Does time exist?

arfa brane said:
I'm saying you can't claim a duration exists which is different from an interval of time. Both ideas about time amount to the idea that time can b measured.
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I didn't mention interval of time. A time interval of 1 second is a duration of time. Duration is measured with a clock. A clock doesn't create duration, it measures duration. Just like a ruler measures the length of a stick. The length of a stick is the thing being measured, and the ruler is the measuring device. You can't claim the stick's length is the same as the ruler that is measuring the stick. They are two different things, the thing being measured (stick) and the measuring device (the ruler.)

It's the same thing with duration (the stick) and the clock (the ruler). A clock is MEASURING duration. The clock is not duration like a ruler is not the length of the stick.


arfa brane said:
Does time exist if it isn't measured? How would you know?
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Does the stick have length is there is no ruler??
 
Notice how playing around with words makes absolutely no difference to the things the words might represent?

With time, you have clocks. Clocks don't input or output time.
 
Write4U said:
Duration is not a thing it is a "differential equation", a mathematical abstraction .
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Duration is not an equation! Duration has no numbers, no units, and no symbols.

The Earth making one complete lap around the Sun is a duration.
The Earth making 1.5 laps is a duration.
The Earth making 17 laps is a duration.
The Earth making 1,000,234,567 laps is a duration.

They are all a duration of time.

If the Earth were to cease to exist then it would be GONE for a duration that continuously increases proportional to it making 1 lap. You could actually measure a duration of its NON EXISTENCE in YEARS that it has ceased to exist.

No more Earth, but duration is still elapsing, which is the duration of NON EXISTENCE!
 
Write4U said:
Duration has a natural mathematical value.
Make up your mind. You are all over the place, mixing symbolic human values and intrinsic natural values.
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Clocks have numbers and units (10 seconds). Clocks measure duration and give duration numbers and units like rulers give a stick's length numbers and units.

Nature has no need for numbers and units. Humans need numbers and units! Nature has no such requirement!

There is length, duration, and objects. Rulers, clocks, and scales are the measuring devices for length, duration, and objects to give them numbers and units.
 
Ghost Appearance said:
The Earth making one complete lap around the Sun is a duration.
The Earth making 1.5 laps is a duration.
The Earth making 17 laps is a duration.
The Earth making 1,000,234,567 laps is a duration.

They are all a duration of time.
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No, they are functions of time.

And physically they are all numbers of orbits.

Interestingly: Infinity is the opposite of duration

What is the opposite of duration?

Antonyms: momentariness, instantaneousness, infinity, eternity.

Synonyms: period, continuance, term, space, protraction, prolongation.
 
Ghost Appearance said:
There is length, duration, and objects. Rulers, clocks, and scales are the measuring devices for length, duration, and objects to give them numbers and units.
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And so, the existence of the measuring devices gives humans a meaningful definition of time and distance, also of objects?
How do you know what nature needs or requires, or doesn't, though? How do you get from clocks and rulers to what nature needs or doesn't need?
 
Ghost Appearance said:
Clocks have numbers and units (10 seconds). Clocks measure duration and give duration numbers and units like rulers give a stick's length numbers and units.

Nature has no need for numbers and units. Humans need numbers and units! Nature has no such requirement!

There is length, duration, and objects. Rulers, clocks, and scales are the measuring devices for length, duration, and objects to give them numbers and units.
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As I said, you do not know the difference between human functional symbolic representations of natural relational values.
 
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Write4U said:
And physically they are all numbers of orbits.
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Numbers of orbits is not duration.

Consider a crankshaft. It can complete one complete revolution in 1 second or .1 seconds. It can have 1,000 revolutions per minute, or 10,000 revolutions per minute.

So what is a minute to you, because it certainly is not number of revolutions?
 
arfa brane said:
And so, the existence of the measuring devices gives humans a meaningful definition of time and distance, also of objects?
How do you know what nature needs or requires, or doesn't, though? How do you get from clocks and rulers to what nature needs or doesn't need?
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Because a stick has length, but no numbers or units. In order for a stick to have a length with numbers and units it needs to measured by a ruler, which is a mad made device using man made numbers and man made units.

You could just as easily measure the sticks length using rocks. No numbers or units required!

...or for that matter, a stick has no need to be measured. It just is what it is, it has no need to be measured!
 
Time exists because of matter being present in our universe. Without it, we lose a sense of time. This is a big thing to consider if our universe came from a fundamental origin of massless radiation.
 
MrOrlock said:
Time exists because of matter being present in our universe. Without it, we lose a sense of time. This is a big thing to consider if our universe came from a fundamental origin of massless radiation.
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I could possibly make massless radiation.
 
This is how a relativistic clock is measured, by a synchromatic pulse of radiation. Possibly our best examples are stable atomic clocks of mass with long half lives.
 
Moderator note: MrOrlock has been banned (sock puppet of a previously-banned user).

This thread is currently in the Physics subforum, but it looks on the verge of moving to Pseudoscience. Please stick to discussing actual science, not nonsensical ideas like "duration is not time". That stuff can be discussed in a junk thread outside the Science sections.
 
Write4U said:
Duration is not a thing it is a "differential equation", a mathematical abstraction .
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No. Don't pick terms at random, when you have no idea what they mean.

A differential equation is an equation relating some variable to its mathematical derivatives , e.g. the equation of motion for a harmonic oscillator:

d²x/dt² = = -(k/m).x.

d²x/dt² means the second derivative of x with respect to time, i.e. the rate of change of rate of change of the displacement of the oscillator (from its equilibrium position). It is not a duration but a rate of acceleration. The equation relates this to the value of the displacement, i.e. the displacement is related to the rate of change of rate of change of displacement.

Differential equations don't have to involve time at all, for example the time-independent version of Schrödinger's equation.

A duration is just a time interval. Nothing to do with equations of any kind, necessarily.
 
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exchemist said:
A duration is just a time interval. Nothing to do with equations of any kind, necessarily.
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Not necessarily. But sometimes?
Finite time differential equations

Abstract:
Continuous finite time differential equations are introduced as fast accurate controllers for dynamical systems. These have qualities superior to controllers which are currently in use in such applications as robotics. The structure of the phase portrait for scalar second order finite time systems is determined. This characterization is used to develop a class of second order finite time systems which can be used as controllers.
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https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/4048613/metrics#metrics
 
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