Absolute truth

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Carico

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I've heard atheists say that there is no absolute truth. But if there is no absolute truth then their statement can't be true. So their statement is false & absolute truth does exist. And since the truth isn't fallible, (or it wouldn't be the truth),the truth has to be infallible. And since humans are fallible, then humans can't have the truth. That means that God has to exist since absolute truth, which is infallible, exists. We call that infallible truth, God. ;)

Once that's been established, then one has to find out just who God is. That's simple; no human being on planet earth has shown infallibility but Jesus Christ. And that's why unbelievers curse Jesus and our Father in heaven. No one curses allah or krishna or anyone else but Jesus. that's because Satan knows who his enemy is...and it's not imaginary gods. So he doesn't lead anyone to curse Santa Claus, allah, zeus, or the toothfairy...only God our Father and God the Son. After all, there's no reason to get angry at a a god one thinks is imaginary;)

Nevertheless, even though it can logically be proven that God exists, God tells us in Romans 1:18-24 & 2 Corinthians 4:4 that Satan will blind the eyes of unbelievers so they won't believe Him. And that's why most of the world doesn't know who God is. :eek:
 
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I've heard someone say "there is no absolute truth", but I've heard someone else say "there is an absolute truth". So if there isn't, the second statement is wrong and so the first statement must also be wrong (if it's true).

So there is no absolutely true statement about truth.
 
StrangerInAStrangeLa said:
If Satan is allowed to blind eyes, you don't know whether you're blind.
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That's a good point. The only way we know is to read God's laws and even if we can't believe in God, we know that we break God's laws. So the first step is to understand that we are all lawbreakers which is where Satan wants us to remain. So if you deny Christ,especially since you have to make up your own history to do it, you are being blinded by Satan. ;)

The only solution is to ask God for faith because we cannot break Satan's hold on us by our own will. A neurotic mind can't change a neurotic mind because the mind thinks neurotically to begin with any more than the blind can lead the blind.
 
Vkothii said:
I've heard someone say "there is no absolute truth", but I've heard someone else say "there is an absolute truth". So if there isn't, the second statement is wrong and so the first statement must also be wrong (if it's true).

So there is no absolutely true statement about truth.
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Sorry but there has to be an absolute truth. if there isn't then there is no truth and therefore no lies, which we all know isn't true. Then there is no logic or rational thinking which means there is no irrationality either. Then you can't say anything is true, which of course includes evolution, then you can't even talk at that point. :D. Then all we can do is remain in a catatonic state for the rest of our lives. But that's the degree of irrationality that some people have to go to to deny God. :eek:
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
There has to be an absolute truth, but why does it have to be god?, I missed the connection you made with truth and god.


peace.
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:D Boy do I understand where you're coming from! I appreciate your honesty. ;)I remember before I became a Christian when I wanted the truth I actually said; "anything but God!" As Romans 6 tells us, we are all God's enemies because we instinctively rebel against authority. We don't want anyone to tell us what's true, false, right, wrong. We want to do things ourselves! And that's why hearing the bible is considered preaching. Preaching is when someone tells us something we already know but don't want to hear, such as if we break a window as a child and hear our parents lecture us. We already know we're guilty but don't want to hear it! That's our stubborn pride and that keeps us from God. But we have to recognize it for what it is or we will continue to rebel against what we know is right and good forever. And that leads nowhere except to death and eternal darkness. :eek:
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
There has to be an absolute truth, but why does it have to be god?, I missed the connection you made with truth and god.


peace.
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It has to be God because Carico was indoctrinated as child. He or she was probably raised in a strict religious household where he or she was forcefed the faith before she was old enough to know (or care) what exactly they were all talking about. When you're indoctrinated before you're old enough, as Carico obviously was, you never have a chance to decide for yourself; therefore you can't think critically about it. How is logic supposed to work when the very fabric of his or her logic consists of a belief in God?

If you were of the Christian or Catholic denomination (even barely) you probably believed in Santa Claus as a kid...now think back on it, and imagine if nobody ever told you that Santa wasn't real, and you never caught your parents bringing the presents up from the basement while you were supposed to be sleeping...I know in my case, I was crushed to learn that Santa didn't exist. And that was while I was still a kid, and never really had a chance to think critically about it.

I don't blame Carico for the way he or she is. He or she is obviously a believer, but his or her approach is just fucked. Pretending to understand science when it is obvious he or she doesn't know anything beyond docu(and mocu)mentaries on cable TV? That's gotta stop. Faith is irrational, but that doesn't make it bad; maybe if Carico learned to keep it to him or herself, then Carico wouldn't find him or herself getting battered around a forum like a crash test dummy.
 
Carico said:
:D Boy do I understand where you're coming from! I appreciate your honesty. ;)I remember before I became a Christian when I wanted the truth I actually said; "anything but God!" As Romans 6 tells us, we are all God's enemies because we instinctively rebel against authority. We don't want anyone to tell us what's true, false, right, wrong. We want to do things ourselves! And that's why hearing the bible is considered preaching. Preaching is when someone tells us something we already know but don't want to hear, such as if we break a window as a child and hear our parents lecture us. We already know we're guilty but don't want to hear it! That's our stubborn pride and that keeps us from God. But we have to recognize it for what it is or we will continue to rebel against what we know is right and good forever. And that leads nowhere except to death and eternal darkness. :eek:
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I don't like the whole threat thing either, "do this or im going to do that to you" I don't respond nicely to threats. Why would God create people knowing he is just going to throw more thhn half of them in hell anyway. Also muslims and hindu's etc would go to hell becuse they do not accept jesus for what he is?, even if they were good people.

I don't think those type of things are honourable or just of God to do to people.


peace.
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
I don't like the whole threat thing either, "do this or im going to do that to you" I don't respond nicely to threats. Why would God create people knowing he is just going to throw more thhn half of them in hell anyway. Also muslims and hindu's etc would go to hell becuse they do not accept jesus for what he is?, even if they were good people.

I don't think those type of things are honourable or just of God to do to people.


peace.
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Nobody does. It actually makes one feel like rebelling even more. That's why i love Romans 7:7, "For I would not have known what the law was if the laws had not said; "Do not covet'. But sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the law breeds in me every kind of covetous desire."

So as the rest of that passage explains, the law actually breeds sin in us because it brings out our rebellion. But unfortunately, just like combat veterans know, it's a fact that if they don't get out of their foxholes and fight, they'll be killed. :eek: So we have to finally see that we can't sit on the fence all our lives. But the wonderful thing is, God will give you the joy and faith to believe the bible so you'll really want to hear what God says. You'll be so thankful that Jesus paid in full for everything you've ever done wrong that you'll want to do anything he says. But even more unfortunately, because of our pride and rebellion, most of us have to be half-dead before we'll ask Him. :D

that's why Jesus said; "he who falls on the capstone will be broken in pieces. but he upon whom it falls will be crushed." So most of us have to be broken in pieces before we'll turn to God. that's our stubborness and pride. :eek:
 
JDawg said:
It has to be God because Carico was indoctrinated as child. He or she was probably raised in a strict religious household where he or she was forcefed the faith before she was old enough to know (or care) what exactly they were all talking about. When you're indoctrinated before you're old enough, as Carico obviously was, you never have a chance to decide for yourself; therefore you can't think critically about it. How is logic supposed to work when the very fabric of his or her logic consists of a belief in God?

If you were of the Christian or Catholic denomination (even barely) you probably believed in Santa Claus as a kid...now think back on it, and imagine if nobody ever told you that Santa wasn't real, and you never caught your parents bringing the presents up from the basement while you were supposed to be sleeping...I know in my case, I was crushed to learn that Santa didn't exist. And that was while I was still a kid, and never really had a chance to think critically about it.

I don't blame Carico for the way he or she is. He or she is obviously a believer, but his or her approach is just fucked. Pretending to understand science when it is obvious he or she doesn't know anything beyond docu(and mocu)mentaries on cable TV? That's gotta stop. Faith is irrational, but that doesn't make it bad; maybe if Carico learned to keep it to him or herself, then Carico wouldn't find him or herself getting battered around a forum like a crash test dummy.
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He said he was not a christian until later on in life, I thought he was indocrinated early on aswell, but he was not. That's why im trying to understand the exact reasons he found a basis for his strong opinions in how life works.

Everybody is a victim of life experiences, I always try to understand what the reasons behind peoples beliefs are. I am still undecided on the truth to everything, I am trying to be open about his and other peoples thoughts on it from both sides of the argument, I think I still rest in the middle somewhere maybe leaning towards the religious side slightly more because I think a god might exist stronger than I used too.


peace.
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
He said he was not a christian until later on in life, I thought he was indocrinated early on aswell, but he was not. That's why im trying to understand the exact reasons he found a basis for his strong opinions in how life works.

Everybody is a victim of life experiences, I always try to understand what the reasons behind peoples beliefs are. I am still undecided on the truth to everything, I am trying to be open about his and other peoples thoughts on it from both sides of the argument, I think I still rest in the middle somewhere maybe leaning towards the religious side slightly more because I think a god might exist stronger than I used too.


peace.
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Yup, we are all victims. But we're all accountable for tour behavior because what comes out of us comes back to us.

From my experience, most people who were raised in a Christian home are not true Christians. they just blindly adopt whatever faith their parents had and think they're Christians. And the statistics bear that out. 83% of people who go to mainline churches do not believe that Jesus is the only way to God. That's because their faith doesn't come from personal knowledge of God, but because of blind faith in their parents and pastors.

So you guys are right that many "Christians" have blind faith. That's why I much prefer the company of atheists over fake Christians because atheists are at least honest about their unbelief. And honesty from us is all God wants and he'll do the rest...provided we ask Him to. ;) So you guys have a much better chance of finding God than most people who go to church! that's because they sadly think they're already saved. :eek:
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
He said he was not a christian until later on in life, I thought he was indocrinated early on aswell, but he was not. That's why im trying to understand the exact reasons he found a basis for his strong opinions in how life works.
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I don't exactly believe him when he says he found it later in life. And part of me just doesn't want to believe it, because of what that implies about him. See, if he was indoctrinated as a child, then I can't fault him for his utter lack of understanding of anything non-biblical (and very little of what is biblical, for that matter), but if he came to religion later...well, that means his ignorance is his own, and when he had the opportunity to improve himself, he took the route of oppressive mythology. That doesn't speak well of his character.

Everybody is a victim of life experiences, I always try to understand what the reasons behind peoples beliefs are. I am still undecided on the truth to everything, I am trying to be open about his and other peoples thoughts on it from both sides of the argument, I think I still rest in the middle somewhere maybe leaning towards the religious side slightly more because I think a god might exist stronger than I used too.

peace.
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Well, I agree to a degree about being a victim of experience. You can be totally brainwashed by your parents, or you can be born into no particular denomination and study science without the haze of faith to blind you; but you can also be born without religion and find it later, whereas you can be born with it and abandon it (or even change it) later. So we're not all victims of it. I think what separates us is our ability to think critically, and (perhaps more importantly) our ability to stomach what we learn.

That isn't to say I hate religion or the religious. I don't. If you find God, then good for you. What I do hate, however, are people who refuse to learn the truth. That is why I actually praise the Catholic church for what they've done regarding the sciences, and the interpretation of the bible. Very progressive stuff, even when they're not all that progressive or controversial otherwise.
 
I don't exactly believe him when he says he found it later in life. And part of me just doesn't want to believe it, because of what that implies about him. See, if he was indoctrinated as a child, then I can't fault him for his utter lack of understanding of anything non-biblical (and very little of what is biblical, for that matter), but if he came to religion later...well, that means his ignorance is his own, and when he had the opportunity to improve himself, he took the route of oppressive mythology. That doesn't speak well of his character.
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Since I know why humans can only breed humans and apes can only breed apes, then I know more than evolutionists know. ;) So where is my ignorance since my beliefs correspond to reality? :eek:

What isn't to say I hate religion or the religious. I don't. If you find God, then good for you. What I do hate, however, are people who refuse to learn the truth. That is why I actually praise the Catholic church for what they've done regarding the sciences, and the interpretation of the bible. Very progressive stuff, even when they're not all that progressive or controversial otherwise.
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I get frustrated with people who can't see that evolution is a fairy tale because no one knows who the common ancestor is nor has anyone in history passed along accounts of our apes ancestors. So it's made up.

The Catholics don't agree with anything in the bible including:

1) the account of creation
2) All the ten commandments which is why they took the libery of playing God and omitting the commandment telling them not to carve statues of people
3) MT. 1:25 saying that Mary wasn't a virgin her whole life

4) Deuteronomy 11:18 telling us not to contact the dead

5) Colossians 2:8 telling us not to follow the traditions of me

6) Matthew 23:9, :"And do not call anyone on earth 'father for you have one father and he is in heaven."

And on and on and on. So I can see why you agree with them because they're unbelievers disguised as sheep. :eek:

I gotta get going because I have things to do. Be back later.
 
WHAT 10 COMMANDMENTS???????????
Who follows the traditions of you???
I get frustrated with people who can't see The Holy Babble is fairy tales. Nasty cruel 1s.
I get frustrated with people who can't see or admit that if some science theories are wrong, it says nothing of whether there are gods.
There are things in The Holy Babble you don't believe.
 
StrangerInAStrangeLa said:
It took THIS long for you to give a half answer yet you call me ignorant.
Which verse(s)?
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Well considering that more than half the posts on several threads are directed at me, then I can't answer all of them. I usually answer that last post. if that isn't good enough for you, then there's nothing I can do about that since I have a life outside of this forum. :eek:
 
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