I am a recovering Catholic (raised Catholic, abused by nuns), have considered myself agnostic for a number of years, and just started reading a book about Bhuddism. It's very interesting so far. Are there any Buddhists in this forum? Do Bhuddist's have any type of ritual they practice? ie- like Catholic's going to church, giving up something for lent, etc... Just curious, I haven't been out of my "agnostic" state in awhile.
Any Bhuddists out there?
- Thread starter analbeads
- Start date
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WildBlueYonder
Guest
you might have better luck using "Buddhist"analbeads said:
also, you may scare off people with your user name; so many 'tender' Buddhist may steer clear of answering you
former Catholic, abused by nuns? I take it you mean more than a whack on the wrists with a ruler, (because I talked too much, also, why I didn't learn enough doctrine to stay in the RCC). I left to look at the original, (Reformed Jewish from age 17 to approx 28, in USAF my dogtags said "Jewish"), with a little agnostics, atheism for awhile, then left Judaism for good after I couldn't reconcile the phrase, "Let us make man in our image" found in the Jewish Torah, it smacked of Christianity & the that 'we' was used in the royal sense, like Queen E, might say, "we are not amused" just didn't wash for me.
left science as the only explanation after I couldn't reconcile the Big Bang or our (human) development into modern man with "cause & effect"
so I went looking;
read several books by Alan Watts, visited Baptists, Nazarene, Methodists, RCC, JW, Apostolic, and the Church Universal & Triumphant; had friends explain Black islam, islam, mormonism, etc..
chose Christianity
try looking in "Eastern religion" forum
There are unlikely to be any true practicers of Buddhism on a forum such as this, because one of the precepts of practicing buddhism is The non attachment to worldly desires, and actions without attachment to the results.
Entering into a forum debate requires some attachment to the results of what you type, and some desire (which is the purpose you entered the debate in the first place).
Obviously non attachment is only a part of buddhism. I would reccommend that you look into it deeper and see what you get out of it, although it is a fairly strict discipline if one itends to apply it fully in their lives. I think most people get something useful to apply to their lives from its teachings.
You may also want to check out Hinduism, which contains far more depth and insight than many people realise. The upanishads and the Bhagavad Gita are great reading for a start.
Entering into a forum debate requires some attachment to the results of what you type, and some desire (which is the purpose you entered the debate in the first place).
Obviously non attachment is only a part of buddhism. I would reccommend that you look into it deeper and see what you get out of it, although it is a fairly strict discipline if one itends to apply it fully in their lives. I think most people get something useful to apply to their lives from its teachings.
You may also want to check out Hinduism, which contains far more depth and insight than many people realise. The upanishads and the Bhagavad Gita are great reading for a start.
I'm a fan of the source of Buddhism, and I happen to know a little about it, although I don't practice in any formal way. There are quite a few rituals associated with it, like meditation, and taking the precepts vow. I can answer questions without being particularly attached to them, or the results.
Any questions?
Any questions?
Of course one can answer questions without being attached, it may even be that one can engage in debate without being attached - to winning or to people understanding ones views or agreeing with them. One may be able to write post without any attachment to anyone even reading them. All this is possible for buddhist and non buddhist alike. Although the person who can do this is very advanced indeed !
Also a buddhist certainly does not have to be perfect to be a buddhist. One may be a buddhist trying to free themselves from attachment but as yet not succeding. Which is of course the whole point of following any spiritual path - not be perfect but to be perfected. IMO anyway.
But my point was this. An environment such as this forum is one where feelings of attachment are likely to arise easily. a person on the buddhist path (I would have thought) would try to avoid such situations. Devoting time to quieting mind and ego and freeing themselves from worldly attachments rather than engaging in heated worldy debate, as is found on this particular forum. Simply answering questions though - of course presents no problem.
Also a buddhist certainly does not have to be perfect to be a buddhist. One may be a buddhist trying to free themselves from attachment but as yet not succeding. Which is of course the whole point of following any spiritual path - not be perfect but to be perfected. IMO anyway.
But my point was this. An environment such as this forum is one where feelings of attachment are likely to arise easily. a person on the buddhist path (I would have thought) would try to avoid such situations. Devoting time to quieting mind and ego and freeing themselves from worldly attachments rather than engaging in heated worldy debate, as is found on this particular forum. Simply answering questions though - of course presents no problem.
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One should have no problem engaging in a lively debate, Buddhism is like riding the stream without getting caught up in it. Zen Buddhist history is full of figures that use unconventional methods to derail the student, including hitting them with a stick. Forget everything you think you know about zen and the peaceful monastic stereotypes of Buddhists rejecting the world. If they reject the world, it's only a temporary method. All the precepts are also tentative and experimental in nature, not dogmatic.
Check out Ikkyu, 15th century Japanese zennist:
even before trees rocks I was nothing
when I'm dead nowhere I'll be nothing
this ink painting of wind blowing through pines
who hears it?
sin like a madman until you can't do anything else
no room for any more
fuck flattery success money
all I do is lie back and suck my thumb
one long pure beautiful road of pain
and the beauty of death and no pain
mirror facing mirror
nowhere else
passion's red thread is infinite
like the earth always under me
a woman is enlightenment when you're with her and the red thread
of both your passions flare inside you and you see
your name Mori means forest like the infinite fresh
green distances of your blindness
my monk friend has a wierd endearing habit
he weaves sandals and leaves them secretly by the roadside
no words sitting alone night in my hut eyes closed hands open
wisps of an unknown face
we're lost where the mind can't find us
utterly lost
Check out Ikkyu, 15th century Japanese zennist:
even before trees rocks I was nothing
when I'm dead nowhere I'll be nothing
this ink painting of wind blowing through pines
who hears it?
sin like a madman until you can't do anything else
no room for any more
fuck flattery success money
all I do is lie back and suck my thumb
one long pure beautiful road of pain
and the beauty of death and no pain
mirror facing mirror
nowhere else
passion's red thread is infinite
like the earth always under me
a woman is enlightenment when you're with her and the red thread
of both your passions flare inside you and you see
your name Mori means forest like the infinite fresh
green distances of your blindness
my monk friend has a wierd endearing habit
he weaves sandals and leaves them secretly by the roadside
no words sitting alone night in my hut eyes closed hands open
wisps of an unknown face
we're lost where the mind can't find us
utterly lost
Light Travelling said:
I don't think so, and I find it strange to see an argument as above, except if one were here with the intention to argue.
Say your friend broke his leg and would be in the hospital for weeks. Is it an expression of attachment if you go and visit him all the time while he is in the hospital? I think it would be cruel to act with people as if one had just met them, and do as if all interaction is form scratch each time, as if there were no previous relationship.
Thus, remaining with someone or somewhere isn't necessarily attachment, it can rightly be skillful action.
The thing is more that answering questions may be very demanding, needing a lot of knowledge both on the part of the answerer as well as the asker, and that the asker might not like the answers, as the answers might be too challenging for him.
For example, if you try to explain anger, anxiety, non-violence, forgiveness, or loving-kindness from a Buddhist perspective to a person who holds a strict personality view -- then it will come across as if one must deprecate and renounce oneself for the sake of the other, because one isn't worth much anyway. Now this is a terrible perspective!
This is one of the reasons why Buddhism is branded as nihilistic: because someone (who is keeping the personality view) has to become a nihilist in order to (try to) practice according to Buddhist principles. But this is not how it is meant to be, I don't think so.
Siddartha reached pure non-attachment, but out of compassion (of itself a form of attachment) he chose to remain to guide others. He was the first of those called "stream-enterers" - people who glimpse something called nirvana from time to time but choose to return to the world of attachments.
Some sects within Buddhism have more ritual than others, and some Buddhists feel the need for more ritual than other. I have a Buddha statue to remind me of how he started the wheel in motion and a string of prayer flags because I think they look cool. That's about it. I am really immersing in a mix of Buddhism and Taoism with as few trappings and dogma as I can get away with. In my more sublime moments, I know I need nothing.
Some sects within Buddhism have more ritual than others, and some Buddhists feel the need for more ritual than other. I have a Buddha statue to remind me of how he started the wheel in motion and a string of prayer flags because I think they look cool. That's about it. I am really immersing in a mix of Buddhism and Taoism with as few trappings and dogma as I can get away with. In my more sublime moments, I know I need nothing.
spidergoat said:
But one does not jump into the stream without learning how to swim first. An experienced spiritual practitioner can do this, but does this mean the introduction to Buddhism should be “just jump in the stream and have fun, that’s what Buddhism is all about”?
spidergoat said:
I don’t think, forget everything you know is fair. Firstly there are many zen monasteries, yes they may have strange teaching methods, but life is still essentially monastic. Secondly, Buddhism is larger than zen, in other Buddhist schools of thought the monastic life is more important. In Theravada for instance, nirvana is only thought attainable by monks.
Although yes Buddhism has many paths and some are more freeform than others
spidergoat said:
Yes it is a temporary method, but it still remains a Buddhist method.
One of the basic precepts of Buddhism is to take refuge in the Buddha, dharma and sangha. Which essentially means accepting Buddhist philosophy above all others. (and preferably living in a spritual community). I know many say there is no Buddhist doctrine and Buddha said we must find our own truths (which I agree with). But there is a difference between what Buddha said and what Buddhists do in practice (as with most other religions). I mean what is the Pali Canon if not doctrine. Buddha may have intended that there be no doctrine, but later Buddhists have indeed made one (or many – depending on which Buddhist path you choose). Zen of course is probably least doctrinalised.
te jen said:
I have a statue of Buddha too, I also recite mantra and meditate. But I am not a Buddhist. I try and keep my mind as unattached and equal as possible, but the inspiration for this comes more from the bhagavad gita and Vedanta than from Buddhism. Karma yoga as it is described. Actions without attachments to the results. So although I have taken much inspiration from Buddhism and continue to read and learn about it (I know only a small part still). I, like you , mix it with other philosophies and religions.
The thread starter asks “are there any Buddhists out there”. I say unlikely on this forum. Others argue that it is likely. Well - they argue that there’s nothing to prevent Buddhists being here anyway (which I agree with).
But so far we have not had one person come forward and say yes I am a Buddhist , my whole life is based in Buddhism! So it is looking like no there aren’t any Buddhists out there.
What there are is a lot of people who have been touched by the ideas of Buddha and try to apply some of them to their lives and philosophies. Does or should this make them Buddhists though?................
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Trilairian
Registered Senior Member
It has nothing to do with Christianity. The Caananite ancestors of the Jews were polytheists.WildBlueYonder said:
In standard Christian doctrine the trinity represents three manifestations of God:
1 The creative power is refered to as the father.
2 The spiritual aspect of God is refered to as the holy spirit.
3 The human manifestation is Jesus.
This dissagrees with the Genesis quote because according to this doctrine God was made into the image of man through Jesus, not the other way around.
water said:
We all know how addictive the forums can be. - this comes from desireous attachments.
water said:
One would go and see him through compassion for him - not through attachment to him.
water said:
You have this the wrong way round, you treat strangers as friends , not friends as strangers. Yes buddhism teaches non attachments, but also love, compassion, and cultivation of warmth and friendliness to all beings.
water said:
I agree, skilfully we can carry out worldly actions compassionately for other people whilst keeping our minds free from desire and attachments. Easy to say very hard to do (in my experience anyway)
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WildBlueYonder
Guest
actually, if you think about it, forums are both of this world & notLight Travelling said:
you can connect with (theoritically millions) on the WWW, (the world)
while connecting with nothing (in cyberspace via a keyboard & monitor) very disembodied, disconnected
does anyone here exist, or are we a figment, etheral, mist
Light Travelling,
What's yours? Mine is mainly coolness.
I think there was a misunderstanding here.
I was commenting on your example of avoiding the forums because of attachment, and gave another, somewhat simpler example. It seemed to me that the way you explained attachment and how bad it is, that it implied that people ought to stay away from persons or things that one could become attached to.
My thinking was: If Buddhist stay away from these forums (because they could get attached), do Buddhist also stay away from other situations where attachment could arise, like having a friend in the hospital and not visiting him because attachment could arise?
I think that the danger of explaining non-attachment is that it often comes across explained as non-affection, treating people as if we had just met; like saying, "I'm going to visit my mother in the hospital only once (even though she is there for a month) because going more often would make attachment possible, and this I don't want, so I won't go more often".
And this I do not think what is meant by non-attachment in Buddhism; this is carelessness to say the least.
I don't think it is non-attachment per se that prevents Buddhists from posting here. They do talk a lot, post a lot -- just not at *this* forum.
Sciforums is a place to massively inflate your ego. It is rarely good company in Buddhist terms, it is rarely conducive to practicing right intentions and right speech, to say the least.
If you are a "pulsating pink blot of loving-kindness" here, no one will take you seriously, and you will be derided and ignored at best. And few lay Buddhists are so far along the path that they would be able to afford constant beatings.
What's yours? Mine is mainly coolness.
I think there was a misunderstanding here.
I was commenting on your example of avoiding the forums because of attachment, and gave another, somewhat simpler example. It seemed to me that the way you explained attachment and how bad it is, that it implied that people ought to stay away from persons or things that one could become attached to.
My thinking was: If Buddhist stay away from these forums (because they could get attached), do Buddhist also stay away from other situations where attachment could arise, like having a friend in the hospital and not visiting him because attachment could arise?
I think that the danger of explaining non-attachment is that it often comes across explained as non-affection, treating people as if we had just met; like saying, "I'm going to visit my mother in the hospital only once (even though she is there for a month) because going more often would make attachment possible, and this I don't want, so I won't go more often".
And this I do not think what is meant by non-attachment in Buddhism; this is carelessness to say the least.
I don't think it is non-attachment per se that prevents Buddhists from posting here. They do talk a lot, post a lot -- just not at *this* forum.
Sciforums is a place to massively inflate your ego. It is rarely good company in Buddhist terms, it is rarely conducive to practicing right intentions and right speech, to say the least.
If you are a "pulsating pink blot of loving-kindness" here, no one will take you seriously, and you will be derided and ignored at best. And few lay Buddhists are so far along the path that they would be able to afford constant beatings.
water said:
This, I think, was the point I originally intended to make.....
Itseemstome
Registered Senior Member
Why choose one religion at all. Just potter through life with the expectation that you will find out one day and that the answer will be completely different from what any of the religions have said. If survival of death is part of the Human process we will all find the same thing happening to us no matter what we have believed. I guess we may have gained a few 'Brownie Points' if we have been nice to everybody as we trundle along but even that may not be correct.