brain better suited in the torso?

dazzlepecs

Registered Senior Member
just silly but wondered if its better suited there, with sense organs around neck area

lower centre of gravity, better protected... Neck wouldnt be so vulnerable



as for eyes/ears etc being a foot or two away... Would this effect processing/reaction time?? For instance balance (even though that could be in the chest too)..
 
No way, it isn't a silly question at all!

It seems like your asking is - "isn't the brain so important that it should be protected in the torso? Wouldn't this protection be a selective advantage?" This question poses the problem of which is more selectively advantageous- protecting the brain or quickly processing sensory information. The answer is the later, as you say, it does take time to transfer signals to the brain. It is extremely benificial to have your central processing center (brain) close to your sensory organs as this reduces the time it takes to receive and process information. Perhaps the sensory organs could be placed about the torso, thus solving this problem... however, this would offset the benefits of having the sensory organs high on the body where they can gather the most information (see over tall grass etc...)

But this is all moot. Evolution doesn't really -create- perfect systems, it jury rigs workable solutions out of what's present already. Remember, natural selection evolves the simplest solution in the shortest number of generations possible.

ETA: I also wanted to say that even a possible trait may be extremely advantageous, it has to be present in the population to be selected on- the trait must be genetic, the mutation must exist in the population. Also, the mutation causing the advantageous trait must not be coupled with other very negative traits. By the time we reach complex organisms like mice and humans, the body plan is involved in so many other functions that global alterations in its structure are generally deleterious. Thus such a mutation would likely never arise in a mammalian population to be selected for in the first place.
 
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just silly but wondered if its better suited there, with sense organs around neck area


You need to think about how we develop as an embryo. We start off as a (roughly) spherical ball of cells. Then the embryo undergoes a process known as ‘convergence and extension’. This is the process that turns a ball of cells into a rod of cells (ie. a bilaterally symmetrical embryo). Cells ‘converge’ towards the midline and intercalate with each other which ‘extends’ the embryo in two directions, thus creating an anterior-posterior axis. One end becomes the ‘head’ end and the other becomes the ‘tail’ end.

The brain of a bilaterally symmetrical vertebrate develops as a result of complex tissue folding and movement of cells that require these cells to be at the end of a ‘rod’ in order for these processes to occur in the first place. The brain is what it is precisely because it formed at the end of a rod-shaped embryo. Your question is interesting but I would say that it’s not valid because you’re asking why something exists in a particular position when the reason it exists in the first place is because it developed in that position.

Does that make any sense? That is as simple as I can describe it without resorting to more complex developmental concepts like neuroectodermal layers, neural plates etc.
 
but is there enough room for the braine i mean like wouldent that just sqeeze to much in the chest ??
 
just silly but wondered if its better suited there, with sense organs around neck area

lower centre of gravity, better protected... Neck wouldnt be so vulnerable



as for eyes/ears etc being a foot or two away... Would this effect processing/reaction time?? For instance balance (even though that could be in the chest too)..

Why not make one and find out?
 
No way, it isn't a silly question at all!

It seems like your asking is - "isn't the brain so important that it should be protected in the torso? Wouldn't this protection be a selective advantage?" This question poses the problem of which is more selectively advantageous- protecting the brain or quickly processing sensory information. The answer is the later, as you say, it does take time to transfer signals to the brain. It is extremely benificial to have your central processing center (brain) close to your sensory organs as this reduces the time it takes to receive and process information. Perhaps the sensory organs could be placed about the torso, thus solving this problem... however, this would offset the benefits of having the sensory organs high on the body where they can gather the most information (see over tall grass etc...)

But this is all moot. Evolution doesn't really -create- perfect systems, it jury rigs workable solutions out of what's present already. Remember, natural selection evolves the simplest solution in the shortest number of generations possible.

ETA: I also wanted to say that even a possible trait may be extremely advantageous, it has to be present in the population to be selected on- the trait must be genetic, the mutation must exist in the population. Also, the mutation causing the advantageous trait must not be coupled with other very negative traits. By the time we reach complex organisms like mice and humans, the body plan is involved in so many other functions that global alterations in its structure are generally deleterious. Thus such a mutation would likely never arise in a mammalian population to be selected for in the first place.


pro lol... thanks
 
You need to think about how we develop as an embryo. We start off as a (roughly) spherical ball of cells. Then the embryo undergoes a process known as ‘convergence and extension’. This is the process that turns a ball of cells into a rod of cells (ie. a bilaterally symmetrical embryo). Cells ‘converge’ towards the midline and intercalate with each other which ‘extends’ the embryo in two directions, thus creating an anterior-posterior axis. One end becomes the ‘head’ end and the other becomes the ‘tail’ end.

The brain of a bilaterally symmetrical vertebrate develops as a result of complex tissue folding and movement of cells that require these cells to be at the end of a ‘rod’ in order for these processes to occur in the first place. The brain is what it is precisely because it formed at the end of a rod-shaped embryo. Your question is interesting but I would say that it’s not valid because you’re asking why something exists in a particular position when the reason it exists in the first place is because it developed in that position.

Does that make any sense? That is as simple as I can describe it without resorting to more complex developmental concepts like neuroectodermal layers, neural plates etc.

im not really asking why, rather just what if :p

i dont 100% understand but that means i have something to read up on eh
 
pro lol... thanks

No prob! My students used to ask questions very similar all the time when I was a supplemental instructor for biology 101. Actually, "why don't we photosynthesize" was a question I asked during my first review sesion when I took bio101 :D Its a fun line of thinking anyway :p
 
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