim country in the world...Indonesia has had a secular goverment since its independence in 1949.As for Islam's compatibility with capitalism Indonesia was untill recently the Worlds Bank model Third World country, having liberalized its economy and having grown 7% a year for almost 3 decades and since it has embraced democracy and has elected a woman president After Indonesia the three largest Muslim populations in the world are in Pakistian,Bangladesh and India(India has over 120 million muslims)Not only have these countries had much experience with democracy but all 3 have elected women as prime ministers and they all did so well before well before most western countries.In Afghanistan before it's 20 year descent into chaos and tyranny(do to mainly the Soviet and US interference)40% of all doctors were women(WORLD ATLAS) and Kabul was one of the most liberated cities for women in all of Asia. Although Bin Laden loved the Talibian most Afghans didnt which is why we saw in post-Talibian Afghanistian men shaving there beards and flying kites listening to music...etc.....This is all not to mention Turkey who has the 5th largest muslim population with a functioning democracy and is also a member of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization(NATO ) and perhaps soon to be a member of the European Union . Their are other democracies as well....Nigeria Mali etc.....but my point here is that the majority of muslims today live in democracies and this is a statistical FACT so if there is an incompatibility problem between Islam and Democracy approximatly 800 million muslims seem not to know it The real problem isnt the muslim world but the middle east. The allure of Isalmic Fundementalism is strong their because of western "meddling"(remember that the west went to war with afghanistan and Iraq even though neither one of those two countries ever commited and terrorism against the US) but it seens that the Arab world carries the "islamic banner" and when one thinks of islam their mind always is drawn to the middle east yet only 260 million of 1.5 billion muslims live there. People use the word Arab and Muslims interchangeably but the obviously dont mean the same thing. So i guess my point is how much problems would the middle east have if not for the oil under their sands and the western desire for it?Muslims outside the middle east seem to be living fine(although alot are in 3rd world countries) It's a fact the the west would play one side against the other in the middle east(iran-iraq war) in order to get what they want it is also a fact that the ME was carved up by the west without any regards to Tribal or ethnic considerations. The nation of Kuwait was created simply to cut off Iraq frm the Persian Gulf by the West which had those two nations squabbling for decades and eventually was one on the main factors leading to the 1st Gulf War. All this is without even mentioning Israel which was created in the middle of Arab lands without any regards for it's inhabitants there.These are my only my opinions but the stats i have given are facts but i would like to hear others views on these things(i am on vacation but will respond whenever able ) thanks to all and peace to you

 

[Leo Volont]

True enough concerning women. But we need to look closely at the reason why Islam 'allows' women to work. It is mostly because the men entertain the old Pastoral Nomad Ideal of the Men Never doing any Work at all -- reserving their strengths for Tribal Warfare, which translates simply into stealing and pillaging other Nomads or raiding Civilized Townships and Settlements. Visit any Country in the Near East and see for yourself that it is the tendency of the Men to be dissatisfied with any passtime besides drinking, gambling, smoking and whoring. If it was not for the Women doing the Work, no work would be done. Is that not the way it is in Afganistan today -- with the Women forbidden to work, the only thing that gets done is the Fighting and the Killing which the men are most glad to do.

 

[surenderer]

True enough concerning women. But we need to look closely at the reason why Islam 'allows' women to work. It is mostly because the men entertain the old Pastoral Nomad Ideal of the Men Never doing any Work at all -- reserving their strengths for Tribal Warfare, which translates simply into stealing and pillaging other Nomads or raiding Civilized Townships and Settlements. Visit any Country in the Near East and see for yourself that it is the tendency of the Men to be dissatisfied with any passtime besides drinking, gambling, smoking and whoring. If it was not for the Women doing the Work, no work would be done. Is that not the way it is in Afganistan today -- with the Women forbidden to work, the only thing that gets done is the Fighting and the Killing which the men are most glad to do.

I have visitied the near east as a matter of fact i have lived their before and you are wrong.Sorry Leo but in Islamic culture the men are the "bread-winners" and they are responsible for the finincial stability of the family and the woman gets to keep all her money for herself to do with as she pleases

Visit any Country in the Near East and see for yourself that it is the tendency of the Men to be dissatisfied with any passtime besides drinking, gambling, smoking and whoring

Yea that happens all the time in muslim countries ...sounds more likke a western thing to me

If it was not for the Women doing the Work, no work would be done

Well that may be true in the household because Islam teaches that women are naturally better child raisers than men are(maternal instincts)

Is that not the way it is in Afganistan today -- with the Women forbidden to work, the only thing that gets done is the Fighting and the Killing which the men are most glad to do

Well Afghanistian today is not a good example beacause it has been used as a "playground"for the US-USSR wars but how about before the superpowers got involved?

 

[James R]

Leo:

Please read the forum posting guidelines regarding stereotyping of members of a particular religion. If you keep this up, I will initially delete your posts, which means any useful content in them will go along with the rest.

 

[§outh§tar]

Isn't there a topic directly below this entitled "What is the status of women in Islam"?


A mod should merge them or something..