How to save earth from hot earth theory and I don’t mean stop global warming.

Sarkus said:
A figure I keep seeing suggests about 2/3 of atmospheric oxygen is produced by phytoplankton. That said, I've also read that phytoplankton population has reduced something like 40% since the 1950s, yet the atmospheric oxygen levels haven't changed that much. So it's unlikely to be a simple answer.
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No simple answer indeed.... true.
Even if we assume that the study you cite has a large error factor we are still dealing with a reduction in phytoplankton during a time when an increase would be necessary to offset O2 consumption. ( based on the premise of an equilibrium being involved prior to the industrial revolution.)

Give the safety margin is only about 1% any reduction in O2 levels would be seriously troubling.
Also I have little faith that the current published value of 20.956% O2 is actually true.
 
billvon said:
You could test it yourself if you cared to.
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I originally thought that was the case but found out that it isn't quite that simple. I can't remember the detail but will revisit the issue. Something about the Scrips method was very important...
 
Quantum Quack said:
There is a difference between a science that states "most likely" referring to events millions of years ago and science that deals with raw data today don't you think?
  • Why do you feel that the Paleontology you use to debunk climate change is more credible than science being done today?
and
  • Why do you think comparing a million year time period to a hundred year time period is somehow beneficial to your cause?
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Perhaps you misunderstand
I have no desire nor intent to "debunk climate change"
I embrace the science of climate change.
Climate and weather are the same and yet fundamentally different.
Studying climate over thousands and millions of years shows us the parameters of climate variations.
Knowing the climate that was is a damned good indicator of what climate will be.

May I repeat:
Study your ancestors who thrived during mis 11(esp. heidelbergensis in south africa.) then extrapolate to the climate and abundance)
then look to the climate during mis 11
then use the knowledge to judge where we are within the current changing climate.

We just may be in the 1st 1/2 of another superintergacial
(look to the 400 kyr cycle)

...........................
I have yet to find a climate model which could accurately predict long term climate change and the effects thereof .
Perhaps, one day, someone will have developed one?
It ain't happened yet, but that does not mean that the modelers should quit trying.
 
sculptor said:
Perhaps you misunderstand
I have no desire nor intent to "debunk climate change"
I embrace the science of climate change.
Climate and weather are the same and yet fundamentally different.
Studying climate over thousands and millions of years shows us the parameters of climate variations.
Knowing the climate that was is a damned good indicator of what climate will be.

May I repeat:
Study your ancestors who thrived during mis 11(esp. heidelbergensis in south africa.) then extrapolate to the climate and abundance)
then look to the climate during mis 11
then use the knowledge to judge where we are within the current changing climate.

We just may be in the 1st 1/2 of another superintergacial
(look to the 400 kyr cycle)

...........................
I have yet to find a climate model which could accurately predict long term climate change and the effects thereof .
Perhaps, one day, someone will have developed one?
It ain't happened yet, but that does not mean that the modelers should quit trying.
Click to expand...
Over what change time scales are you referring to in years?

certainly more than 100 or so?
 
Quantum Quack said:
Also I have little faith that the current published value of 20.956% O2 is actually true.
Click to expand...
It changes constantly. Most uses of Google-fu suggest that it is declining, and has been for a while, but not significantly so as to put life (as we know it) at risk.
Reports suggest a 0.7% reduction in O2 over the past 800,000 years, although 0.1% over the past 100, possibly due to the increase in CO2 over that same period (but that's just me guessing).
To put that in perspective, a 0.7% reduction is apparently what you'd expect going from sea-level to 100 metres up, for example, so you'd need significant change in 02 level before anything too much happened.
I guess the first thing you'd see is the tree line (i.e. Above which plants don't grow) on mountains start lowering slightly.
 
Have already made reference to such see:
Post # 74 and #85

And note that the window is only 1% O2 reduction before acclimatization is not possible however adaption is (with symptoms of hypoxia being a part of that adaptation)

Edit: Apologies Sarkus. For some reason I am being a tad arrogant. I am not sure why...Perhaps it is a reaction to the distressing nature of the topic...

I believe you and I have similar thoughts on the issue...
 
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sculptor said:
Knowing the climate that was is a damned good indicator of what climate will be.
- - -
We just may be in the 1st 1/2 of another superintergacial
(look to the 400 kyr cycle)
Click to expand...
If we are in the first half of another superinterglacial, we are in one that has been altered by a sudden and dramatic boost in the CO2 concentration of the atmosphere.

This boost has had the expected effects on global weather, and so on global climate. These have been measured. They are without known precedent, just as the sudden and continuing CO2 boost is without known precedent.

So add that to your knowledge of the climate that was, in guessing the climate that will be.
 
billvon said:
You could test it yourself if you cared to.
Click to expand...

Several techniques have become available for measuring atmospheric oxygen.
  • The one used at Scripps Institution of Oceanography is interferometry, which exploits the refractive properties of different precisely known wavelengths to measure the oxygen/nitrogen ratio (O2/N2) (Keeling et al. 1998).
Other methods have since been developed, including:
  • paramagnetic analysis (Manning and Keeling, 1999),
  • gas chromatography (Tohjima, 2000), vacuum ultraviolet absorption (Stephens and Keeling, 2003; mass spectrometry (Bender, 2005) and
  • differential fuel-cell analysis (Stephens et al. 2007).

​
src: http://cdiac.ess-dive.lbl.gov/trends/oxygen/modern_records.html
(reformatted)
 
Today we have extrordinary firestorm in Queensland and record November flooding in Sydney. Not lookin' good.
 
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