Attention sciforums muslims:slavery in islam

P

path

Militant wiseguy
Registered Senior Member
I seriously doubt our respected muslim forumites (Knife, surrenderer, Bruce Wayne, and Sufi) are for slavery but I came across this at an islamic forum and find it disconcerting. This is a thread where muslims are discussing the permissability of slavery :eek: with the majority agreeing that it is permissable(there is a minority arguing against it) There have been discussions here about "islamophobia" and I feel this is exactly the type of thing non-muslims hear about islam that causes it, with good reason. What are your thoughts on slavery and if you disagree with it (which I assume you do) what can be done to spread the word to your fellow muslims?

islamic forums

Salaam
Patrick
 
Ok so noone is going to take issue with this? I registered just to let them know what I think but as an infidel I will no doubt be mobbed off the board. :p
 
Sorry, I don't know even about Islam to make any comment. All I know is Christian bible support slavery as well.
 
path said:
I seriously doubt our respected muslim forumites (Knife, surrenderer, Bruce Wayne, and Sufi) are for slavery but I came across this at an islamic forum and find it disconcerting. This is a thread where muslims are discussing the permissability of slavery :eek: with the majority agreeing that it is permissable(there is a minority arguing against it) There have been discussions here about "islamophobia" and I feel this is exactly the type of thing non-muslims hear about islam that causes it, with good reason. What are your thoughts on slavery and if you disagree with it (which I assume you do) what can be done to spread the word to your fellow muslims?

islamic forums

Salaam
Patrick
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Sup Path,
One thing that should be noted is that the first call to prayer at the Quba mosque built by Prophet Muhammad (saws) was given in 622 by Bilal - a black slave freed by the Prophet.In Islam only non-muslim prisoners of war(muslims cant/arent suppose to enslave other muslims)or their offspring can become slaves.Additionally, slaves had the ability to enfranchise themselves at their own initiative, without waiting passively for the goodwill of their masters: the procedure known as mukataba allowed them to buy their own freedom with sums which they saved from their work, and which the state frequently augmented with advances -- a measure which the slaveowner had no right to oppose. There are many other hadiths which define Islam's true attitude in this regard. The Prophet said: 'Your slaves are your brethren; therefore whoever has a brother who depends upon him must feed and clothe him in the way he feeds and clothes himself; and should not impose upon him tasks which exceed his capacity; should you ask them to do such things, then you are obliged to help them.' The Sharia takes this injunction, among many others, into account when defining the responsibilities and duties of slaveholders.Also Islamic legislation subjected slaveowners to a set of precise obligations, first among which was the slave's right to life, for, according to a hadith, 'Whoever kills his slave shall be killed by us'. In consequence, the murder of a slave was punished like that of a free man. Slavery in Islam in the past had been tolerated but never encouraged and had been (or was suppose to be anyway :) ) like a butler or maid would be treated nowadays. Hope that answers you....peace to you
 
path said:
My main point (even though I know it often comes across as bashing islam) is that religious dogma of any kind is a very slippery slope that tends to separate the infidels from the chosen people.
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It seems that you have expanded your area of operations to other things in Islam.
 
Holy Shit! What a bunch of psychos!

I can hardly wait for those guys to either kill me in the imminent battle or, if I'm lucky, enslave me and allow me to enjoy the privileges of "good ol' islamic slavery".
 
surenderer said:
Sup Path,
One thing that should be noted is that the first call to prayer at the Quba mosque built by Prophet Muhammad (saws) was given in 622 by Bilal - a black slave freed by the Prophet.In Islam only non-muslim prisoners of war(muslims cant/arent suppose to enslave other muslims)or their offspring can become slaves.Additionally, slaves had the ability to enfranchise themselves at their own initiative, without waiting passively for the goodwill of their masters: the procedure known as mukataba allowed them to buy their own freedom with sums which they saved from their work, and which the state frequently augmented with advances -- a measure which the slaveowner had no right to oppose. There are many other hadiths which define Islam's true attitude in this regard. The Prophet said: 'Your slaves are your brethren; therefore whoever has a brother who depends upon him must feed and clothe him in the way he feeds and clothes himself; and should not impose upon him tasks which exceed his capacity; should you ask them to do such things, then you are obliged to help them.' The Sharia takes this injunction, among many others, into account when defining the responsibilities and duties of slaveholders.Also Islamic legislation subjected slaveowners to a set of precise obligations, first among which was the slave's right to life, for, according to a hadith, 'Whoever kills his slave shall be killed by us'. In consequence, the murder of a slave was punished like that of a free man. Slavery in Islam in the past had been tolerated but never encouraged and had been (or was suppose to be anyway :) ) like a butler or maid would be treated nowadays. Hope that answers you....peace to you
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So it is still ok then under islam?
 
Bruce Wayne said:
It seems that you have expanded your area of operations to other things in Islam.
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Bruce I am sorry but when I see something like this I can't just ignore it maybe you can but I can't. :(
 
path said:
So it is still ok then under islam?
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Path,
Remember this was the treatment for POW's in the Prophet's(saws) day when people would kill anyone from another tribe/army. The Koran also states that in Hadith:



The Noble Qur'ân Al-Baqarah 2:177

It is not Al-Birr (piety, righteousness, and each and every act of obedience to Allâh, etc.) that you turn your faces towards east and (or) west (in prayers); but Al-Birr is (the quality of) the one who believes in Allâh, the Last Day, the Angels, the Book, the Prophets and gives his wealth, in spite of love for it, to the kinsfolk, to the orphans, and to Al-Masâkin (the poor), and to the wayfarer, and to those who ask, AND TO SET SLAVES FREE, performs As-Salât (Iqâmat-as-Salât), and gives the Zakât, and who fulfill their covenant when they make it, and who are As-Sâbirin (the patient ones, etc.) in extreme poverty and ailment (disease) and at the time of fighting (during the battles). Such are the people of the truth and they are Al*Muttaqûn (pious).


again slavery in Islam is something with a historical aspect that some people dont know and they abuse it....peace
 
Perhaps you should worry about abolishing slavery in America & Canada before criticising other countries?
 
Slavery?

How about human trafficking in Israeli brothels? How about the U.S.? The fruit picker slaves right behind a retirement home and golf course in Lake Placid? How extremely saintly. How hypocritical. People are getting sold into slavery and forced into prostitution. It does not matter that slavery is already illegal worldwide. It still happens.

To assume that this is unique to Islamic countries is both hypocritical and idiotic.

It's not like Muslim countries are the only places that deal in 21st century slavery. Wake the fuck up.
 
Zero said:
Slavery?

How about human trafficking in Israeli brothels? How about the U.S.? The fruit picker slaves right behind a retirement home and golf course in Lake Placid? How extremely saintly. How hypocritical. People are getting sold into slavery and forced into prostitution. It does not matter that slavery is already illegal worldwide. It still happens.

To assume that this is unique to Islamic countries is both hypocritical and idiotic.

It's not like Muslim countries are the only places that deal in 21st century slavery. Wake the fuck up.
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Oh come on.......it is all muslims fault rest of the world is one happy flower pot. This the the impression given to all over the usa and other evangalist churches.....never look at ur self always blames the other. Best policy ever. :D
 
First, Slavery is just one way that the Wealthy have of exploiting the labor of the poor, and it is by far not the worst way. The Slave is at least reassured that he or she has 'value'.

Exploitation by Wage guarantees no value to the person but only the 'time' of the laborer. The Slave will be fed whether or not there is work to do, and whether or not he or she is healthy. A sick Slave will be nursed in order to protect his or her value. But a wage worker will be forgotten.

Compare the United States South from its Slavery Period to when it exploited its Negroes through share-cropping. The anecdotal evidence is that the work conditions were harder for the non-slave. But yes, the Share Croppers were able to emeliorate their conditions by 'voting with their feet'. They moved to the Cities where roughly 50% were employed and the other 50% lived off the other half or from the proceeds of crime -- theft, gambling, prostitution.

So, no, unless you advocate the abolition of all forms of Labor Exploitation, it just seems narrow and argumentative to single out Slavery. It think Future Civilization will look back at all these forms of exploitation and see not an iota of difference them. Think about it. Unless you show up for work, you starve. That makes you a slave, doesn't it? And all this while the leisured rich are making money off of their capital investments -- their slaves, which happen to be you and me who have to still pick cotton while they sit on their immemorial porch drinking their immemorial mint julops... and whistle "Dixie".
 
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