God is the highest power there is - so?

[greenberg]

God is sometimes said to be the highest power there is.
It is also said sometimes that people must obey God's orders.


Does it therefore follow that because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders?

If you think it follows - please justify why you think so.

 

[lightgigantic]

God is sometimes said to be the highest power there is.
It is also said sometimes that people must obey God's orders.


Does it therefore follow that because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders?

If you think it follows - please justify why you think so.

sometimes god is described as occupying the highest conceivable ontological position because nobody has the option to disobey him - for instance love or loathe god, the time factor (a potency attributed to god) ticks on regardless.

Of course there are some things that we can decide to be obedient to or not - but our attitude to such issues simply results in a situation like a persons decision to be dis/obedient to civil laws (ie one either is a free citizen or in jail) - in either case, the power of authority does not diminish.

 

[ashura]

Mmm, does that really answer the question though? You stated that yes, God is the highest power and that we can choose to obey him. But the analogy to governmental authority is interesting because the question is should we obey. In the instance of government, sometimes the law can be considered wrong and some people feel a moral obligation to disobey. But can such a position exist with God? Is there ever an opportunity when we shouldn't obey God?

 

[lightgigantic]

Mmm, does that really answer the question though? You stated that yes, God is the highest power and that we can choose to obey him. But the analogy to governmental authority is interesting because the question is should we obey. In the instance of government, sometimes the law can be considered wrong and some people feel a moral obligation to disobey. But can such a position exist with God? Is there ever an opportunity when we shouldn't obey God?

obviously the government is only an analogy and it only holds as far as simple issues - for instance if you don't want to obey the suggestion on what side of the road to drive on you will be made to obey whatever infringements/penalties are imposed for traffic violations - in other words the citizen has no scope for absolute independence because they are existing within a "controlled" environment at all times. In the same way, the living entity has no scope for independent existence outside of the jurisdiction of god (even the material world is a sub division of god's realm)

 

[ashura]

So basically, there never is an opportunity when we shouldn't obey God since his jurisdiction is the only jurisdiction there is?

 

[lightgigantic]

So basically, there never is an opportunity when we shouldn't obey God since his jurisdiction is the only jurisdiction there is?

well no, not unless you think it doesn't matter which side of the road you should drive on, since either way you will just end up being obedient to government rules - even within controlled jurisdictions there are choices

 

[ashura]

Sorry, poorly worded.

So basically, there never is an opportunity when we shouldn't obey God since his jurisdiction is absolute? There can never be any exceptions unlike laws or governments which can be changed or overthrown.

 

[lightgigantic]

Sorry, poorly worded.

So basically, there never is an opportunity when we shouldn't obey God since his jurisdiction is absolute? There can never be any exceptions unlike laws or governments which can be changed or overthrown.

no, there is no more opportunity to overthrow god than there is to jump over one's knees - that is one of many differences between god and mundane governments

 

[Grantywanty]

God is sometimes said to be the highest power there is.
It is also said sometimes that people must obey God's orders.


Does it therefore follow that because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders?

If you think it follows - please justify why you think so.

Not in general. The whole obey thing seems to parallel despotic earthly rulers. Why some all powerful being wants to sit around giving orders and handing out punishments is beyond me. We seem to be rather complicated creatures, surely God or Gods or She or It had something more interesting in mind.

Oh, I'll make them horney and then limit their sex. And they better fucking listen.

If this is the way God is, I think we have a moral obligation to show him that he is selling the possiblities of a universe short. Come on down and play, get that stick out of your ass.

We can't just leave God in this impoverished conception of his role. I mean if my Dad had just sat around in his armchair barking out orders, it certainly wouldn't have helped him get a life if I had pretended that obeying was being respectful.

 

[ashura]

But your dad can't toss me into burning pits of pain and abstinence like Jesus' dad can.

 

[Grantywanty]

Until I was about 12 my Dad could kick my ass without getting out of that chair.
On the other hand my Dad was a nice guy.
If God is like in the Bible
then I hate him
and if he is omniscient He knows this
and no amount of ass-kissing will get me around this. He will find me out. There is not way I can contort myself to consider that a loving God.
Hell, he should have plucked Jesus off that cross when the guy was leaning back with the mallet, if he could have, that is.
All the explanations about why that was a holy event are similar to all the justifications of sexual abusers.

 

[greenberg]

no, there is no more opportunity to overthrow god than there is to jump over one's knees - that is one of many differences between god and mundane governments

You still haven't addressed the OP question. The OP doesn't ask whether God's will can be overthrown. Presuming that God is omnipotent, God's will will be done anyway.


The question is,

"Because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders" - does that follow, and if yes, why?

 

[ashura]

From what I gather, his answer is yes because God is always right. A very simplistic broken down version of his view, yes, but that's your answer.

 

[greenberg]

From what I gather, his answer is yes because God is always right. A very simplistic broken down version of his view, yes, but that's your answer.

I am open to the possibility that there might be more answers to that question. IOW, I am interested in different justifications for that yes.
Hence a thread.

 

[SkinWalker]

God is sometimes said to be the highest power there is.
It is also said sometimes that people must obey God's orders.


Does it therefore follow that because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders?

If you think it follows - please justify why you think so.

Which god? There have been thousands of extant and extinct gods in human history and prehistory. Before one could answer the question, shouldn't one determine, first, which god you are referring to? And, even then, there is no good reason to accept that [insert favorite god] is the correct god to follow. And, if one is to adhere to the notion that "all gods are really the same god" (an argument that isn't tenable since the gods of humanity have varied and diverse mythical qualities that are often very contradictory in nature), then can it really be said that there are "orders" given by this god? The orders of the Judeo-Christian gods frequently contradict those of the Muslim god; both of these mythical deities contradict other gods like Zeus, Atun, Ptah, Quetzacoatl, etc.

OP commits an existential fallacy by assuming a priori that there exists a singular god that all can agree upon and that there exists [a god at all.

 

[Grandtheftcow]

God is sometimes said to be the highest power there is.
It is also said sometimes that people must obey God's orders.


Does it therefore follow that because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders?

If you think it follows - please justify why you think so.

It doesn't follow because it isn't based on evidence or reality.

As an example some women say they have trouble achieving an orgasm.

Some women say chocolate is better than sex.

Therefore in order to achieve an orgasm women should use chocolate.

See how easy it is to make two claims and string them together as if they were truthful or accurate.

 

[sandy]

God is sometimes said to be the highest power there is.
It is also said sometimes that people must obey God's orders.
Does it therefore follow that because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders?
If you think it follows - please justify why you think so.

God is THE highest power. He is the great "I am". When you're HIS child, you WANT to obey Him. You WANT to be pleasing to Him. Nothing else matters. Nothing.

 

[SkinWalker]

God is THE highest power. He is the great "I am". When you're HIS child, you WANT to obey Him. You WANT to be pleasing to Him. Nothing else matters. Nothing.

Which god of the thousands of gods in human mythology are you referring to? And, on what evidence do you base these claims?

 

[greenberg]

Which god? There have been thousands of extant and extinct gods in human history and prehistory. Before one could answer the question, shouldn't one determine, first, which god you are referring to? And, even then, there is no good reason to accept that [insert favorite god] is the correct god to follow. And, if one is to adhere to the notion that "all gods are really the same god" (an argument that isn't tenable since the gods of humanity have varied and diverse mythical qualities that are often very contradictory in nature), then can it really be said that there are "orders" given by this god? The orders of the Judeo-Christian gods frequently contradict those of the Muslim god; both of these mythical deities contradict other gods like Zeus, Atun, Ptah, Quetzacoatl, etc.

OP commits an existential fallacy by assuming a priori that there exists a singular god that all can agree upon and that there exists [a god at all.

I see what you mean and it was something I took into consideration before posting.

But the statements "God is sometimes said to be the highest power there is" and "It is also said sometimes that people must obey God's orders" apply to several religions, several schools within a religion. So respondents from various religions and their schools will feel addressed.

What I'm after are the various justifications for that "yes" (or "no") to the question "Because God is the highest power there is, people must obey God's orders" - does that follow, and if yes, why?

 

[greenberg]

Which god of the thousands of gods in human mythology are you referring to?
And, on what evidence do you base these claims?

It's not necessary to ask such questions for the purposes of this thread.
I only wish to see the justifications for that "yes", wherever they come from, whatever they are.