Big freakin' scorpion

Tiassa

Let us not launch the boat ...
Valued Senior Member
Source: Science Daily
Link: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/11/071120195710.htm
Title: "Giant Fossil Sea Scorpion Bigger Than Man"
Date: Novermber 20, 2007


Positively Cthulhian: Giant sea scorpion.

The discovery of a giant fossilised claw from an ancient sea scorpion indicates that when alive it would have been about two and a half meters long, much taller than the average man ....

.... Some geologists believe that giant arthropods evolved due to higher levels of oxygen in the atmosphere in the past. Others, that they evolved in an 'arms race' alongside their likely prey, the early armoured fish.

'There is no simple single explanation', explains Braddy. 'It is more likely that some ancient arthropods were big because there was little competition from the vertebrates, as we see today. If the amount of oxygen in the atmosphere suddenly increased, it doesn't mean all the bugs would get bigger.'


(Science Daily)

I'm not sure, though, that the previous estimates of a two-meter scorpion make me feel any better. Just remember this the next time you're our for lobster.

 
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I wonder if they would have tasted as good as lobster. Get some butter sauce and now we're talkin!
 
Tiassa,

Do you know what makes it a type of scorpion rather than a type of crustacean? Or is it actually a type of crustacean that is labelled a scorpion just because it looks like one?
 
Mikenostic said:
Do you know what makes it a type of scorpion rather than a type of crustacean? Or is it actually a type of crustacean that is labelled a scorpion just because it looks like one?

To be honest, I never thought manatees looked like cows, but hey.

The best answer I can give comes from Wikipedia. The sea scorpions aren't actually scorpions. They are class Eurypterida, of the subphylum Chelicerata, so they are taxonomic neighbors to genunine scorpions (class Arachnida). Subphylum Chelicerata includes horseshoe crabs, and a page I found regarding Eurypterus remipes in New York state reminds that, "The broad head and spiked tail of Eurypterus remipes show a closer similarity to fossil and modern horseshoe crabs, such as Mesolimulus."

Short answer, then, is that it's somehow obviously structural.


Left: E. remipes fossil, Herkimer Co., NY
Right: M. walchi fossil, Eichstatt, Bavaria, Germany.
(click images for more information)

And no, I don't see it, especially since M. walchi is about two hundred million years younger than E. remipes. I'm looking at these fossils wrongly; I would have guessed, without having the information at hand to inform me otherwise, that M. walchi was the elder species.

Someone far better-versed in paleontology than I would be able to explain the relevant points.

Okay ... links:

Wikipedia: Eurypterid — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurypterid
Wikipedia: Chelicerata — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chelicerata
Wikipedia: Scorpion — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scorpion
Paleontological Research Institution: Eurypterus remipes — http://www.priweb.org/collections/arth/chel/remipest.html
Paleontological Rsearch Institution: Mesolimulus walchi — http://www.priweb.org/collections/arth/chel/mesolim.html
 
that would not be fun running into that. those claws would snap off your head.

those giant insect movies were real.
 
that would not be fun running into that. those claws would snap off your head.

those giant insect movies were real.
Unless you were in a scuba suit or a submarine underwater, you wouldn't run into it.

And yes, way back in the dinosaur days and before, Earth had a much higher oxygen content and insects were much bigger back then.
 
Giant sea scorpion
I'm disappointed that they referred to all arthropods as "bugs." That's the reason biologists don't even use the term any more. Properly, bugs are an order of insects with a specialized feeding apparatus that has evolved into a proboscis.
I'm not sure, though, that the previous estimates of a two-meter scorpion make me feel any better. Just remember this the next time you're our for lobster.
Lobsters and all crustaceans are just the aquatic cousins of insects, spiders and the other land-dwelling arthropods.
Do you know what makes it a type of scorpion rather than a type of crustacean? Or is it actually a type of crustacean that is labelled a scorpion just because it looks like one?
Colloquial names for flora and fauna are sometimes infuriatingly unscientific. The North American "buffalo" is a bison, the "sea cow" is a pinniped, the "zebra wolf" is a marsupial, the "prairie dog" is a rodent, the "killer whale" and (arguably) the "sperm whale" are giant dolphins, and the "sea anemone" is an animal, not a plant.

Crustaceans are the order of arthropods that remained in the water when the others evolved into air breathers. Any arthropod that breathes under water is a crustacean. That taxonomy is getting a little blurry though, I've seen references to animals being reclassified as land-dwelling crustaceans. In general any type of animal has the potential to evolve into larger species more easily in an aquatic environment because of the different way the force of gravity deploys. On land, your entire weight is born by the tiny parts of you that are in contact with the ground. In the water, your entire lower surface bears the weight. That's why whales are so much larger than the primitive hippopotamuses they descended from.
And yes, way back in the dinosaur days and before, Earth had a much higher oxygen content and insects were much bigger back then.
Plants were the first large organisms, and they steadily converted the bounty of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere into oxygen. (Even if this was an arduous process of the carbon dioxide dissolving in the ocean, aquatic plants "inhaling" it and "exhaling" dissolved oxygen, and the oxygen effervescing back into the atmosphere.) This process was only reversed when a fire broke out, and that couldn't even happen until the first land plants took root in a dry habitat, providing fuel for the fire. The first animals had to be suitable for a very oxygen-rich environment.
 
And no, I don't see it, especially since M. walchi is about two hundred million years younger than E. remipes. I'm looking at these fossils wrongly; I would have guessed, without having the information at hand to inform me otherwise, that M. walchi was the elder species.
The age of the fossil and the "age" of the organism are not all that well correlated, in general.

Big advanced sea scorpions came and went, big advanced fish came and (mostly) went, big advanced aqautic dinos came and went, big advanced aquatic mammals came - - -

the horseshoe crab just kept tooling along - - - -
 
I expect GeoffP will be along in a bit to say that it was probably no larger than about 2cm. And that the drawing is wrong.
 
fossil of huge scorpion

LONDON -- This was a bug you couldn't swat and definitely couldn't step on.

British scientists have stumbled across a fossilized claw, part of an ancient sea scorpion, that is of such large proportion it would make the entire creature the biggest bug ever.

How big? Bigger than you, and at 8 feet long as big as some Smart cars.

The discovery in 390-million-year-old rocks suggests that spiders, insects, crabs and similar creatures were far larger in the past than previously thought, said Simon Braddy, a University of Bristol paleontologist and one of the study's three authors.

"This is an amazing discovery," he said Tuesday.

"We have known for some time that the fossil record yields monster millipedes, super-sized scorpions, colossal cockroaches, and jumbo dragonflies. But we never realized until now just how big some of these ancient creepy-crawlies were," he said.

The research found a type of sea scorpion that was almost half a yard longer than previous estimates and the largest one ever to have evolved.

The study, published online Tuesday in the Royal Society's journal Biology Letters, means that before this sea scorpion became extinct it was much longer than today's average man is tall.

Prof. Jeorg W. Schneider, a paleontologist at Freiberg Mining Academy in southeastern Germany, said the study provides valuable new information about "the last of the giant scorpions."

Schneider, who was not involved in the study, said these scorpions "were dominant for millions of years because they didn't have natural enemies. Eventually they were wiped out by large fish with jaws and teeth."

Braddy's partner paleontologist Markus Poschmann found the claw fossil several years ago in a quarry near Prum, Germany, that probably had once been an ancient estuary or swamp.

"I was loosening pieces of rock with a hammer and chisel when I suddenly realized there was a dark patch of organic matter on a freshly removed slab. After some cleaning I could identify this as a small part of a large claw," said Poschmann, another author of the study.

"Although I did not know if it was more complete or not, I decided to try and get it out. The pieces had to be cleaned separately, dried, and then glued back together. It was then put into a white plaster jacket to stabilize it," he said.

Eurypterids, or ancient sea scorpions, are believed to be the extinct aquatic ancestors of today's scorpions and possibly all arachnids, a class of joint-legged, invertebrate animals, including spiders, scorpions, mites and ticks.

Braddy said the fossil was from a Jaekelopterus Rhenaniae, a kind of scorpion that lived only in Germany for about 10 million years, about 400 million years ago.

He said some geologists believe that gigantic sea scorpions evolved due to higher levels of oxygen in the atmosphere in the past. Others suspect they evolved in an "arms race" alongside their likely prey, fish that had armor on their outer bodies.

Braddy said the sea scorpions also were cannibals that fought and ate one other, so it helped to be as big as they could be.

"The competition between this scorpion and its prey was probably like a nuclear standoff, an effort to have the biggest weapon," he said. "Hundreds of millions of years ago, these sea scorpions had the upper hand over vertebrates - backboned animals like ourselves."

That competition ended long ago.

But the next time you swat a fly, or squish a spider at home, Braddy said, try to "think about the insects that lived long ago. You wouldn't want to swat one of those."

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/1103ap_biggest_bug_ever.html
 
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