All Gods are Man Made

[Starman]

All Gods are Man Made. This is a fact that is hard to except. Human beings are products of their envrionment and the Religions they follow are usually a direct result of the envrionment they were born into. Most Religions are mans first attempts of self government in order to bring order out of anarchy. Due to the facts that most Religions are early forms of government they usually have negetive impacts when people try to combine them with modern governments.

 

[-Bob-]

How edifying.

 

[SkinWalker]

Agreed. People make up gods in the same way they make up aliens and ufo nonsense. But you could've gone into more detail. For instance, do you see religion as an evolutionary process in the way that Robert Bellah does? He postulates that cultures begin with primitive and archaic religions until they hit an axial stage where modern religions develop. In all, he suggest 5 stages of religious devlopment.

Others have taken off from this and suggested "new axial" ages where modern religions develop to answer/deal with modern questions of science and discovery. These include ufo cults, scientology, and new age mumbo jumbo.

But on what data do you rely to support the contention that "most religions are mans (sic) first attempts of self government in order to bring order out of anarchy"? H. sapiens have been around a lot longer than writing, so our best inferrances to the structure of "civilization" include artifacts of agriculture and habitation as well as religion. It seems likely that religion is a result of a given population's attempts to deal with post-death existance and the concept that the natural and supernatural worlds were one (as is the case with modern examples of Bellah's "primitive" religions): therefore, when resources were taken from the world, appropriate gratitude had to be demonstrated for future availability or to not piss off the gods.

Religions existed long before governments... governments existed in ways that were ditinstinct from religion, but inclusive. We can see this in excavations of sites like Ur where temples and religious sancutaries were obvious as were palaces. The palaces included shrines, but the temples didn't include secular aspects of government that can be seen in the archaeological record.

I say religion and governments are separate and distinct, governments, however, have the common sense to include religion in order to appeal to the populace. In many circumstances, governmental leaders, such as kings, took on the personae of deities or gods, but their governance was still bounded by the religion and overstepping religious boundaries was risky and difficult. England's creation of the Church of England is an example.

I would also suggest that "anarchy" did not exist prior to government or religion.

 

[§outh§tar]

Yes very edifying.

No proof. No corroboration. Just stupid speculation. This is getting out of hand.

 

[Red Devil]

Religion is the ability to explain the unexplained in ancient times.

"Daddy, why is that man flying through the air on a flamin' chariot!"

"Shut up son, and eat your breakfast, thats a god that is!!"

 

[Always]

All Gods are Man Made... but all Laws are not!

 

[Starman]

Agreed. People make up gods in the same way they make up aliens and ufo nonsense. But you could've gone into more detail. For instance, do you see religion as an evolutionary process in the way that Robert Bellah does? He postulates that cultures begin with primitive and archaic religions until they hit an axial stage where modern religions develop. In all, he suggest 5 stages of religious devlopment.

Others have taken off from this and suggested "new axial" ages where modern religions develop to answer/deal with modern questions of science and discovery. These include ufo cults, scientology, and new age mumbo jumbo.

But on what data do you rely to support the contention that "most religions are mans (sic) first attempts of self government in order to bring order out of anarchy"? H. sapiens have been around a lot longer than writing, so our best inferrances to the structure of "civilization" include artifacts of agriculture and habitation as well as religion. It seems likely that religion is a result of a given population's attempts to deal with post-death existance and the concept that the natural and supernatural worlds were one (as is the case with modern examples of Bellah's "primitive" religions): therefore, when resources were taken from the world, appropriate gratitude had to be demonstrated for future availability or to not piss off the gods.

Religions existed long before governments... governments existed in ways that were ditinstinct from religion, but inclusive. We can see this in excavations of sites like Ur where temples and religious sancutaries were obvious as were palaces. The palaces included shrines, but the temples didn't include secular aspects of government that can be seen in the archaeological record.

I say religion and governments are separate and distinct, governments, however, have the common sense to include religion in order to appeal to the populace. In many circumstances, governmental leaders, such as kings, took on the personae of deities or gods, but their governance was still bounded by the religion and overstepping religious boundaries was risky and difficult. England's creation of the Church of England is an example.

I would also suggest that "anarchy" did not exist prior to government or religion.

Skin Walker not all aliens are made up. According to the Drake Equation alien life forms do exist, however I understand there is a lot of misinformation connected with UFO’s.

The reason I did not go into such detail was to keep it simple. Religion did exist before there was a written record in most cases Gods and supernatural beings were created by man to deal with the unknown.

Yes others have created modern day Religions and Cults. The need of Humans to have fellowship is a basic need. We all want to belong to something or be part of a whole. This gives us direction, purpose, appreciation and a feeling of worth instead of isolation. The answer has not yet been found for a modern day Religion or Social Group that will reform religious movements of today. Necessity is the mother of all inventions. We do need a new movement that is set up on Truth and Fact one that doesn’t have all the answers to all the questions, one that is constantly evolving not stagnate. A movement that will embrace all people and provide fellowship on a global scale.

Anarchy was prevalent during times of conquest until man created supernatural beings that could not be killed or concurred. The creation of Religion was to allow an ethnic group to continue even during times of conquest.

I agree with what you said about the relation of Religion and early forms of Government.

 

[SkinWalker]

Anarchy was prevalent during times of conquest until man created supernatural beings that could not be killed or concurred.

As indicated by what evidence or cited by what source?

 

[Starman]

Anarchy was prevalent during times of conquest until man created supernatural beings that could not be killed or concurred.

As indicated by what evidence or cited by what source?

I dont have any source or evidence, I am refering to the Jews historical past.
However Dr. Barbara Theoring author of "Riddle of the Dead Sea Schrools" a leading world schollar on the schrolls has brought forth evidence in the schrolls that proves that the Judea Christian Muslum Religions are Man made.

 

[SnakeLord]

Skin Walker not all aliens are made up. According to the Drake Equation alien life forms do exist

"In Green Bank, West Virginia at the new National Radio Astronomy Observatory, a young astrophysicist named Frank Drake runs a two week project called Ozma, to search for extraterrestrial signals. A signal is received, to great excitement. It turns out to be false, but the excitement remains. In 1960, Drake organizes the first SETI conference, and came up with the now-famous Drake equation:

N=N*fp ne fl fi fc fL

Where N is the number of stars in the Milky Way galaxy; fp is the fraction with planets; ne is the number of planets per star capable of supporting life; fl is the fraction of planets where life evolves; fi is the fraction where intelligent life evolves; and fc is the fraction that communicates; and fL is the fraction of the planet's life during which the communicating civilizations live.

This serious-looking equation gave SETI an serious footing as a legitimate intellectual inquiry. The problem, of course, is that none of the terms can be known, and most cannot even be estimated. The only way to work the equation is to fill in with guesses. And guesses-just so we're clear-are merely expressions of prejudice. Nor can there be "informed guesses." If you need to state how many planets with life choose to communicate, there is simply no way to make an informed guess. It's simply prejudice.

As a result, the Drake equation can have any value from "billions and billions" to zero. An expression that can mean anything means nothing."

Caltech Michelin lecture, (Michael Chrichton)

 

[Truth51]

All Gods are Man Made. This is a fact that is hard to except. Human beings are products of their envrionment and the Religions they follow are usually a direct result of the envrionment they were born into. Most Religions are mans first attempts of self government in order to bring order out of anarchy. Due to the facts that most Religions are early forms of government they usually have negetive impacts when people try to combine them with modern governments.

How do you know this, just out of curiosity? I mean, what is your source? There is a huge amount of evidence suggesting there really is a God.* Furthermore, you probably never even gave Christ a chance to reveal himself to you, so it really isn't a wonder that you believe these things.

Love of Christ

 

[SkinWalker]

There is really only circular evidence to suggest a god or any gods... usually religious texts and written mythologies that are taken for doctrine such as the judao-christian bible, the koran, etc. Hardly qualifies as a "huge amount of evidence."

But to Starman: you said "anarchy was prevalent during times of conquest until man created supernatural beings that could not be killed or concurred.

"Prevalent" suggests that the state of anarchy, a state of lawlessness or disorder, is the most common or dominant state. "Until man created supernatural beings" suggest that we're talking about a period prior to that in which "supernatural beings" or gods were a part of the man's world, which is long before written history and perhaps even into the time of Homo neanderthalis if one accepts some of explanations for evidence found at the lower levels of Shanidar.

"Times of conquest" is the period in which you are vague, however. What period is this in human history? Prior to writing? During the time when Semitic peoples split and formed Canaanites, Jews, etc.? During the time when both H. neanderthalis and H. sapiens roamed from E. Africa to Mesopotamia to the Zagros Mountains, and even up into Europe?

There is about as much evidence that man created gods to bring order as there is that gods actually exist.

There is, however, some striking evidence and study that indicates that H. sapiens are hard-wired to "believe" in deities and the supernatural and to have religious thought (Ramachandran and Blakeslee, 1998; Boyer, 2001).

Boyer, Pascal (2001). Religion Explained: the Evolutionary Origins of Religious Thought. New York. Basic Books.

V.S. Ramachandran and Sandra Blakeslee (1998) Phantoms in the Brain. New York: Morrow.

 

[Starman]

How do you know this, just out of curiosity? I mean, what is your source? There is a huge amount of evidence suggesting there really is a God.* Furthermore, you probably never even gave Christ a chance to reveal himself to you, so it really isn't a wonder that you believe these things.

Love of Christ

My wife is very Religious and I attend Church every Saturday because the Christian Church we go to is to crowded on Sunday. The preacher is one of the best I have ever herd speak.

Lets talk just a little bit about Jesus. He was a Jew and he was a normal human being a decendent of King David through his "father" Joseph. He did not belive everything about his faith to be true. He set out to make changes in order to improve the Jewish system of belief.

The bible contains alot of history and many good morals to live by. It also contains alot of supernatural stories that were created by Man and this is proven in the Dead Sea Schrolls by Dr. Barbara Theroing of Austraila. If you can face your Judea Christian Religion without having to have all the Majic and Supernatural Stories and Some Big Guy up in the sky who people have conversations with and that scares me. Then you can except that the text of the bible is a view of life as it existed in a 1st century world view and you can apreciate it for the history of the time it was written.

The simple fact is hard to except all Bibles all Gods are in fact Man Made.

 

[Starman]

There is really only circular evidence to suggest a god or any gods... usually religious texts and written mythologies that are taken for doctrine such as the judao-christian bible, the koran, etc. Hardly qualifies as a "huge amount of evidence."

But to Starman: you said "anarchy was prevalent during times of conquest until man created supernatural beings that could not be killed or concurred.

"Prevalent" suggests that the state of anarchy, a state of lawlessness or disorder, is the most common or dominant state. "Until man created supernatural beings" suggest that we're talking about a period prior to that in which "supernatural beings" or gods were a part of the man's world, which is long before written history and perhaps even into the time of Homo neanderthalis if one accepts some of explanations for evidence found at the lower levels of Shanidar.

"Times of conquest" is the period in which you are vague, however. What period is this in human history? Prior to writing? During the time when Semitic peoples split and formed Canaanites, Jews, etc.? During the time when both H. neanderthalis and H. sapiens roamed from E. Africa to Mesopotamia to the Zagros Mountains, and even up into Europe?

There is about as much evidence that man created gods to bring order as there is that gods actually exist.

There is, however, some striking evidence and study that indicates that H. sapiens are hard-wired to "believe" in deities and the supernatural and to have religious thought (Ramachandran and Blakeslee, 1998; Boyer, 2001).

Boyer, Pascal (2001). Religion Explained: the Evolutionary Origins of Religious Thought. New York. Basic Books.

V.S. Ramachandran and Sandra Blakeslee (1998) Phantoms in the Brain. New York: Morrow.

I was specifically referring to the conquest of the Jews by the Romans and that even though the Romans were Pagan they could not destroy the Jewish faith no matter how hard they tried and the Jewish Religion went on to keep the unity of Jews and it was the law they live by to this day. So is the establishment of Law not the central structure of Government? If you were not strong enough to lead by force then would it not be easier to rule using Gods that people would fear and submit to?

In my observation this was clearly one way for the intellectuals to rule over the physically dominating class of people. Who was it that said that the pen is mightier than the sword?

And to be specific I am referring to anarchy among the Jews.

Humans have herding instincts that exist in many other mammals that is why we as humans want to have a place in a group as either leaders or followers.