An Unlikely scenario - but just suppose .....

[lightgigantic]

This is a hypothetical question for atheists and agnostics, although I guess even a theist could contribute -

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists - meaning that they were to suddenly realise that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of their seeing and even one's own sense of self had directly emanated from god.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

The question of this thread is

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)

 

[Sarkus]

Doesn't the answer depend entirely in which "god" the new-found belief was held in?

 

[Nickelodeon]

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)

Agnostic.
It would be impossible to know until it happened.

 

[perplexity]

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

I see no reason to suppose that it would.

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?

I see no reason to suppose that it would.

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

I see no reason to suppose that it would.

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I see no reason to suppose that it would.

I see no need to worry if god exists or not, per se, that is god's problem, not mine.

As best I know, the problem is mine only to the extent somebody presumes to suggest, directly or indirectly, what it should mean with regard for instance to the considerations above, in which case, who are you and how would you know?

--- Ron.

 

[Satyr]

Agnostic.

Let us suppose I grew wings out of my ass and I could glide by farting against them….How would this affect my world-view and my eating habits?
More beans?

Religious minds love the hypothetical which lends itself to all sorts of calming possibilities.
The ‘What if?’ becomes good enough for them.
Why?
Because their particular ‘What if?’ offers them the possibility of something stable and concrete and sure and good and safe – hope.

Let us suppose vampires existed – epistemology included – and they fed on human blood (prove that they don’t or believe that they do) would you want to be turned into one?
Each particular unsubstantiated belief offers particular relief from reality.

This is why there are so many kinds of religion.

 

[Adstar]

This is a hypothetical question for atheists and agnostics, although I guess even a theist could contribute -

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists - meaning that they were to suddenly realise that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of their seeing and even one's own sense of self had directly emanated from god.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

The question of this thread is

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)

theist


How would you like a theist to contribute?


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[KennyJC]

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists - meaning that they were to suddenly realise that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of their seeing and even one's own sense of self had directly emanated from god.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

Well such a thing is never going to happen without fantastic evidence, but I will play along...

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Probably the same way it makes all other fundamentalists unstable.

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

I would probably hate all gays and not admit that I hate blacks or muslims, but would very much wish to enforce my lovely Catholic religion on them and their country and would probably support doing so by force.

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Of utmost importance would be that everyone would have to follow my interpretation of God's authority or the authority of whatever scripture I follow.

Phew, it's just as well I don't have a belief in God then isn't it? Having the burden of getting everyone to do what God want's would be a heavy workload.

 

[SetiAlpha6]

This is a hypothetical question for atheists and agnostics, although I guess even a theist could contribute -

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists - meaning that they were to suddenly realise that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of their seeing and even one's own sense of self had directly emanated from god.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

The question of this thread is

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)

Here is my own personal perspective on this topic.

I am sort of a Theist/Agnostic. I was raised as a Christian and I have been a Christian for almost all of my life. I have led many Bible studies in my day. But I have decided through much personal pain and anguish to reject much of Christianity. Some of it is very good (love and forgiveness) but some of it also represents the vilest evil ever known to mankind.

Right or wrong, I still do believe in God but I have rejected the “dark side” of Christianity. You know… all the parts that we are supposed to pretend are not there. The passages where you are required to kill a person for working on the Sabbath or even kill your own child if he gets angry at you and curses you even once. You are not supposed to forgive your own child according to the Law, you are supposed to just stone him to death. There are even Laws that teach you how to sell your own daughter as a sex slave. There is another Law that requires a woman to marry the very same man who just violently raped her. Strange, so far, no Christian I have ever talked to has ever denied that these things are in the Bible. Time to look away from the screen, disengage your mind, and forget about all of those ugly Laws. If you pretend that they are not there, won’t they all just go away?

The Law is described as “perfect” by David in the Psalms. According to Jesus, the Law will never pass away as long as this earth exists. And if it still, as Paul declares, condemns the entire world before God (not just the Jews) then it is still in full force today worldwide and it should be carried out and executed just as Jesus required.

So if I ever decided to add the “dark side” of Christianity into my world view I would have to take up killing and stoning my own children. I would have absolutely no morals of my own since I would be required to follow and execute the Law without question. And to ever dare to question the morality of the Law itself would not be to live in faith either. This would turn me into, at the very least, an amoral person. And for me to accept all of the Bible and the Law as “perfect” I would basically have to become a mindless amoral killer just like many people actually were in the Old Testament. How many centuries must the bloodshed go on? To save my soul, as in the Abraham and Isaac account, the Bible requires that I must be willing to kill my own child. Sorry, but that is never going to happen! If my soul is forfeit then it is forfeit. What’s one soul more or less? Jesus talks in parables to deliberately deceive people and keep them from entering His kingdom. So what does He care about one more lost soul among billions?

I guess I still believe in God but I just reject the evil things that are said or written about Him. I completely reject the Biblical mandates that would require me to become evil myself if I were to carry them out. Yes, I know. I am confused. Thanks for thinking that of me! Historically, no matter what Christian doctrine you hold there is always another “loving” Christian Brother around who will kill you for believing it. Hopefully, I didn't stray too far off the topic!

Best Wishes!

 

[Fathoms]

This is a hypothetical question for atheists and agnostics, although I guess even a theist could contribute -

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists - meaning that they were to suddenly realise that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of their seeing and even one's own sense of self had directly emanated from god.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

The question of this thread is

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)

born again atheist.

In a Godful or Godless world the objective remains the same. To live life as well and honestly as you possibly can.

 

[spidergoat]

atheist,

It depends on the nature of the God that is revealed. That is one thing theists never make clear.

 

[Satyr]

The infected mind in its full glory

Watch the hypotheticals - and I quote:

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists -

“Irrevocable Convictions”
This infected mind is still convinced that there can be convictions of this absolute type.

A conviction isn’t something to be tested and changed, as new information arises, or altered as awareness of the actual shifts and mutates, but it can find a final position, an unalterable, unflinching, set in stone, “truth”.

This is its starting epistemological dictum, upon which its ontology comfortably reclines.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

Of course not, this hypothetical is meant to support its desired hypothesis.
The epistemology is set aside, for the time being and the imagination is released from reason.

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Here we witness the desire for absoluteness manifesting itself in a need to show how ‘positive’ submitting to the hypothetical can be.

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)

Here we see an indirect affirmation of its own ignorance.

It has come to some irrefutable conclusions concerning atheists and agnostics, concerning their materialism and lack of moral fiber and is now confronted with the possibility that it could be wrong and that it should adjust its ‘argument’ to these new challenges.

‘Epistemology’ and ‘Ontology’ seemed to work, in other circles and they haven’t proven to be as successful here.
Some more research is required to accomplish two goals:
1- The façade of investigation is maintained. This, of course is a pretension because the final conclusion has been established and only the details have to be filled in.
2- This mind comes to know the opposition. This will be useful for its continuing acceptance of its belief and for its future defensive tactics against all challengers.

His; “Prove God does not exist” strategy and his attempt to equate science and honest philosophy with his brand of absolutist, prejudiced Theosophy, by using established philosophical jargon (ontology, epistemology etc.) have proven to be less than adequate

I love this guy.

 

[Michael]

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Firstly I would want to have a discussion with this fellow being and then I would give this some thought and then maybe it would, depending on the answers I received, alter some of my world views - just as any conversation with any sentient being may do.

I have a question for you:

What if you were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god does NOT exist - meaning that you were to suddenly realize, as all of us Atheist have, that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of your seeing and even your own sense of self had nothing to do with a god because their never was a God.

How it happened that you developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not at issue.

In what ways would this restructure your life?

 

[lightgigantic]

Firstly I would want to have a discussion with this fellow being and then I would give this some thought and then maybe it would, depending on the answers I received, alter some of my world views - just as any conversation with any sentient being may do.

I have a question for you:

What if you were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god does NOT exist - meaning that you were to suddenly realize, as all of us Atheist have, that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of your seeing and even your own sense of self had nothing to do with a god because their never was a God.

How it happened that you developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not at issue.

In what ways would this restructure your life?

there is already a thread that exists along those lines by Prince james - actually reading his thread inspired me to open this one - if however you feel the needs and concerns you raised are important perhaps you could pen a third one in that connection.

As far as this thread is concerned I was trying to make it clear in th e opening post that this is not so much about discussing the relevance of ideologies and who is right/wrong - I mean there are plenty threads like that already.

I was more interested in how people gauged the life aspects of a perfected theist through whatever uderstanding they are currently operating out of.

 

[Michael]

I was more interested in how people gauged the life aspects of a perfected theist through whatever uderstanding they are currently operating out of.

Well for my part, as I said, my attitude towards a Godhead and my worldview would be completely dependant on the conversation we would have together.

For example: I would ask the Godhead what it’s like not being able to learn anything new? “Surely knowing everything must suck arse?” I would suggest. Perhaps never having had the ability to “learn” has resulted in the Godhead resorting to the need of worship (under penalty of eternal hellfire) as a means of filling this void? I would tell the Godhead that, while it doesn’t have my adoration, it does have my pity. Poor thing.

I suppose depending on the response I would receive that would or would not change my world view.

 

[greenberg]

An in-effect atheist here.

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

I'd have my meaning of life. Something to wake up for in the morning and something to go to sleep while knowing I am doing the right thing. Something that would direct all my actions every moment of every day.

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

Yes, absolutely. But the content of this would depend on what God and my link to God would be like.

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

This is in relation to the above two answers.

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

Absolutely. But again, see above answers.

 

[spidergoat]

This is a hypothetical question for atheists and agnostics, although I guess even a theist could contribute -

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists - meaning that they were to suddenly realise that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of their seeing and even one's own sense of self had directly emanated from god.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

The question of this thread is

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)

I would question my sanity. Not simply because of the conviction that God exists, but because I would realize that in the absense of any evidence pointing me in that direction, my belief would be irrational.

 

[greenberg]

I would question my sanity. Not simply because of the conviction that God exists, but because I would realize that in the absense of any evidence pointing me in that direction, my belief would be irrational.

So you think it is possible to have the realization that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of your seeing and even your own sense of self had directly emanated from God,
and still wonder about matters of evidence?

 

[visceral_instinct]

I would go to my doctor and ask for psychiatric treatment.

 

[lightgigantic]

“
Originally Posted by lightgigantic
This is a hypothetical question for atheists and agnostics, although I guess even a theist could contribute -

It innvolves that one theoretically assume that they were to suddenly have an irrevocable conviction that god exists - meaning that they were to suddenly realise that the entire manifested and unmanifested substance of their seeing and even one's own sense of self had directly emanated from god.

How it happened that one developed this conviction, why it happened etc etc is not the issue of this thread.

The question of this thread is

In what ways would this restructure one's life?

Would it warrant a difference in the organisation or the valuing of ones ideals?
(this can be anything betwen choosing what country one decided to reside in to changing one's career goals)

In what ways would it change what one considered important and what one considered unimportant?

Would it affect one's notions of happines/distress in the world?

I doubt whether I will be posting much in this thread - I just want to get some idea of an atheists/agnostics perspective of the significance of values/goals/needs of a theist established in such a realisation.

Perhaps it could be helpful to declare at the beginning of your post where you stand in regard to theism (agnostic/atheist etc)
”
I would question my sanity. Not simply because of the conviction that God exists, but because I would realize that in the absense of any evidence pointing me in that direction, my belief would be irrational.

perhaps I should have put it in bold

 

[lightgigantic]

An in-effect atheist here.



I'd have my meaning of life. Something to wake up for in the morning and something to go to sleep while knowing I am doing the right thing. Something that would direct all my actions every moment of every day.




Yes, absolutely. But the content of this would depend on what God and my link to God would be like.




This is in relation to the above two answers.




Absolutely. But again, see above answers.

\
one of the reasons I originally made this post was to point out the fallibility of arguments against religious practice on the basis of social paradigms that are basically godless (in other words, modern society).

You know, arguments that basically boil down to "theism is rubbish because people take it so seriously (ie make life decisions based on it)"