Is it right to call a bigot a bigot?

Magical Realist

Valued Senior Member
I believe it is. And no I don't buy the "turning of the tables" tactic of accusing people who don't tolerate bigotry of bigotry themselves. If you are against bigotry that means you are FOR tolerance, not against it. A bigot is a mindset and not a state of being. It can be enlightened and changed. That's why calling out bigots is not only a right, but a responsibility as well. People need to see where they are being bigoted so that they can overcome it. Here's a relevant article on this very topic:

"I hate name calling. It's disrespectful, offensive and just plain stupid. If you're not like me and love name calling, then (no surprise) the Internet is the perfect place for you, especially social media sites like YouTube and Twitter. Or maybe you should just have your own blog.

There are lots of really offensive name callers out there, but in my experience the worst ones are the gun advocates. I'm talking about minuteman militia-type guys who laugh at the idea that the Second Amendment is about self-defense. They say you're a moron if you think that. You see, it's really about the need to arm yourself against the federal government. The militia guys are afraid that at any second the government is going to land in Black Hawk helicopters on their front lawns, storm their compounds and take away their guns. They know that the U.S. government is pretty well-armed. After all, they have thousands of nuclear weapons, and the militia guys don't want to be caught flatfooted. So they are looking to stockpile as much high-powered weaponry as they possibly can. You see, that's what the founding fathers intended.

If you're thinking about sending out a really radical gun control tweet, like saying that having more than 300 million guns floating around the country might actually make us all less safe, be sure to cancel your schedule for the rest of the day. You'll have your hands full fighting off a name-calling barrage of apocalyptic proportions from a host of Second Amendment "experts" who want you to know in no uncertain terms that you are absolutely one of the dumbest mofos ever to crawl across the face of the Earth.

So I do indeed hate name calling. It's typically a self-indicting waste of time and an embarrassing admission of intellectual bankruptcy. But is name calling always wrong? No, actually it's not. As Ralph Waldo Emerson once said, "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Emerson's wisdom applies in the case of name calling. Specifically, if somebody is a bigot, you have a right -- in fact, you have a responsibility -- to call them out and say, "Hey, you're a bigot."

Most bigots don't think they're bigots. They think they're right. When I was growing up in an all-white working-class suburb just outside Philadelphia, almost all the adults in my neighborhood were racists. Some of them were rabidly racist. They called black people "niggers" and "coons." Others were less obvious. But all these people had the same view: They all thought that black people were inferior to white people, intrinsically inferior, that is. They thought that black people were by nature stupid, immoral and dangerous. Yes, dangerous. Ironically, the white racists in my neighborhood were afraid of the people they looked down upon. They also all thought that they themselves were good, god-fearing Christians. They didn't think they were racists. They didn't think they were bigots. They thought they were right.

It's the same today with most people who are anti-gay and anti-transgender. I'm sure the entire congregation of the Westboro Baptist Church thinks of themselves as good, god-fearing Christians. They think they're not bigots. They think they're just right. I mean, their website is called GodHatesFags.com.

Clearly, if somebody is a bigot, we need to call that person a bigot. But in calling out bigots, let's start with the biggest bigot of all. To paraphrase the Westboro Baptists, God, or at least the god of the Old Testament, is anti-gay and anti-transgender. But obviously the Old Testament god's bigotry doesn't make bigotry right. It just makes the Old Testament god a bad god. Shame on him, and shame on anybody who uses the Bible to justify their own bigotry against gay and transgender people.

Of course, "the Bible tells me so" is the single most popular way that people justify anti-gay and anti-transgender bigotry. It's the number-one justification that Republicans use for continuing to oppose marriage equality. John Boehner made exactly that justification earlier this month when he said, "I believe that marriage is the union of one man and one woman. ... It's what I grew up with. It's what I believe. It's what my church teaches me. And I can't imagine that position would ever change." John, I'm here to tell you and all your anti-marriage-equality Republican colleagues in the House that that's bigotry.

Of course, all fundamentalist Christian ministers and their followers are anti-gay and anti-transgender as well, and they all base their opposition to gay and transgender people on the Bible. There's little need to call out the Westboro Baptist types. They pretty much call themselves out. It's the nicer ones who seem kind of moderate and reasonable whom we need to confront. They're much more dangerous, because they make anti-gay and anti-transgender bigotry seem so righteous and holy. I'm talking about nice, reasonable, moderate ministers like Rick Warren and Joel Osteen. Rick does donate millions of dollars to fight HIV/AIDS, and Joel is always so very, very nice, but Rick and Joel are both anti-gay, and they both oppose marriage equality.

It really comes down to this: If, based on your religious beliefs, you demonize people because of their sexual orientation or gender identity, and you deny people the right to have sex and marry, then you are against freedom and equality for those people. You are practicing bigotry. You are a bigot, and you deserve to be called a bigot.

Yes, it is right to call a bigot a bigot. In fact, it is a responsibility. I will embrace that responsibility whenever necessary, and I call upon everyone who values freedom and equality for all people to do the same."----http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-joe-wenke/is-it-right-to-call-a-bigot-a-bigot_b_2948207.html
 
I believe it is. And no I don't buy the "turning of the tables" tactic of accusing people who don't tolerate bigotry of bigotry themselves. If you are against bigotry that means you are FOR tolerance, not against it. A bigot is a mindset and not a state of being. It can be enlightened and changed. That's why calling out bigots is not only a right, but a responsibility as well. People need to see where they are being bigoted so that they can overcome it. Here's a relevant article on this very topic:

"I hate name calling. It's disrespectful, offensive and just plain stupid. If you're not like me and love name calling, then (no surprise) the Internet is the perfect place for you, especially social media sites like YouTube and Twitter. Or maybe you should just have your own blog.

There are lots of really offensive name callers out there, but in my experience the worst ones are the gun advocates. I'm talking about minuteman militia-type guys who laugh at the idea that the Second Amendment is about self-defense. They say you're a moron if you think that. You see, it's really about the need to arm yourself against the federal government. The militia guys are afraid that at any second the government is going to land in Black Hawk helicopters on their front lawns, storm their compounds and take away their guns. They know that the U.S. government is pretty well-armed. After all, they have thousands of nuclear weapons, and the militia guys don't want to be caught flatfooted. So they are looking to stockpile as much high-powered weaponry as they possibly can. You see, that's what the founding fathers intended.

If you're thinking about sending out a really radical gun control tweet, like saying that having more than 300 million guns floating around the country might actually make us all less safe, be sure to cancel your schedule for the rest of the day. You'll have your hands full fighting off a name-calling barrage of apocalyptic proportions from a host of Second Amendment "experts" who want you to know in no uncertain terms that you are absolutely one of the dumbest mofos ever to crawl across the face of the Earth.

So I do indeed hate name calling. It's typically a self-indicting waste of time and an embarrassing admission of intellectual bankruptcy. But is name calling always wrong? No, actually it's not. As Ralph Waldo Emerson once said, "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Emerson's wisdom applies in the case of name calling. Specifically, if somebody is a bigot, you have a right -- in fact, you have a responsibility -- to call them out and say, "Hey, you're a bigot."

Most bigots don't think they're bigots. They think they're right. When I was growing up in an all-white working-class suburb just outside Philadelphia, almost all the adults in my neighborhood were racists. Some of them were rabidly racist. They called black people "niggers" and "coons." Others were less obvious. But all these people had the same view: They all thought that black people were inferior to white people, intrinsically inferior, that is. They thought that black people were by nature stupid, immoral and dangerous. Yes, dangerous. Ironically, the white racists in my neighborhood were afraid of the people they looked down upon. They also all thought that they themselves were good, god-fearing Christians. They didn't think they were racists. They didn't think they were bigots. They thought they were right.

It's the same today with most people who are anti-gay and anti-transgender. I'm sure the entire congregation of the Westboro Baptist Church thinks of themselves as good, god-fearing Christians. They think they're not bigots. They think they're just right. I mean, their website is called GodHatesFags.com.

Clearly, if somebody is a bigot, we need to call that person a bigot. But in calling out bigots, let's start with the biggest bigot of all. To paraphrase the Westboro Baptists, God, or at least the god of the Old Testament, is anti-gay and anti-transgender. But obviously the Old Testament god's bigotry doesn't make bigotry right. It just makes the Old Testament god a bad god. Shame on him, and shame on anybody who uses the Bible to justify their own bigotry against gay and transgender people.

Of course, "the Bible tells me so" is the single most popular way that people justify anti-gay and anti-transgender bigotry. It's the number-one justification that Republicans use for continuing to oppose marriage equality. John Boehner made exactly that justification earlier this month when he said, "I believe that marriage is the union of one man and one woman. ... It's what I grew up with. It's what I believe. It's what my church teaches me. And I can't imagine that position would ever change." John, I'm here to tell you and all your anti-marriage-equality Republican colleagues in the House that that's bigotry.

Of course, all fundamentalist Christian ministers and their followers are anti-gay and anti-transgender as well, and they all base their opposition to gay and transgender people on the Bible. There's little need to call out the Westboro Baptist types. They pretty much call themselves out. It's the nicer ones who seem kind of moderate and reasonable whom we need to confront. They're much more dangerous, because they make anti-gay and anti-transgender bigotry seem so righteous and holy. I'm talking about nice, reasonable, moderate ministers like Rick Warren and Joel Osteen. Rick does donate millions of dollars to fight HIV/AIDS, and Joel is always so very, very nice, but Rick and Joel are both anti-gay, and they both oppose marriage equality.

It really comes down to this: If, based on your religious beliefs, you demonize people because of their sexual orientation or gender identity, and you deny people the right to have sex and marry, then you are against freedom and equality for those people. You are practicing bigotry. You are a bigot, and you deserve to be called a bigot.

Yes, it is right to call a bigot a bigot. In fact, it is a responsibility. I will embrace that responsibility whenever necessary, and I call upon everyone who values freedom and equality for all people to do the same."----http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-joe-wenke/is-it-right-to-call-a-bigot-a-bigot_b_2948207.html

Very good post. :thumbsup::thumbsup:
 
I'm talking about minuteman militia-type guys who laugh at the idea that the Second Amendment is about self-defense. They say you're a moron if you think that. You see, it's really about the need to arm yourself against the federal government. The militia guys are afraid that at any second the government is going to land in Black Hawk helicopters on their front lawns, storm their compounds and take away their guns. They know that the U.S. government is pretty well-armed. After all, they have thousands of nuclear weapons, and the militia guys don't want to be caught flatfooted. So they are looking to stockpile as much high-powered weaponry as they possibly can. You see, that's what the founding fathers intended.
In addition to anything else you want to call these guys, they are also incredibly stupid.

Have they actually seen the shit that the government has at its disposal for identifying, finding, targeting and killing people it doesn't want to put up with? They can track down a guy, follow his activities, and gun him down with a drone while the chicken-shit drone operator sits comfortably in an air-conditioned office on the other side of the planet! If they decide that one of us is too much trouble to keep around, they can see his infrared signature right through the roof of his house and shoot him in his sleep!

And I haven't even mentioned their much larger, more powerful weapons, such as airplanes with machine guns and missiles, or nuclear bombs that can kill the entire population of a rather large town! Guns ain't worth shit in this scenario.

If you're thinking about sending out a really radical gun control tweet, like saying that having more than 300 million guns floating around the country might actually make us all less safe . . . .
Indeed! Every gun in America is five times more likely to be used to kill the owner, a family member, friend, neighbor, stranger, or victim in another state shot by the gun after it is stolen, than to actually be used in self-defense against a human or wild animal with both the desire and ability to kill the owner.

Of course, all fundamentalist Christian ministers and their followers are anti-gay and anti-transgender as well, and they all base their opposition to gay and transgender people on the Bible.
Which I find so amazing. It seems to me that God must really love the LGBT community because he made so many of them! Roughly ten percent of the population is LGBT: this means there are more of them than there are people with high enough IQs to be software developers! So which one does God love more?

There's little need to call out the Westboro Baptist types.
Today's e-mail tag line:

Live your life in such a way that the Westboro Baptists will picket your funeral.

It really comes down to this: If, based on your religious beliefs, you demonize people because of their sexual orientation or gender identity, and you deny people the right to have sex and marry, then you are against freedom and equality for those people. You are practicing bigotry. You are a bigot, and you deserve to be called a bigot.
How about people who demonize others because they belong to a different religion? Christians and Muslims in particular have been killing people outside of their faith since their faiths arose. The Muslims are still doing it, and the only reason the Christians stopped for a while is that Hitler was so good at it that they were able to rest for a few decades and still maintain a good long-term record of religiously-inspired murder.
 
In addition to anything else you want to call these guys, they are also incredibly stupid.

Have they actually seen the shit that the government has at its disposal for identifying, finding, targeting and killing people it doesn't want to put up with? They can track down a guy, follow his activities, and gun him down with a drone while the chicken-shit drone operator sits comfortably in an air-conditioned office on the other side of the planet! If they decide that one of us is too much trouble to keep around, they can see his infrared signature right through the roof of his house and shoot him in his sleep!

And I haven't even mentioned their much larger, more powerful weapons, such as airplanes with machine guns and missiles, or nuclear bombs that can kill the entire population of a rather large town! Guns ain't worth shit in this scenario.

So why isn't Al-Qaeda wiped out then? They're America's #1 target, Republican and Democrat alike. Most of them have little better than small arms and improvised explosive devices.
 
Mystery of the Ages?

GeoffP said:

So why isn't Al-Qaeda wiped out then? They're America's #1 target, Republican and Democrat alike. Most of them have little better than small arms and improvised explosive devices.

Nobody knows.
 
So why isn't Al-Qaeda wiped out then? They're America's #1 target, Republican and Democrat alike. Most of them have little better than small arms and improvised explosive devices.
Every time we wipe out someone we don't like in a distant location, we typically take out a couple of innocents too. We don't have a personnel list, but there are probably at least several thousand people who consider themselves members of Al-Qaeda. If we kill ten thousand innocent people in order to take them out, the consequences would be unbearable. The entire world would hate America--if they don't already!

It's a lot easier to do a precision drone attack on someone in America. We have much more information. It's not a stretch to say that the government could figure out exactly where in a house the person is sleeping/standing/bathing/eating and wait until no one else is close enough to be killed by the strike.

We can't be that precise in Pakistan, where most Al Qaeda members spend most of their time.

The Pakistanis are already pretty pissed off at us. If we kill another 10,000 of their people they'll probably shoot one of their nuclear weapons at us! Or maybe at Israel, our little lapdog.
 
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