Genesis Authorship

Live4Him

Registered Senior Member
The authorship of the first book of the Bible is Genesis. While the author of this book is not known, there are two competing theories.

JEDP

Liberal religious theologians in the 1800's, advocating the gradual development of religion, proposed that the Bible developed gradually. One of the ideas that resulted from this thinking gained popularity with many. The foundation for this belief is that Genesis could not have been written by eyewitnesses of the events. Rather, the stories in Genesis are a compilation of oral traditions passed down from many different sources.

Thus, the early books of the Bible were believed to have been written by unknown authors during the Divided Kingdom (approx 800 - 582 BC). The books, including Genesis, were believed to have been compiled from several sources, each which could be distinguished by the name used for God. The J-Document used the name Jehovah, the E-Document used Elohim, while the D and P documents were named for Deuteronomic and Priestly, respectively.

Thus, they alleged that the Bible did not originate from eye-witnessed events.


TABLET THEORY

Even during a casual reading of the book of Genesis, one will notice that the book is divided into sections, each separated by similar phrases. The passages below are the division points of Genesis.

1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2:4 This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were created.
5:1 This is the written account of Adam’s line.
6:9 This is the account of Noah.
10:1 This is the account of Shem, Ham and Japheth, Noah’s sons,
11:10 This is the account of Shem.
11:27 This is the account of Terah.
25:12 This is the account of Abraham’s son Ishmael,
25:19 This is the account of Abraham’s son Isaac.
36:1 This is the account of Esau (that is, Edom).
36:9 This is the account of Esau
37:2 This is the account of Jacob.
50:26 So Joseph died

Note that 5:1 specifically mentions it is a written account, rather than oral tradition. Also note, that there are TWO accounts of Esau. This would not occur if it were an oral tradition because the stories would be merged into one. But, it WOULD occur if an author was copying or translating the account from a tablet onto a scroll.

Thus the phrase "this is the account" connects the various sections together.

And, this agrees with other Biblical passages that Moses passed the information down, but it came from his ancestors.

John 7:22 Yet, because Moses gave you circumcision (though actually it did not come from Moses, but from the patriarchs), you circumcise a child on the Sabbath.

COULD ADAM WRITE?

Next, lets address the issue of whether Adam could have left a written record. Lets see if Adam could have left a written record before he died.

1) Some Bible scholars have proposed a date of approximately 6000 years ago as the creation of the world, and thus Adam.

2) The earliest known writings are approximately 5500 - 5100 years old.
http://www.staff.ncl.ac.uk/hermann.moisl/ell365/oldest_writing.htm

3) According to scripture (Gen 5:5), Adam live 930 years.

Thus, if one accepts the 6000 years-ago date, and the Gen 5:5 passage, Adam could have left a written record of his life. Second, Adam would have been very proud of this ability, since it was new technology at the time. And, being proud of the use of new technology, he was very likely to mention it in his history. Later authors wouldn't be as likely to mention "old" technology in their respective histories, so it is not mentioned.

However, if these were compiled oral traditions, then one should expect to see the same verbiage in all of the connecting phrases (i.e. "this is the account of" -or- "this is the written account of"). But we see it ONLY in the person's life that first witnessed the new technology.

CONCLUSION

Genesis is a compiled book of histories recorded by the person who witnessed the event. Thus, it is genuine history, not a conglomeration of oral traditions written down at a later point in time.
 
Originally posted by Live4Him
The authorship of the first book of the Bible is Genesis. While the author of this book is not known, there are two competing theories.

JEDP

Liberal religious theologians in the 1800's, advocating the gradual development of religion, proposed that the Bible developed gradually. One of the ideas that resulted from this thinking gained popularity with many. The foundation for this belief is that Genesis could not have been written by eyewitnesses of the events. Rather, the stories in Genesis are a compilation of oral traditions passed down from many different sources.

Thus, the early books of the Bible were believed to have been written by unknown authors during the Divided Kingdom (approx 800 - 582 BC). The books, including Genesis, were believed to have been compiled from several sources, each which could be distinguished by the name used for God. The J-Document used the name Jehovah, the E-Document used Elohim, while the D and P documents were named for Deuteronomic and Priestly, respectively.

Thus, they alleged that the Bible did not originate from eye-witnessed events.


TABLET THEORY

Even during a casual reading of the book of Genesis, one will notice that the book is divided into sections, each separated by similar phrases. The passages below are the division points of Genesis.

1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2:4 This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were created.
5:1 This is the written account of Adam’s line.
6:9 This is the account of Noah.
10:1 This is the account of Shem, Ham and Japheth, Noah’s sons,
11:10 This is the account of Shem.
11:27 This is the account of Terah.
25:12 This is the account of Abraham’s son Ishmael,
25:19 This is the account of Abraham’s son Isaac.
36:1 This is the account of Esau (that is, Edom).
36:9 This is the account of Esau
37:2 This is the account of Jacob.
50:26 So Joseph died

Note that 5:1 specifically mentions it is a written account, rather than oral tradition. Also note, that there are TWO accounts of Esau. This would not occur if it were an oral tradition because the stories would be merged into one. But, it WOULD occur if an author was copying or translating the account from a tablet onto a scroll.

Thus the phrase "this is the account" connects the various sections together.

And, this agrees with other Biblical passages that Moses passed the information down, but it came from his ancestors.

John 7:22 Yet, because Moses gave you circumcision (though actually it did not come from Moses, but from the patriarchs), you circumcise a child on the Sabbath.

COULD ADAM WRITE?

Next, lets address the issue of whether Adam could have left a written record. Lets see if Adam could have left a written record before he died.

1) Some Bible scholars have proposed a date of approximately 6000 years ago as the creation of the world, and thus Adam.

2) The earliest known writings are approximately 5500 - 5100 years old.
http://www.staff.ncl.ac.uk/hermann.moisl/ell365/oldest_writing.htm

3) According to scripture (Gen 5:5), Adam live 930 years.

Thus, if one accepts the 6000 years-ago date, and the Gen 5:5 passage, Adam could have left a written record of his life. Second, Adam would have been very proud of this ability, since it was new technology at the time. And, being proud of the use of new technology, he was very likely to mention it in his history. Later authors wouldn't be as likely to mention "old" technology in their respective histories, so it is not mentioned.

However, if these were compiled oral traditions, then one should expect to see the same verbiage in all of the connecting phrases (i.e. "this is the account of" -or- "this is the written account of"). But we see it ONLY in the person's life that first witnessed the new technology.

CONCLUSION

Genesis is a compiled book of histories recorded by the person who witnessed the event. Thus, it is genuine history, not a conglomeration of oral traditions written down at a later point in time.

How long do your arms have to be to reach that far....I'm just curious, because the leaps in logic are astounding. I mean, it's almost like reason takes brief hiatus's between sentences and comes back later to shake it's head.
 
Originally posted by Live4Him
1) Some Bible scholars have proposed a date of approximately 6000 years ago as the creation of the world, and thus Adam.

2) The earliest known writings are approximately 5500 - 5100 years old. http://www.staff.ncl.ac.uk/hermann.moisl/ell365/oldest_writing.htm

3) According to scripture (Gen 5:5), Adam live 930 years.

Thus, if one accepts the 6000 years-ago date, ...
Oh goodie. Our little YEC is enamoured by "5500 - 5100 years old writing". And where did this estimate come from? Let's see:
Clay tablets containing primitive words were uncovered in southern Egypt at the tomb of a king named Scorpion. They were carbon-dated to 3300-3200 BC.
That's right, folks. Here we have a YEC reliant on C14 dating.

So the question becomes: "What does our little YEC do with the many neolithic sites dated to before "the 6000 years-ago date"? Poor little YEC ...
 
Originally posted by Voodoo Child
Adam living 930 years? Er, hello?
Which means that he was there for all but the first millenium of the Ubaid period in Mesopotamia and died just after it gave way to the Summerians.
 
Originally posted by williamwbishop

How long do your arms have to be to reach that far....I'm just curious, because the leaps in logic are astounding. I mean, it's almost like reason takes brief hiatus's between sentences and comes back later to shake it's head.

Which means that you presented empirical evidence to expose the evidence that I presented, right?

What? Can you say that again? Did I hear that you didn't present ANY empirical evidence? I did?

Amazing! A philosopher who presents opinions without facts!
 
Someone just hack into his comp and format all the drives or something...please...it would give us peace.

Now that whatsup is gone, we have ANOTHER one...or is it whatsup back with a new IP?
 
Originally posted by Live4Him
Which means that you presented empirical evidence to expose the evidence that I presented, right?
You are either a despicable liar or a pathetic fool: you have, in fact, presented not one single item of evidence.
 
Let me see if I understand

Originally posted by ConsequentAtheist
That's right, folks. Here we have a YEC reliant on C14 dating.

You don't believe in C14 dating. Thus, you don't believe in Old Earth dates, right?

As for me, I believe in C14 dates that agree with empirical knowledge (i.e. written). There are a number of known C14 dating errors. Notably, C14 dates don't agree with tree ring dates, or with coral growth dates.

However, when a date agrees with outside agreeing dates, then I can accept it as empirical fact. This C14 date was determined to agree with the previously known civilizations' time period. Thus, it has been substantiated by empirical evidence.
 
Originally posted by

Adam living 930 years? Er, hello?

Lets see now, we have a written record from his time stating that he lived 930 years. And, we have your opinion that because no one from our current time ever lives. Yet, that opinion fits with the Biblical record as well.

Genesis 6:3 Then the LORD said, “My Spirit will not contend with man forever, for he is mortal; his days will be a hundred and twenty years.”

According to God, our days are limited to 120 years. Thus, the current empirical evidence should be 120 years or less. And you find it surprising?
 
Re: Let me see if I understand

Originally posted by Live4Him
You don't believe in C14 dating. Thus, you don't believe in Old Earth dates, right?

As for me, I believe in C14 dates that agree with empirical knowledge (i.e. written).
This is the blathering of a born-again fruitcake. What in hell are you talking about?

Tell me little yec, what is your date for Adam, the Flood, and the Exodus, and upon what extra-biblical source is it based?
 
As for me, I believe in C14 dates that agree with empirical knowledge (i.e. written). There are a number of known C14 dating errors. Notably, C14 dates don't agree with tree ring dates, or with coral growth dates.

Actually, overall, it concordes very well.

Lets see now, we have a written record from his time stating that he lived 930 years. And, we have your opinion that because no one from our current time ever lives. Yet, that opinion fits with the Biblical record as well. Genesis 6:3 Then the LORD said, “My Spirit will not contend with man forever, for he is mortal; his days will be a hundred and twenty years.” According to God, our days are limited to 120 years. Thus, the current empirical evidence should be 120 years or less. And you find it surprising?

< sarcasm force="10">Well, that explains it. It is not a biological impossibility because it says in the Buy-bull. < /sarcasm>

Noah and the gang live several hundred years, but today's people don't because God wiggled his nose and >poof< limited them to one-hundred and twenty. Don't talk about empirical evidence to me. You are making an extremely extraordinary claim: that there is God and God used his magic to make people live for a shorter time. <i>You</i> need fricken truckloads of empirical evidence, stat.
 
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